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AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 6:01:08 AM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-ama11.html

I wasnt too happy when Propel water was taxed here. I know it is pennies....but....

Thoughts on this?
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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 7:07:30 AM   
ShiftedJewel


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Status: offline 		I have a better idea... how about they target parents of obese little ones? Most learn their eating habits at a very young age and as far as I am concerned those that allow their children to become obese (and yes, I understand there are medical causes out there too, that's not what I am talking about here) are commiting child abuse. Just look at what the kids go through around other kids, particularly at school. They are harrassed, made fun of and left out of so much. Not to mention the health problems they suffer later on. I know that most would say that we should teach the rest of the little ones more tolerance... bull shit.. we should teach our kids healthier eating habits.
 
Sorry to rant and preach here... you just happen to hit on one of my passions.
 
Jewel

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 7:41:28 AM   
NakedOnMyChain


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Status: offline 		As long as the money goes to a good cause, and not the government's private coffers, I can deal with it, but I'm not thrilled.  I'm not a big fan of taxing things for the hell of it, and I think this is pushing that boundary.  People are still going to buy just as much pop regardless of the extra tax.  It won't stop them.  The money going to a good cause, such as exercise programs, etc. is really the only upside.  It would be nice to be able to help that cause.  It would also be nice if it were optional.

It sounds as though the problem that the Senate has with the proposed tax is that the money won't be going into their bankroll.  They're only opposition to an extra tax is that the money will be allocated somewhere besides their pockets.  What a sad statement.

By the by, they've just removed all the soda machines in schools here in Indiana.  I'm not sure about what other states are doing.  Is this going to help at all?  HAHAHAHA!  No.  The vending machines still sell sugary juice (which is only marginally better), candy bars, and chips.  The lack of pop won't stop anyone.  Also, if it's OK with some of those kids' parents, the parents will let them take pop with them to school anyway.  Kind of defeats the purpose, doesn't it?  

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 7:45:03 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		If this is a national sales tax, I am against it.

One way or another we pay...

Obesity is epedemic. Technically more of us are obese then....

The parents have some imput.... but culturally- the parents can only do so much.

I am going to be an uncle. I am so very excited. My sister asked if I would make the babyfood. I said hell yeah! [helppppppppppp]

I dont want my nephew sugared up.

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 7:46:18 AM   
NakedOnMyChain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ShiftedJewel

 Just look at what the kids go through around other kids, particularly at school. They are harrassed, made fun of and left out of so much. Not to mention the health problems they suffer later on. I know that most would say that we should teach the rest of the little ones more tolerance... bull shit.. we should teach our kids healthier eating habits.


True.  And we should also teach the kids more tolerance.  After all, even when you rule out the ones that are obese from lifestyle and eating habits, you still have the ones with medical conditions that are made fun of just as much as the ones that are simply fat.  Kids don't discriminate between choice and a health problem when they're made fun of.

I agree that children need to be taught to eat healthily and exercise properly.  They need to be taught to live an active, healthy lifestyle instead of sitting in front of their Playstation 2 all day eating Cheetos and doughnuts.  They also need to be taught to be kind and understanding in regard to their peers.  There is no excuse for taunting and teasing a child just because he is different.

_____________________________

"Oh, it's torture, but I'm almost there."
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"I ask for so little. Just fear me, love me, do as I say, and I will be your slave."
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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 7:49:20 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Many states have stoped PE classes, or dont have PE every day. I dreaded PE- as a kid. But Im glad it happened.

I am not against sugar per se, just think it should be in moderation.
If sugar just came out today, it would be a controlled substance.

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 8:08:27 AM   
NakedOnMyChain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Many states have stoped PE classes, or dont have PE every day. I dreaded PE- as a kid. But Im glad it happened.

I am not against sugar per se, just think it should be in moderation.
If sugar just came out today, it would be a controlled substance.


How I hate PE.  I wasn't very popular the first couple years of highschool, and PE made my life hell.  Imagine the only goth girl at a Catholic school... ouch.  (Oddly, when I switched schools my Junior year, I did a 180, went blonde, and somehow became popular without a drastic personality change... hmph).

As for sugar, not all of it's bad.  Brown sugar, honey, and pure cane sugar all have nutrients your body needs in moderation.  Unfortunately, most everything contains the refined sugar instead of its whole form.  Either way, plain sugar's still better for you than fake sweetener.  Ick.  That stuff even tastes like butt.

_____________________________

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~The Cure

"I ask for so little. Just fear me, love me, do as I say, and I will be your slave."
~The Labyrinth

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 8:28:13 AM   
cuddleheart50


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Status: offline 		Well, there goes my morning pop!

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 8:38:46 AM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		Im still recovering from a catholic school too. lol.

I was not popular in gym at all. they would throw the ball to me just because no one was guarding me in say soccer. lol

..hey get this..and im talk a few yrs now. but twin brothers passed themself off as 1 person in gym. they alternated attending. was a good many months before they were busted. lmao

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 8:50:16 AM   
marieToo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ShiftedJewel

I have a better idea... how about they target parents of obese little ones? Most learn their eating habits at a very young age and as far as I am concerned those that allow their children to become obese (and yes, I understand there are medical causes out there too, that's not what I am talking about here) are commiting child abuse. Just look at what the kids go through around other kids, particularly at school. They are harrassed, made fun of and left out of so much. Not to mention the health problems they suffer later on. I know that most would say that we should teach the rest of the little ones more tolerance... bull shit.. we should teach our kids healthier eating habits.
 
Sorry to rant and preach here... you just happen to hit on one of my passions.
 
Jewel


Teaching our kids healthy eating habits is very important...And we should also teach our kids to mind their own business and not ridicule other people, then we should teach them to not behave like victims.  Those are the kids who get picked on.  The ones who look insecure and shy.  All shapes and sizes get mocked in the school systems....Kids that are geeks, kids that have bucked teeth, kids who are fat, skinny, dorky, smart, dumb etc etc.  Kids will always find reasons to make fun of others.  Very sad, but true. 

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 8:51:55 AM   
MistressLorelei


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Status: offline 		ShiftedJewel:
quote:


I have a better idea... how about they target parents of obese little ones? Most learn their eating habits at a very young age and as far as I am concerned those that allow their children to become obese (and yes, I understand there are medical causes out there too, that's not what I am talking about here) are commiting child abuse. Just look at what the kids go through around other kids, particularly at school. They are harrassed, made fun of and left out of so much. Not to mention the health problems they suffer later on. I know that most would say that we should teach the rest of the little ones more tolerance... bull shit.. we should teach our kids healthier eating habits.
 
Sorry to rant and preach here... you just happen to hit on one of my passions.
 
Jewel


I don't think it's a fair tax.  Targeting soda seems wrong, as there are lots of bad for you sugary products on the market that contribute to obesity.  Are they going to target twinkies, cream filled donuts, cookies,  candy bars?  Some of these are not only loaded with sugar, but lots of fat grams too.... perhaps they should double tax those products.  Let's tax video games and TV's too, cause those kids should be out running around.  Don't forget to tax juice... almost as much sugar as soda, and parents think it's okay to feed it to their kids all day long.  Tax apple juice and buy your kids an apple instead? 

Tobacco products are one thing... all of them that are inhaled through your lungs are taxed..  Not all sugar products are being taxed, not all drinks are being taxed... it's not fair.   I  think it's wrong to single out one product out of many similar products.

As far as taxing parents of obese kids....  How about instead they tax all the parents of children who don't teach their kids empathy, tolerance and kindness.  Kids learn their morals and values from their parents.  Not all kids are cruel... and they aren't born that way.  It's a learned behavior.  Societies of yesteryear would have thought the weight of someone considered overweight today to be perfection, and the teasers of today would have been the outcasts of yesterday.  Teach kids EMPATHY and teach them why and how it's important to eat healthy and live a healthy lifestyle... mind, body, and soul. 

< Message edited by MistressLorelei -- 6/11/2006 9:51:12 AM >

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 8:56:04 AM   
BBBTBW


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ShiftedJewel

I know that most would say that we should teach the rest of the little ones more tolerance... bull shit.. we should teach our kids healthier eating habits.



Tolerance is a MUST issue, not a should issue although we cannot force people to teach their kids tolerance.  If we allow them to tease fat kids, how do we stop  them from teasing people with disabilities etc........

and YES we Must teach kids healthier eating habits.  There are MANY recipes on the internet that offer healthy snacks and meals.  Go to www.About.com and type in low sugar desserts or low fat snacks and you will get a list of available recipes.  I work in a group home with Adults with Developmental Disabilities. 6 people and 5 have Down's Syndrome, so we definitely have to watch the sugar and fat intake.  The other day we had a sugar free chocolate fondue...Ok we had to tweak the recipe a bit to get it right...but with cut up fruit an occasional angel food cake or it can be used as a topping  for sugar free ice cream or a dip for sugar free cookies...All kinds of things....we have to get creative with ourselves and our children so we can be a healthier nation.

As far as exercise.  Encourage your teens to go to the mall and walk around without eating or take some cut up fruit with them.  Take your kids to the park and let them play on the jungle gym or find something else that is Kid friendly that they like to do that will help them burn calories.  Playing video games in an arcade burns calories....CREATIVITY is the key.

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 9:11:41 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Interesting comments about tolerance. I was one of the kids picked on..tho not the worst.
In Americorps we did a project for all 6 graders in my county on this.

And true- if can be the wrong fashion, bucked teeth...etc.

As for artificial sweeteners...I think there is risk in high amounts of those too.

One way or another we wil be taxed.... so that is ...almost a mute point.

Soda in PA is taxed at 6% state sales tax. [food and clothing has no sales tax](7% Pitt/Philly)

Propel water is taxed....

[prepared foods are taxed here as well]

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 9:13:51 AM   
pahunkboy


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Status: offline 		I worked in group homes as well. Often staff would "bribe" a resident with food. After a while- if each shift does this- the weight packs on. Then if an outburst happens...look out.

yikes.

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 9:41:17 AM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		Naked;

I must disagree with you on the "pure cane sugar". It only contain carbon hydrogen and oxygen, (hmmm, isn't that the same things as in pure cocaine ?) Molasses and brown sugar contain chromium and vanadium, minerals your body needs to produce the insulin and properly process the sugar. White sugar does not.

Any tax on something bad for you is not to get people healthy. Our gov has proven time and time again that they are our mortal enemy. Any angle they can get to get or control more money is what they what. No matter how good it sounds, nothing they do has any altruistic motivation. They simply don't have it in them. Shoot them all, except Ron Paul.

Actually I was fat when I was young, got some strife out of it but not that much. The other side of the coin, childrens' cruelty has taught me much. The saying "painful truth" comes to mind. Yes indeed it would be better if kids were taught tolerance, but sometimes their intolerance teaches others. Unfortunately it is not always the right lesson. Of all of society's members, children are the most brutal, and at best, the most truthful.

It is a double edged sword, this tolerance. If someone really is wrong, and nobody says anything they will continue to be wrong forever. Where do we draw the line ? If a child is taunted for being fat, what happens ? In some cases he will eat less, in others he will eat more. We cannot predict the effect.

I have a thought about weight. Forget about calories and all that garbage. Your weight is an easily defined quantity. There is no logical argument against it and I defy anyone to try to go against the laws of physics.

You were born 8 lbs., you weigh 200 lbs., that means that you have comsumed 192 lbs that you have not sweat out, urinated or defecated out of your body. It really is as simple as that. OK different foods "stick to your ribs" or "go straight to your thighs" but the weight is still a physical quantity. Nothing magically appears in your body, and nothing magically disappears.

While that statement defies logical rebutment it is not the whole issue. It is still true.

Now the biggest problem with obesity is losing it. You can eat less and less and your body will excrete less and less. This works against you. If you gain a pound a day eating 4 pounds of food, if you cut it down to 2 pounds of food you will not lose a pound a day. This is the trap.

You have to control kids until they learn. If you don't, there are many traps they can fall into, obesity is only one, there are alot worse. Free floating anger, substance abuse come to mind. Hubris is a trap which many never extricate themselves from. Just ask the former taunters of the obese. Sometimes these are the type who will get a divorce if their Wife gains 20 lbs.

"And I think to myself, what a wonderful world".

T

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 10:10:11 AM   
FelinePersuasion


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Status: offline 		I have always thought that too. What happend to parenting. I saw on one talk show this 4 year old that weighed 300 pounds and was on verge of heart failure cause the mother kowtowed to all her babies eating demands. Ie mcdonalds four times a week, chicken nugets in bbq sauce for lunch. When she tried to impliment healthy snacks her kid went on hunger strikes. So rather than forcing the issue she took her kid to mc D's to eat.

Now I can see how you couldn't control what kids did outside your home, friends will provide shit food sometimes but at four you are their SOLE FOOD PROVIDER at most times, and Mc D's is not apropriate to feed your kids let alone 4 times a week.

I see a lot of moms with lil babies just 5 months old in highchairs trying to feed their baby the french fries that mommy is eating and I think why.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShiftedJewel

I have a better idea... how about they target parents of obese little ones? Most learn their eating habits at a very young age and as far as I am concerned those that allow their children to become obese (and yes, I understand there are medical causes out there too, that's not what I am talking about here) are commiting child abuse. Jewel

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 10:20:26 AM   
FelinePersuasion


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Status: offline 		I lived in group homes. They fed let us eat way to much and let us do zero exorcise. To go for a walk you had to have level privilages which ment nobody was grounded on suicide watch or there was enough staff to take the girls out. You couldn't even use the tv room if you were grounded. And I think that exercise vidios should be the one thing universally allowed, grounded on level or not.

We ate 3 times a day, and most the food was rich in calories and fats. I went into that particular group home a size 16 and came out weiging three hundred and thirty pounds.

now I am not claiming total innocence to that weight I chose to pig out and to eat 6 helpings on top of 5 other girls who gave me their food to avoid being docked privilages for wasting food.

But the group homes lack of exercise opertunities and other gross neglagiences was their fault.

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

I worked in group homes as well. Often staff would "bribe" a resident with food. After a while- if each shift does this- the weight packs on. Then if an outburst happens...look out.

yikes.

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 10:43:41 AM   
pahunkboy


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Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Group homes in PA, excercise is a right, not a privelidge. Pretty much anything that the average person can acess- so to, in group homes. [generally speaking]

However if someone is harming themself- staff must interevene.

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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 12:20:43 PM   
UtopianRanger


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-ama11.html

I wasnt too happy when Propel water was taxed here. I know it is pennies....but....

Thoughts on this?



It’s all propaganda; we’re being squeezed and taxed to death and don’t need any more new taxes. If they need revenue to fund some nutty program, eliminate some redundant federal agency, cut spending and have mandatory pay cuts for all bureaucrats. No more new taxes for the American people. - Period.


One last thing.....Stop trying to protect people from themselves.


 - R


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RE: AMA, soda tax per obesity ? - 6/11/2006 12:51:09 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


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quote:

ORIGINAL: UtopianRanger
It’s all propaganda; we’re being squeezed and taxed to death and don’t need any more new taxes. If they need revenue to fund some nutty program, eliminate some redundant federal agency, cut spending and have mandatory pay cuts for all bureaucrats. No more new taxes for the American people. - Period.

One last thing.....Stop trying to protect people from themselves.
- R
I agree with this.
I don't really care if soda is taxed, as I drink soda maybe 4times/year, but perhaps if teachers, parents, and the systems (government/schools) were doing their jobs, the kids wouldn't need to be locked in the house with the tv and the chips. 
We ought to have mandatory Physical Education Classes in EVERY SCHOOL (perhaps extended at the end of the school day); have subsidized daycare so that women don't have to choose poverty with having children vs being happy fullfilled members of society no matter their choice (this because of latch key kids, and kids being raised by other children who don't know better); we ought to also have afterschool physical/sports so that children can have safe places to go and be active.   M

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