Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (Full Version)

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Owner59 -> Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 2:34:42 PM)

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/05/24/who-is-the-smallest-government-spender-since-eisenhower-would-you-believe-its-barack-obama/


"It’s enough to make even the most ardent Obama cynic scratch his head in confusion.

Amidst all the cries of Barack Obama being the most prolific big government spender the nation has ever suffered, Marketwatch is reporting that our president has actually been tighter with a buck than any United States president since Dwight D. Eisenhower.

Who knew?"



Certainly NOT fox noose viewers.....[:D]



subrob1967 -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 3:08:12 PM)

President Obama: The Biggest Government Spender In World History

That's one hell of a flip flop in one month, wouldn't ya say? Forbes needs to make up it's mind.[8|]

I'd say the only people who are confused here are the magazine, and the people who believe Ungar's op ed.




DaNewAgeViking -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 3:16:33 PM)

Gee... Those pesky facts can be a real nuisance, can't they?
[sm=dunno.gif]



DarkSteven -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 3:20:51 PM)

One big difference is that the Ungar article states that Obama's first fiscal budget was 2010, and the Ferrara article claims that Obama was responsible for the 2009 fiscal budget, lamely explaining that even though he wasn't President at the time, he had voted on it.

The thing that neither article mentions is that Bush kept the Iraq and Afghan wars off the books, and Obama put them on. That's one way to correct a lie but at the same time it could be misconstrued as an increase in spending rather than acknowledgement of reality.



Yachtie -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 3:28:04 PM)

Forbes v Forbes. Would the real Forbes please stand up?[8|]

The two authors are

Rick Ungar, Contributor

I cover the public health care policy beat. - 1st link

and

Peter Ferrara, Contributor

I cover public policy, particularly concerning economics. - 2nd link


Into the Octagon with them.



kalikshama -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 5:08:40 PM)

[image]http://blogs-images.forbes.com/rickungar/files/2012/05/MW-AR658_spendi_20120521163312_ME.jpg[/image]



erieangel -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/12/2012 9:12:08 PM)

That graph can't possibly be true. After all, every true, red blooded American knows Reagan was a fiscal conservative who cut taxes again and again.

(snark off)



tweakabelle -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 12:20:00 AM)

The bigger the lie, the more it is repeated by the looney Right.

The graph in post 5 shows the "tax and spend" Presidents are Reagan and Bush II. Both of them increased spending at almost 4 times the rate of the current Administration. A big lie bites the dust.

This revelation follows hot on the heels of another big looney Right lie being exposed as the looney Right Israeli Govt finally admitted that looney Right Iran President Ahmedinajact did NOT call for the extermination of Israel. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/palestinians-deliver-ultimatum-to-israel-in-bid-to-revive-peace-talks-7654793.html

Of course, the scale of these lies pale in comparison to the infamous "Iraq has WMDs" lie by Bush II, which was the excuse for the invasion of Iraq.

The moral of the story: Never believe the looney Right unless there has been comprehensive independent verification of their claims.




joether -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 2:12:59 AM)

Just one more nail into that coffin that contains the 'Fiscal Conservative Philosophy'. What a sham! Who would be dumb enough to believe those lies? Ranks up there with the tooth fairy and the Easter bunny.....



Moonhead -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 4:20:58 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

The bigger the lie, the more it is repeated by the looney Right.

The graph in post 5 shows the "tax and spend" Presidents are Reagan and Bush II. Both of them increased spending at almost 4 times the rate of the current Administration. A big lie bites the dust.

This revelation follows hot on the heels of another big looney Right lie being exposed as the looney Right Israeli Govt finally admitted that looney Right Iran President Ahmedinajact did NOT call for the extermination of Israel. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/palestinians-deliver-ultimatum-to-israel-in-bid-to-revive-peace-talks-7654793.html

Of course, the scale of these lies pale in comparison to the infamous "Iraq has WMDs" lie by Bush II, which was the excuse for the invasion of Iraq.

The moral of the story: Never believe the looney Right unless there has been comprehensive independent verification of their claims.



"Borrow and spend" not "tax and spend", Tweak.
That's an important distinction for the neocon massive. Raising taxes to try and fund your extravagant budget is evil, anti American progressive nonsense that has no place in politics.



subrob1967 -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 7:20:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

One big difference is that the Ungar article states that Obama's first fiscal budget was 2010, and the Ferrara article claims that Obama was responsible for the 2009 fiscal budget, lamely explaining that even though he wasn't President at the time, he had voted on it.

The thing that neither article mentions is that Bush kept the Iraq and Afghan wars off the books, and Obama put them on. That's one way to correct a lie but at the same time it could be misconstrued as an increase in spending rather than acknowledgement of reality.


Good argument... Except Ungar is using Rex Nutting numbers, and fails to take into account Obama's April 2009 budget increase of 3.8 TRILLION.

Also in April of 2009

How about FactCheck? Will you take their word?


Damn those pesky facts!



mnottertail -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 7:32:15 AM)

there was no budget increase of 3.8 trill, that was the entire budget.

epic fail from a well known innumerate.



Musicmystery -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 7:48:39 AM)

You can't even tell when you're quoting and when you're inventing new words.

How can you be trusted to understand reading???



Fellow -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 4:48:38 PM)

Hard to make anything from the graph as it does not say what the numbers represent. Is it the percent of the previous year of total government spending? In my view, Obama economic policy is a disaster. Look at any number what matters: budget deficit, unemployment, raise of poverty, lost generation of young people not having jobs, financial sector is a bunch of kleptocrats above the law, to name a few. America is rotting from the inside in general. Obama had historical opportunity to make a change, he failed. Why should the government budget increase when it is unable to raise revenue? Explain the story.



Yachtie -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 5:37:41 PM)

Obama did inherit an abysmal situation from Bush. Not that Bush was the originator, but he sure did his part. Obama has not done what is necessary to counter the economic problems, beginning with the fact that many of Goldman-Sachs and JPM sort should be in jail now. Why aren't they? It is Mr. Obama's Justice Department. Can't hang that one on Bush. The value of the Dollar has steadily decreased and Obama has done nothing to counter the erosion; that erosion being a stealth tax on everyone as it reduces everyone's purchasing power in favor of government spending. Obama deserves no kudos as of yet.

As to Obama's spending, here is a chart of gov't spending as a % of GDP (1791 to present)

[image]http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/outlays-GDP.png[/image]

US GDP growth rate may be seen here.

Obama still deserves no kudos.

Now I don't really have any desire to equate Bush's two terms with as fully not yet Obama's only one. Bush had Iraq and both he and Obama share Afghanistan. If Obama wins a 2nd term he may yet get Iran, Syria, etc.




mnottertail -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 5:44:21 PM)

He'll get them on the cheap if he does.



Fellow -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 6:12:07 PM)

Is spending as a % of GDP a good indicator? At first, the government spending is a component of GDP itself and secondly, the the way US GDP is calculated (essentially total spending, private and public) makes it a bad indicator for most economic decisions.  The Chinese perhaps may have better use for the US GDP number to evaluate their economy. 



mnottertail -> RE: Who Is The Smallest Government Spender Since Eisenhower? It's Barack Obama? (7/13/2012 6:38:34 PM)

since it is their money creating it.  ours is borrowed and we are spending it and not on domestic products.




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