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Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 10:18:19 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Here's the video, about 5 minutes, of Michael Moore out of spittle-spraying propagandist mode.  He's talking money, voter demographics, and venting the sense of fatalism bubbling in the left.

HuffnPoo speaks with Michael Moore (via RCP) 

Does anyone else find the pessimism on the left to be increasing?
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 10:29:06 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		It's a lecture about not underestimating the power of money that will flow into this election.

You drew some pretty weird conclusions from there.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 10:30:26 AM   
Restyles


Posts: 116
Joined: 8/22/2012
Status: offline 		It is very clearly manifesting itself in disinterest and resignation in the liberal groups I encounter. Democrat leadership recognizes it and thus the strategy of attempting to rekindle the base via hate and division.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 10:32:54 AM   
Real0ne


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Status: offline 		he forgot to mention the "Diebold Factor"

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 10:34:17 AM   
LaTigresse


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Does anyone else find the pessimism on the left to be increasing?


No.

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My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 10:51:26 AM   
tazzygirl


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quote:

Does anyone else find the pessimism on the left to be increasing?


Nope

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 11:14:35 AM   
Lucylastic


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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 11:29:11 AM   
TheHeretic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

It's a lecture about not underestimating the power of money that will flow into this election.

You drew some pretty weird conclusions from there.


How is that different from what I said? (except for you leaving out the whole topic of the utterly unreliable youth vote that carried him last time?)

And what's weird about calling a "get used to saying President Romney" assessment from Michael Moore, fatalistic? 

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 12:55:18 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

Does anyone else find the pessimism on the left to be increasing?


Nope

Can I add my own "nope"to this chorus ?



whether or not I can......I do
lol

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 1:13:39 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Restyles

It is very clearly manifesting itself in disinterest and resignation in the liberal groups I encounter. Democrat leadership recognizes it and thus the strategy of attempting to rekindle the base via hate and division.

As opposed to, say, the RNC strategy of hate, division, and blatant lying.

(in reply to Restyles)
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 1:15:30 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

It's a lecture about not underestimating the power of money that will flow into this election.

You drew some pretty weird conclusions from there.


How is that different from what I said? (except for you leaving out the whole topic of the utterly unreliable youth vote that carried him last time?)

And what's weird about calling a "get used to saying President Romney" assessment from Michael Moore, fatalistic? 

How did you get from assessing a Moore quote to a sweeping assessment of the left?

Boy and girls, the word for today is assumption.

The topic, if you missed it yourself, is the power of money in elections.



< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 9/1/2012 1:16:15 PM >

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 4:55:58 PM   
DaNewAgeViking


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
Does anyone else find the pessimism on the left to be increasing?

Yes: every Radical nut-case on these boards.

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 5:33:32 PM   
TheHeretic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

How did you get from assessing a Moore quote to a sweeping assessment of the left?



And how did you get from me saying something was bubbling in the left, to it being a sweeping assessment?

I've been seeing it here and there, for a time now, Muse.  I'm hardly going to link you to the facebook pages of the lefties I hang out, drink beer, and eat grilled meat with, now am I? 

There are the pundits, who have written their "excuses in advance," columns, setting the template that he wasn't liberal enough, which I'm sure you could find easily if inclined, or sweetly ask Tazzy to find for you.  I'm sure you could try re-setting your eyes, next time you read a fundraising appeal that shows up in your inbox, and looking for the hint of desperation between the lines.


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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 5:40:38 PM   
Fellow


Posts: 1486
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Obama supporter M. Moore talking total nonsense. Basically what he is saying: Obama is better but money will buy Romney victory (it is obvious Moore does not really believe it, he just feels Obama may not make it). The question is why young people are not  interested any more about Obama victory? How about high unemployment and no hope for change? Obama has been bad president and it is a problem. I wouldn't be so sure Romney will win. Ron Paul created lot of excitement among young voters; they are looking for radical change. Romney is a status quo candidate (the same as Obama), not a reformer. Obama is a major league player in propaganda and deception. He may still pull it off.

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 5:46:19 PM   
DaddySatyr


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quote:

I think he's gotta act. He should have started acting four years ago ... He should not have compromised with congress. He went in, compromising before even stating what he believed. Ummm He hasn't followed through on the things he said he was going to do ... young people that voted for him, four years ago are not that enthused ...


Someone's gonna lose their DNC decoder ring and convention seat!



Peace and comfort,



Michael

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 6:00:54 PM   
cloudboy


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I'm not sure if we can call this leftist, but I'm disappointed in the direction the USA has gone since Ronald Reagan.

(1) There is just too much defense spending, period. It is out of control, and it emboldens the USA to meddle.

(2) We are still too oil-dependent. 1980 to now, we have simply not made investments in public transportation.

(3) In 1998 I taught Middle School in a poor, working class Baltimore neighborhood. The building was dilapidated, and the school was under-performing. There was one copy machine for the whole school and two telephone lines. 8 classrooms were portable classrooms (trailers.) I went back to see this school 14 years later, and it looks worse than before -- if you did not know it was a school, you might guess that it was a prison in a 3rd World Country.

(4) Ronald Reagan often said the US should have won the Vietnam War, and that line of thinking, that arrogance reared its head again after 9/11.

(5) The growth of family values - wedge issues is entirely irritating and it leads to electoral victories for fringe-worthy candidates.

(6) The US needs a Constitutional Amendment to curb campaign contributions. We might also consider six year terms for the Presidency, 4 years terms for house members, and term limits for Supreme Court Justices. This might better promote the USA's reliance on democracy, and it might insulate our political leaders from having to pander so much. Next, the line-item veto should be passed as legal under the constitution to help guard against excessive earmarks in the federal budget.

(7) Anti-government rhetoric -- its just out of control. What we need is better government.

(8) Public interest politics is almost a non factor in DC right now. Big money interests control the agendas.

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 6:02:32 PM   
stellauk


Posts: 1360
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

Romney is a status quo candidate



True dat

*Pick up air guitars here*

'Get down deeper on down
Down down deeper on down
Down down deeper on down
Get down deeper on down

I want all the world to see
To see you're laughing, and you're laughing at me
I could take it all from you
Again, again, again, again, again, again, again
Deeper on down....'

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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 7:34:55 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

How did you get from assessing a Moore quote to a sweeping assessment of the left?



And how did you get from me saying something was bubbling in the left, to it being a sweeping assessment?

I've been seeing it here and there, for a time now, Muse.  I'm hardly going to link you to the facebook pages of the lefties I hang out, drink beer, and eat grilled meat with, now am I? 

There are the pundits, who have written their "excuses in advance," columns, setting the template that he wasn't liberal enough, which I'm sure you could find easily if inclined, or sweetly ask Tazzy to find for you.  I'm sure you could try re-setting your eyes, next time you read a fundraising appeal that shows up in your inbox, and looking for the hint of desperation between the lines.



Ah. I need to wear your glasses to see it.

Pass.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/1/2012 7:38:02 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy


I'm not sure if we can call this leftist, but I'm disappointed in the direction the USA has gone since Ronald Reagan.

(1) There is just too much defense spending, period. It is out of control, and it emboldens the USA to meddle.

(2) We are still too oil-dependent. 1980 to now, we have simply not made investments in public transportation.

(3) In 1998 I taught Middle School in a poor, working class Baltimore neighborhood. The building was dilapidated, and the school was under-performing. There was one copy machine for the whole school and two telephone lines. 8 classrooms were portable classrooms (trailers.) I went back to see this school 14 years later, and it looks worse than before -- if you did not know it was a school, you might guess that it was a prison in a 3rd World Country.

(4) Ronald Reagan often said the US should have won the Vietnam War, and that line of thinking, that arrogance reared its head again after 9/11.

(5) The growth of family values - wedge issues is entirely irritating and it leads to electoral victories for fringe-worthy candidates.

(6) The US needs a Constitutional Amendment to curb campaign contributions. We might also consider six year terms for the Presidency, 4 years terms for house members, and term limits for Supreme Court Justices. This might better promote the USA's reliance on democracy, and it might insulate our political leaders from having to pander so much. Next, the line-item veto should be passed as legal under the constitution to help guard against excessive earmarks in the federal budget.

(7) Anti-government rhetoric -- its just out of control. What we need is better government.

(8) Public interest politics is almost a non factor in DC right now. Big money interests control the agendas.

Agreed, and well said, with a note on #6 -- not sure about that, but an interesting thought for further consideration.

(in reply to cloudboy)
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RE: Realpolitik, with Michael Moore - 9/2/2012 12:33:36 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

The topic, if you missed it yourself, is the power of money in elections.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Ah. I need to wear your glasses to see it.

Pass.


No, Muse.  If you are unwilling to see the perspective through another set of eyes, or even by clearing the filters momentarily from your own, that still doesn't invite you to redefine the topic of the thread to suit your comfort level.

Moore talked about money, yes, but he also spoke of the turnout and enthusiasm of young voters.  He brought up the organization and energy of the conservative base, and he wrapped it all in a fatalistic outlook of how the election may turn out.

You don't want to watch the vid for more than a few seconds?  Fine.  You don't wish to think or view from outside your comfort zone?  Live how you wanna live, baby.  You think you can force everybody else to operate and think according to how you like it in your safety sac?  Good luck with that.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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