Global warming by the numbers (Full Version)

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angelikaJ -> Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 7:09:03 AM)

"If the pictures of those towering wildfires in Colorado haven't convinced you, or the size of your AC bill this summer, here are some hard numbers about climate change: June broke or tied 3,215 high-temperature records across the United States. That followed the warmest May on record for the Northern Hemisphere – the 327th consecutive month in which the temperature of the entire globe exceeded the 20th-century average, the odds of which occurring by simple chance were 3.7 x 10-99, a number considerably larger than the number of stars in the universe.

... The accord did contain one important number, however. In Paragraph 1, it formally recognized "the scientific view that the increase in global temperature should be below two degrees Celsius." And in the very next paragraph, it declared that "we agree that deep cuts in global emissions are required... so as to hold the increase in global temperature below two degrees Celsius." By insisting on two degrees – about 3.6 degrees Fahrenheit – the accord ratified positions taken earlier in 2009 by the G8, and the so-called Major Economies Forum.

...Some context: So far, we've raised the average temperature of the planet just under 0.8 degrees Celsius, and that has caused far more damage than most scientists expected. (A third of summer sea ice in the Arctic is gone, the oceans are 30 percent more acidic, and since warm air holds more water vapor than cold, the atmosphere over the oceans is a shocking five percent wetter, loading the dice for devastating floods.) Given those impacts, in fact, many scientists have come to think that two degrees is far too lenient a target. "Any number much above one degree involves a gamble," writes Kerry Emanuel of MIT, a leading authority on hurricanes, "and the odds become less and less favorable as the temperature goes up." Thomas Lovejoy, once the World Bank's chief biodiversity adviser, puts it like this: "If we're seeing what we're seeing today at 0.8 degrees Celsius, two degrees is simply too much." NASA scientist James Hansen, the planet's most prominent climatologist, is even blunter: "The target that has been talked about in international negotiations for two degrees of warming is actually a prescription for long-term disaster." At the Copenhagen summit, a spokesman for small island nations warned that many would not survive a two-degree rise: "Some countries will flat-out disappear." When delegates from developing nations were warned that two degrees would represent a "suicide pact" for drought-stricken Africa, many of them started chanting, "One degree, one Africa." ..."

Read more: http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/global-warmings-terrifying-new-math-20120719#ixzz23uHI6Wrl




jlf1961 -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 9:29:39 AM)

The only scientists that are saying there is nothing to climate change are being paid by the oil companies, the Koch brothers and big business, and a few of them took the money and then turned around and supported climate change.




Real0ne -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 10:06:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

The only scientists that are saying there is nothing to climate change are being paid by the oil companies, the Koch brothers and big business, and a few of them took the money and then turned around and supported climate change.


NOT


[image]http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/nine_one_one/911/global%20warming/carbon_dioxide.jpg[/image]


and the ones who actually LOOKED at AL WHORES chart
and can see:

1) its cyclical through history
2) the temp is going down
3) global is bigger than your back yard




[image]http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/nine_one_one/stuff/alarmclock.gif[/image]

troughers are at it again










mnottertail -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 10:14:30 AM)

2. temp is not going down.   inumerate, cannot read and cannot comprehend seems to be about par.




servantforuse -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 12:01:52 PM)

I actually got to swim in my pool for more than two months this summer. It's been 3 months and still counting.




Yachtie -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 12:12:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

"If the pictures of those towering wildfires in Colorado haven't convinced you, or the size of your AC bill this summer, here are some hard numbers about climate change: June broke or tied 3,215 high-temperature records across the United States. That followed the warmest May on record for the Northern Hemisphere – the 327th consecutive month in which the temperature of the entire globe exceeded the 20th-century average, the odds of which occurring by simple chance were 3.7 x 10-99, a number considerably larger than the number of stars in the universe.



That's fine. I note you highlighted the odds without acknowledging the time frame (I highlighted it for you). Now, if I'm not mistaken, there was quite a bit of history before the 20th century.

Of course, I could be mistaken[8|]




Sanity -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 12:43:32 PM)


Weather is officially climate now? [:D]




Fellow -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 4:01:21 PM)

I do like vegetation better than desert. The plants are actually CO2-limited, I would like it to go up another 20%. I recently spotted an article that shows (based on tree-rings, that is very reliable method) the climate was warmer during Roman Empire times: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2171973/Tree-ring-study-proves-climate-WARMER-Roman-Medieval-times-modern-industrial-age.html




Rule -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 4:58:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ
"in the very next paragraph, it declared that "we agree that deep cuts in global emissions are required... so as to hold the increase in global temperature below two degrees Celsius."

That is a lie. Nothing a couple of billion apes can do, will influence the climate.

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ
So far, we've raised the average temperature of the planet just under 0.8 degrees Celsius,

That is a blatant lie: we have not raised the average temperature.

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ
At the Copenhagen summit, a spokesman for small island nations warned that many would not survive a two-degree rise: "Some countries will flat-out disappear."

Aw, who cares? They spend most of their time in boats anyway, fishing.

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ
When delegates from developing nations were warned that two degrees would represent a "suicide pact" for drought-stricken Africa, many of them started chanting, "One degree, one Africa." ..."

Another lie. If the oceans produce five percent more rain, Africa will become five percent wetter, not drier.

Anyway, the drought in the Sahel region is caused by the air pollution (from vehicles and factories and homes) produced in Europe.




DaNewAgeViking -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 5:04:27 PM)

Rule, you are sad. At least pretend to comprehend the issues.
[sm=bury.gif]




Rule -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 5:09:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow
I recently spotted an article that shows (based on tree-rings, that is very reliable method) the climate was warmer during Roman Empire times:

That is to be expected: all them marching legions must have produced an enormous amount of CO2. [sm=rofl.gif]




Rule -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 5:13:42 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaNewAgeViking
Rule, you are sad.

No, I am not: I am of excellent cheer at the moment. I have visited relatives this afternoon, celebrating the birthday of one of them, and I have had a barbecue with friends this evening, and we watched the movie Sherlock Holmes 2. We had tropical heat today, but at the moment it is a cool night. So I may be dense, but I am not sad.




Tumblweed -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 8:10:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961



NOT


[image]http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o296/nine_one_one/911/global%20warming/carbon_dioxide.jpg[/image]





Hang on here. I know how to read a graph, in fact DAMMIT I can make a graph ! I can even do reactance and resonance unlike those savages still stuck in Ohm's law.

Now I just spent three years in the fifth grade again and I can tell there is a green line on the right side of that graph. Yup I done learnt me colors.

Numbers too. First of all I refute all the numbers. At least tell us how they were derived. Dinosaur eggs or something ? And then make sure this carbon dating or whatever is working right. After that, let's discuss how the fuck that green line on the right got so high so fast.

First of all look at the scale. It starts at like 150, not at zero. So something that looks twice as high might only be ten percent or something. It's not, it IS alot higher. Call it double, close enough.

Now we have to fucking figure out a thousand more things. Have a seat.

They say that venus should set an example, because of it's CO2 atmosphere it is so hot. Shit Sherlock, did anyone figure out that it is only a little over two thirds of the distance from the sun than Earth and because of the inverse square law it recieves about double the energy from the sun ? Has anyone even applied the inverse square law when considering the Milankovitch cycle ?

And they are fucking wrong about Venus. First of all most of the data came from Russia, but that is not the reason I question it. They (wiki) say that venus has an atmosphere 92 times that of the pressure of the Earth. Physical laws make this impossible if the planet's mass is not comensurately higher, to have the gravity to pull down that atmosphere.

If this is physically possible it would be a very strange set of circumstances. Ask ya this, why doesn't the moon have air ? Not enough gravity. Now don't you think that a planet with a 92 fold more dense atmosphere would have to have a little bit more gravity, mass that is, than what we live in ? It has less.

There is someting wrong here becasue the two reported facts are irreconcilable. Period. I really doubt they are lying because itr's unlikely they have a reason. What bothers me is that with spending all that fucking money, they can't even see the error. As such of course we will have to think that only silicon based life forms could live there.

Actually I read a VERY interesting entry in a 33 year old encyclopedia. They may have been spelled encyclopeadia back then, not sure right now. It gave detail on just how silicon based life would work, and explained IN DETAIL why it was so unikely.

But they didn't say impossible. If anyone wants to read it I guess I would have to scan it. Ask, I will if someone is interested in it but if not IO won't bother. I barely have time to come here.

Weed








Rule -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/18/2012 8:59:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tumblweed
And they are fucking wrong about Venus.

I agree.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tumblweed
First of all most of the data came from Russia, but that is not the reason I question it. They (wiki) say that venus has an atmosphere 92 times that of the pressure of the Earth. Physical laws make this impossible if the planet's mass is not comensurately higher, to have the gravity to pull down that atmosphere.

It has to do with the escape velocity of the air molecules. Lighter molecules have a lower escape velocity than heavier molecules. Escape velocity also is a function of the energy that is available. The principles are all well known and neat calculations concur with the observations.




Fellow -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/19/2012 2:11:14 AM)

quote:

That is to be expected: all them marching legions must have produced an enormous amount of CO2.


Farting of the men on bad diet was the real problem, not CO2.




DesideriScuri -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/19/2012 9:21:00 PM)

FR,

Has anyone noticed that the US is not the #1 emitter of carbon dioxide (we are #2)? That the Kyoto Protocol would have left "emerging" economies out of the cuts (which, includes the #1 emitter of CO2)? That our CO2 emissions have gone down to near 1990 levels, yet CO2 in the air is still rising (who could that be?)?

July was brutally hot in NW Ohio. June wasn't exactly pleasant, either. But, thus far, August has been gorgeous. The 10-day forecast high is 86. In an area where 90's (along with 90%+ humidity) is typical in August, the current weather sure doesn't seem all that warm.




papassion -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/20/2012 11:02:39 AM)


One poster said his swimmming season is a good bit longer, People on other threads say they are wearing lighter jackets earlier in the spring, flowers blooming weeks earlier, ect, etc. All this because the average temp went up 1 degree? It is getting warmer, but it is cyclical. Has been happening for millions of years. (yawn)




Rule -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/20/2012 11:22:26 AM)

Climate change is of all ages. The dinosaurs already complained about the Earth warming up and muttered that something ought to be done about it. And look how that clamor ended: they got exterminated.

Hence, I think it is best to not complain too much about the climate, as there are plenty more of comets up there.




jlf1961 -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/20/2012 11:32:56 AM)

Yes the earth has gone through warming and cooling periods over the entire history of the planet.

NO ONE IS DENYING THAT.

What is not normal is the increase of CO2 in the atmosphere which has caused a faster than normal heating cycle. Ice core studies have proven that this huge increase in so short a time is unprecedented in the planet's history, with a couple of exceptions, both volcanic in nature and both lasting thousands of years.

Since there has been no eruptions that can explain the dramatic increase of CO2, then you want to explain what has caused it? Personally I would venture that the massive deforestation of the rain forest and increasing use of fossil fuels have a lot to do with it.




Rule -> RE: Global warming by the numbers (8/20/2012 11:40:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
What is not normal is the increase of CO2 in the atmosphere which has caused a faster than normal heating cycle.

CO2 doesn't have anything to do with it.




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