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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:04:54 AM

DiannaVesta

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

quote:

ORIGINAL: DiannaVesta

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

Slave definately, kajira specifically and nothing less or different will do. I want to and will own her heart, body and soul as is my right.

Hey Ironbear how nice to see you. I was thinking about you and hope that you will drop me a line.

Now as for the post.... can you please explain what you mean by "is my right" ? I'm curious. That's how I feel and would like to learn more about how the men feel.

Greetings Dianna, good to see you too,

The right I refer to extends only within the Gorean lifestyle Community and is tempered with the common sence attitude that we still have to abide by the laws of the land. However within those constricts, as a Gorean Master (if I bother to collar another girl, when and if one becomes available near me), It is my right to own my property completely. It is also my right to deal with her as I see fit and it is also certainly my right to know here inside out... After all how else can I Master her completely and help her develop and grow to be the best she can be. That too is my right..

Thank you. Thats very cool & I am sure it's also romantic to those into it. I love that type of stuff.

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:04:54 AM

SweetDommes

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To the OP: We prefer submissives, for most of the same reasons as you. There are also so many negative connotations, in our minds and the minds of others, connected to the word "slave" ... not to mention the type of 'slaves' that we have run across during our search *rolls eyes*

To Dianna: our dynamics with our submissive are all the time, even when not actively Dominating him, we are all still aware of the dynamics. I don't know if you intended it or not, but to me, it seems that you are implying that submission isn't/can't be all the time, that only slavery is ... and I disagree. However, honestly, your description of having a slave (that it's not just someone to take out the trash ... that you feel the dynamics all the time) is how we describe having a submissive. We just use a different name for it. Everyone has different connotations to words that may or may not be related to the true definition of the word (according to a dictionary) ... for us, a slave is a bad thing, but a submissive is a wonderful thing ... you seem to use the word slave for the same kind of people that we use the word submissive for (due to our varying connotations), and the word submissive for what we would call a bottom. This is one of many reasons that there are so many misunderstandings that occur in this lifestyle. Sometimes I think it would be nice if there were some kind of code so that each word mean approximately the same thing to at least most people ... and then I realise that there would be so many arguments about the "true" meaning of a word that it just isn't possible ...

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:11:05 AM

DiannaVesta

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SweetDommes

To the OP: We prefer submissives, for most of the same reasons as you. There are also so many negative connotations, in our minds and the minds of others, connected to the word "slave" ... not to mention the type of 'slaves' that we have run across during our search *rolls eyes*

To Dianna: our dynamics with our submissive are all the time, even when not actively Dominating him, we are all still aware of the dynamics. I don't know if you intended it or not, but to me, it seems that you are implying that submission isn't/can't be all the time, that only slavery is ... and I disagree. However, honestly, your description of having a slave (that it's not just someone to take out the trash ... that you feel the dynamics all the time) is how we describe having a submissive. We just use a different name for it. Everyone has different connotations to words that may or may not be related to the true definition of the word (according to a dictionary) ... for us, a slave is a bad thing, but a submissive is a wonderful thing ... you seem to use the word slave for the same kind of people that we use the word submissive for (due to our varying connotations), and the word submissive for what we would call a bottom. This is one of many reasons that there are so many misunderstandings that occur in this lifestyle. Sometimes I think it would be nice if there were some kind of code so that each word mean approximately the same thing to at least most people ... and then I realise that there would be so many arguments about the "true" meaning of a word that it just isn't possible ...

Oh no, I don't think that all. There are definitely submissives that maintain that base all the time. I know this. I use the word slave to define ones position in my life and really I just love the word. Often I will call out to mine, “Slave come here” & it makes fuzzies in both of us.

I can have submissive friends who I spend time with and enjoy while they are in that space or when we’re together. However when one turns themselves over to me and becomes my property then BABY that’s a slave!

Damn just thinking about it gets me excited!

Now where is my slave???? ::::looking about the house::::: Damn it the house work will never get done and my mother is coming for 2 days. Wait til slave meets mom! Lol- and hy thinks I’m demanding.

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:11:05 AM

IronBear

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DiannaVesta

Thank you. Thats very cool & I am sure it's also romantic to those into it. I love that type of stuff.

I gues it is but the Irish side of is the romantic in a very Edwardian way too.. However it is more than that I have obligations to all who are in my care and protection, be they two foot, four foot, slave or Free... It is based largely on how I was brought up and a sense of Honour, Integrety, Loyalty, Duty and Love.... Not romantic nor special or praisworthy for it is a natural part of what I grew up to be.

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:18:26 AM

DiannaVesta

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

quote:

ORIGINAL: DiannaVesta

Thank you. Thats very cool & I am sure it's also romantic to those into it. I love that type of stuff.

I gues it is but the Irish side of is the romantic in a very Edwardian way too.. However it is more than that I have obligations to all who are in my care and protection, be they two foot, four foot, slave or Free... It is based largely on how I was brought up and a sense of Honour, Integrety, Loyalty, Duty and Love.... Not romantic nor special or praisworthy for it is a natural part of what I grew up to be.

This is how I feel too.

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:27:56 AM

LadyHugs

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Dear GddssBella, Ladies and Gentlemen;

My real preference would be slave over submissive.

Submissive types submit many times and have boundaries. A slave submits once and within the boundaries of the Master/Mistress/Owner.

Submissives can show slave tendencies. Slaves shows submissive tendencies. The mindset of submissives seemingly are how may it please both of us equally. The mindset of slaves seemingly are how may they serve their Master/Mistress and find pleasure in doing so.

Submissives tend to adlib in service adding their own perception of what is pleasing to the dominant. Slaves add to the pleasing of the dominant staying within the preferences and perception of pleasure that the dominant expresses as service. Thus, no need to micro-manage as expectations are known and the boundaries a slave can operate with freedom.

Slaves and submissives in my circles, do have a voice, they do have personalities, they have choices, they do have liberties per se. They just act on them differently, submissives do not always have a protocol to do such whereas, slaves do.

None are better than the other but, submission's energy is very different, manifests differently, seen differently and for me 'felt' differently. I have a more peaceful feeling around slaves.

Respectfully submitted for consideration,
Lady Hugs

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 10:44:33 AM

iliv2servher

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra

[Much good stuff snipped.]

quote:

In my opinion having a submissive is a lot less stressful for me then having, a slave would be. As I said, I have never owned a slave so I am not speaking from experience just from what I have read and heard others say about their M/s relationships.

Considering Lashra's definition of a slave as opposed to a submissive, I would tend to agree with her in that having to micromanage a person 24/7 would be akin to having an adult child in your care who may or may not have the mental capacity to make his or her own decisions. That's a hell of a lot of responsibility for anyone to take on.

And although it may be both interesting and useful for a domme to have such a person under her control, I would tend to believe that dominant females are attracted to those who are intelligent and who have other interests in life other than service. I don't even think it is healthy to be in a relationship with a person of that stature, unless that person happens to be disabled or mentally retarded. In that case, a caregiver family member or nurse practitioner would be the best choice. But we're not talking about that, are we?

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 11:52:52 AM

LadiesBladewing

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GddssBella

What do you prefer, submissive or slave? Why? Pro/cons? Definitions? I'll post my own take on this thread once it gets off the ground. Please, no flaming and let's keep this civil. Thanks.

Neither, actually. When we have an opening for a servant, we prefer an individual who is submissive in nature. Over time, the depth and breadth of that submission can be shaped and tested, but we don't expect an individual to turn his or her life over into our care 100% from day one. We expect that there will be a gradual yielding. Because of this, there are basic rules for newcomers. These rules become fewer, but also more intense as a servant moves into a more long-term relationship with our household. The servants in the inner core only have 2 rules -- "Yield completely, from the depth of your heart" -and- "Strive for perfection in every act, every day." By that time, that's all they need -- but within those rules are the foundations to yield utterly, in every way, at all times. Between the day they arrive and the day they're ready for the final set of rules, there will be a lot of trial and error, a lot of questions, and a lot of room to grow or go. Anyone can make it to that point, if they truly desire to -- but for many, the demands don't correspond to the desire.

It's pretty much impossible for me to answer the question directly, since we don't use the terms "submissive" or "slave" here. We decided to come up with another useful term because slave is innacurate for an individual in a voluntary position to yield, and because "submissive" is an adjective and I'm a pain in the butt about saying what I mean.

We chose "servant" because it is gender neutral, accurately describes the station in the household, and does not make any distinction between the person who comes to serve for a little while or every so often and the one who serves every day, all day -- the only distinction comes from the efforts of each individual. If they all serve from the depth of their spirits, they're all outstanding servants -- if they don't, they don't end up staying here long.

ZWD

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 2:22:40 PM

agirl

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quote:

ORIGINAL: iliv2servher

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra

[Much good stuff snipped.]

quote:

In my opinion having a submissive is a lot less stressful for me then having, a slave would be. As I said, I have never owned a slave so I am not speaking from experience just from what I have read and heard others say about their M/s relationships.

Considering Lashra's definition of a slave as opposed to a submissive, I would tend to agree with her in that having to micromanage a person 24/7 would be akin to having an adult child in your care who may or may not have the mental capacity to make his or her own decisions. That's a hell of a lot of responsibility for anyone to take on.

And although it may be both interesting and useful for a domme to have such a person under her control, I would tend to believe that dominant females are attracted to those who are intelligent and who have other interests in life other than service. I don't even think it is healthy to be in a relationship with a person of that stature, unless that person happens to be disabled or mentally retarded. In that case, a caregiver family member or nurse practitioner would be the best choice. But we're not talking about that, are we?

I would have thought that if a dominant chose to micromanage then it would follow that he/she finds it pleasing to do so.

agirl

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 3:21:32 PM

IronBear

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Iwill only have slaves as i have commented already. However no slave of mine even need micromanagement. They are ruthlessly trained, have written coppies of HIB's standing orders which are also posted on the boards and know my preferences regarding dress. They are expected to follow these and if there are any questions they should be firstly address to the MoS (Mistress of Slaves or if unavailable or the girl is my personal to me. When there are multiple slaves the person who will supervise all chores and deal with all minor situations as well as respond to questionsis the First Girl. A high maintance slave who needs micromanagement wouild find no place in any Gorean Home I know..

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RE: Preferences... - 6/19/2006 6:20:37 PM

TeeGO

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My thoughts on this for what it's worth is that a submissive and a slave are the same thing with the difference being a slave is owned and a submissive is not.

Now same thing is relative because no two submissives, slaves, Dom's, or Domme's are the same.

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RE: Preferences... - 6/20/2006 9:16:25 AM

KaramelGoddess

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quote:

For me a submissive is highly desirable, which I have. He's got backbone, sass, and an independent streak which frees me up from worrying about him all the time. He's capable of fending for himself. My boy is quite solicitous of me and puts my comforts first in almost all things. If all goes well and we're still together much further down the line, the situation will be total when we move in together. His greatest pleasure is to be useful to me and make my life easier. He exemplifies what I believe is best in a submissive. Not to mention, he's cuddlier than a teddy bear.

I love this description... and it is also what I desire. I love a boy who will be feisty sometimes....and then will beg forgiveness during a thorough beating

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RE: Preferences... - 6/20/2006 9:50:41 PM

Vendaval

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Greetings A/all,

The preference right now is for submissives and bottoms because
My schedule is so crazy and I spend so much time on the road.

Anyone wanting to be a slave would need to climb in, stap
on the seat belt, hold on, and shut up!

lol,

Vendaval

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RE: Preferences... - 6/20/2006 11:59:35 PM

MsKarenMarie

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What an intersting bunch of opinnions here. And tru to Myself I will give Y/you Mine as well.......

I agree with Raven and the Gorean Master (forgive Me but I didnt write Your name before I started typing) about slavery and micromanagement.... if a slave is well trained it is like a well-oiled machine which only needs proper maintenance to keep going.....a slave in My mind is one who from the depths of its heart knows that serving is its calling and finds fullfillment in doing so to the One whom it has pledged its servitude....

Respectfully,

MsKarenMarie

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RE: Preferences... - 6/21/2006 5:25:16 AM

IronBear

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Greetings KarenMarie,

Welcome to the forums another voice is great to see/read/hear (Ohh shyte what ever I guess you know what I mean).......

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RE: Preferences... - 6/21/2006 5:45:31 AM

Lashra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I would have thought that if a dominant chose to micromanage then it would follow that he/she finds it pleasing to do so.

agirl

Exactly, from what I understood when speaking to Owners the majority of them seem to enjoy micromanaging someone, but this wasnt true in every case. I personally do not care to micromanage and hence why I stated I prefer submissives.

~Lashra

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RE: Preferences... - 6/22/2006 11:14:42 PM

MsKarenMarie

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Grettings to You as well Master Iron Bear.... and thank You for the warm welcome lol!

Respectfully,

Ms KarenMarie

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RE: Preferences... - 6/23/2006 12:19:16 AM

stockingluvr54

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra

Submissives have a say in their day-to-day life, they handle their own finances and many of their own decisions. They are pretty much self sufficient in most areas but some areas are turned over to the Dominant to control. I have a sub, he makes most of his own decisions, and he sometimes asks for my input. He can say yes or no, to whatever I suggest but he is better off saying yes . In the bedroom, I make the decisions and call all the shots,"

~Lashra

New to site and been up all night reading all the threads with much interest! I'm new to all of this with very little experience but what Lashra describes is my perception of how I hope fit into this lifestyle at this point in time? What Lashra mentioned along with trust and communication is where I hope to be as the ladys' sub...not someones slave or doormat...but their sub that wants to please and also be lead at times but maintain my own identity and mind.....

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