RE: Why ObamaCare might work (Full Version)

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Musicmystery -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/16/2012 1:25:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Several provisions have been in place for a while now. Hardly premature.


I have to confess that I do not regard what you just wrote as especially persuasive. A vague something about provisions that have been in place for awhile now. It is like saying the ground work for the revolution is in place.

Sigh.

I falsely assumed someone posting opinions about something would have some clue about the topic. Silly me.

Google is your friend. Several aspects of ACA went into place immediately, others along the way, the final parts in 2014. Preexisting conditions, keeping kids on your insurance through age 26, and so forth.

Whether you're fucking persuaded isn't the fucking point. It's not an opinion--it's history.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/16/2012 3:38:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Several provisions have been in place for a while now. Hardly premature.


I have to confess that I do not regard what you just wrote as especially persuasive. A vague something about provisions that have been in place for awhile now. It is like saying the ground work for the revolution is in place.

Sigh.

I falsely assumed someone posting opinions about something would have some clue about the topic. Silly me.

Google is your friend. Several aspects of ACA went into place immediately, others along the way, the final parts in 2014. Preexisting conditions, keeping kids on your insurance through age 26, and so forth.

Whether you're fucking persuaded isn't the fucking point. It's not an opinion--it's history.


Persuasion is always the point. Shouldn't you have used an exclamation point instead of a period?

There were some legal changes. What would the economist Milton Friedman say? He was renown for his debate skills. My conclusion stands, what you are saying seems premature.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/16/2012 4:35:39 PM)

Another problem I have with the Supreme Court tax-penalty conversion is that it suggests that taxes aren't taxing.



erieangel -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/16/2012 8:21:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

Another problem I have with the Supreme Court tax-penalty conversion is that it suggests that taxes aren't taxing.



No it doesn't.

You have to remember the content here and forget what the pundits are saying.

The SC didn't actually say that the penalty is a tax (despite the pundits). What the SC said is that the penalty is permitted under the taxing authority of Congress.




Musicmystery -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/16/2012 9:54:21 PM)

quote:

what you are saying seems premature.


What I am saying is already past tense, and has been since April 2011, whatever fantasy world you choose to inhabit. The provisions in place are already matters of history. That you prefer ignorance leaves reality standing.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 6:41:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

Another problem I have with the Supreme Court tax-penalty conversion is that it suggests that taxes aren't taxing.


No it doesn't.

You have to remember the content here and forget what the pundits are saying.

The SC didn't actually say that the penalty is a tax (despite the pundits). What the SC said is that the penalty is permitted under the taxing authority of Congress.


It can be taxing to explain oneself. How is this distinction you are drawing significant?



Musicmystery -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 6:43:07 AM)

She is saying you need to read the Supreme Court decision before you decide what you think about it based on what you fantasize it says.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 8:29:23 AM)

Isn't it odd that thus far I am the only person in this thread who has advanced an explaination concerning why ObamaCare might work and I'm the one under attack by its proponents. There is silliness at work here.



Musicmystery -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 8:30:11 AM)

No, you're the only person clearly clueless about what you're talking about, both the ACA and the SC decision.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 8:50:25 AM)

I'm waiting on erieangel response and I am looking forward to it eagerly, but in general I suspect there are a great many people hiding behind artificial distinctions. This is something I pointed out in my threads on the topic. Government is replete with artificial distinctions. We need to call a spade, a spade. I feel that ObamaCare could have been sold as a tax.



mnottertail -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 8:55:37 AM)

It could have been sold as a hamburger, but there is no such thing as Obamacare.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 9:39:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

It could have been sold as a hamburger, ...


served with Freedom Fries.



mnottertail -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 9:42:17 AM)

or a dollop of dumbass



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 10:11:56 AM)

The trouble with this argument, a quote from Milton Friedman should help.

For some background information concerning who Milton Friedman was go to
http://www.edchoice.org/The-Friedmans/Remembering-Milton.aspx

quote:


Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself.

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/m/milton_friedman.html


Though likely true, the statement is also flawed when taken to an extreme. The economics of Ronald Regan and Margaret Thatcher became a religion. It isn't magic, but we began to think of it as magic. I recall the science fiction author Isaac Asimov writing about this in the Foundation Trilogy. The brilliance of Ronald Regan and Margaret Thatcher was to go for it because its time came. There was too much regulation, but those who came after these giants were lesser people. All was politics, politics abhors reason, and so things went to extremes. We really didn't understand what we were doing.



mnottertail -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 10:14:44 AM)

Milton Friedman is a graduate of ninth grade and self-taught in economics, and since he was St Wrinklemeats bete noir, I think we can dispense with his wisdom.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 10:38:37 AM)

The insurance companies understood the word penalty. The insurance companies knew they could get into trouble if the truth came out. Their extremist policies could be called into question. What they sought was a tax.



ClassIsInSession -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 10:45:05 AM)

Who didn't finish school and later became significant in history?

Peter Jennings
Richard Branson
Robert Maxwell
The Wright Brothers
Thomas Edison
Kirk Kerkorian
Einstein didn't finish high school- I suppose we should ignore his contribution to physics.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 11:13:15 AM)

I think you are being evil mnottertail. Bad mnottertail.



Moonhead -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 11:19:05 AM)

I doubt that he'll let it bother him any.



BenevolentM -> RE: Why ObamaCare might work (7/17/2012 11:23:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ClassIsInSession

Einstein didn't finish high school- I suppose we should ignore his contribution to physics.


I feel you are making a good point. It is my understanding that the Nazis in Nazis Germany regarded the work of Albert Einstein as Jewish physics and because it was Jewish it was summarily dismissed; hence, Germany failed to build the bomb.

The moral of the lesson here is, it doesn't matter if it is Jewish physics or Jewish economics. Truth is truth.

quote:


Friedman was born in Brooklyn, New York, to recent Jewish immigrants Jeno Friedman and Sára Landau from Beregszász in Austria-Hungary (now Berehove in Ukraine), both of whom worked as dry goods merchants.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milton_Friedman



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