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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/30/2012 3:14:35 AM   
Edwynn


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I didn't read his mind, I read what he said. It's that simple.

Logical understanding (even of illogical statements) and common sense comprehension is all it takes, no 'mind reading' about it.



< Message edited by Edwynn -- 10/30/2012 3:20:10 AM >

(in reply to Kirata)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/30/2012 3:19:54 AM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn

It's that simple... no 'mind reading' about it.

Now you're being modest.

K.





< Message edited by Kirata -- 10/30/2012 3:20:35 AM >

(in reply to Edwynn)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/30/2012 5:24:35 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

Is it simply because I didn't spell it out as eloquently as you, that I'm getting all sorts of heat for my analysis of Mourdock's intent?


Not simply that, but it no doubt plays a part.

IWYW,
— Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 423
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/30/2012 5:44:16 AM   
Aswad


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Joined: 4/4/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

Perhaps it's because my belief in Christianity ticks them off and Aswad doesn't carry that burden, but neither one of us thinks government should have the say in it.


I certainly carry that burden. Most of the posters on this thread are quite aware that I have beliefs that would probably receive the label "Christian" and, on this account, no small number no doubt shake their head slightly and think "why would an otherwise reasonable person believe in that BS?", with a few probably thinking "such a pity he still clings to that belief" (even though there's no clinging involved). There have been instances where people have dismissed my arguments on grounds of my person on the basis of this belief, but it is fortunately a fairly rare occurence.

Of course, I don't think Christianity is incompatible with abortion, either.

And, as you say, the government should not have the right to requisition a woman's body to serve as life support for a foetus. Else, one has precedence for permitting the state to use our bodies when it is deemed necessary, a precedent I would not care to introduce, ever. Kind of like universal organ donation meets institutionalized slavery. If my neighbour needs my bone marrow, I'll probably provide it, but never because the state believes itself to own my body and to have some right to manage it like so much inventory.

IWYW,
— Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/30/2012 6:30:06 AM   
Aswad


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

That does not exhaust the options, however.


I was trying to keep it simple. That seems to be a useful thing when there is much confusion about a subject, and especially when trying not to go too far afield. Of course, there is the possibility of extensive intervention, but practically speaking that still invalidates humanity when it occurs on any significant scale.

In any case, running down a very large network of implications from a statement is not generally a valid way to determine what one can hold a person accountable for, which is part of why Rule gets so much flak for the obliqueness of his comments. Do that graph tracing too well, and it's insanity. Do it too poorly, and suddenly it's "anyone can see that". This never sat well with me, which is why I tend to pay attention when Rule speaks, even though he's sometimes wrong; most people can't tell when he's wrong, and when he's simply far ahead of them. It shouldn't take many notes to tell when someone is playing in a different key, versus slamming the piano at random, but that's apparently not true for most when we're dealing with thoughts, rather than the auditory kind of music.

IWYW,
— Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 425
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/30/2012 5:23:55 PM   
Politesub53


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Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Ah yes, anyone who doesnt agree with you must be illiterate...

It's not a matter of agreeing with me. It's a matter of English. Obviously you don't understand that, so I'm pleased you have chosen to demonstrate my point yet again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

It doesnt say "God intends rape" it says "Now God intended rape" The OP makes quite clear who the target is.

My apologies, I misunderstood. So your claim is actually that previously God did not intend rape to happen, but Mourdock "said" that God has changed his mind and "now" he does. Well that's an interesting take on it. If you can find the time, I'd be fascinated to hear what you think of this.

K.



Why do you attribute words to me that I didnt utter. Is this down to your illiteracy or your ignorance ?

(in reply to Kirata)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/31/2012 4:10:26 PM   
GotSteel


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Joined: 2/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
GS, you are assuming I am arguing the validity of that position. I am not. I do understand that at the time of that writing, that was how society was. Its like pointing to a southern law regarding slavery and labeling everyone from the south as racist. The past is the past. We learn from it. But utilizing it for today's standards doesnt work.

So, you go ahead with your dommly self and demonize writings that are over 3000 years old. And I will point out that, once again, its history written into a book.

Morality is subjective but it's not that subjective. We're talking about a culture that was truly awful when it came to womens rights. As a matter of history, meh they sucked whatever. Thing is people are still trying to use their ancient horribly misogynistic ideas as a template for how society should operate, ergo the war on women.

That's the conversation you walked into and played the legitimate rape card. To remind you of the point fucktoy was trying to make, here it is again:

quote:

ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess
Got Steel, this is at the crux of the issue. Most major religions in the world did view women as property (and if not as property, certainly second class citizens who were required to listen to either fathers or husbands). It is quite clear that women were not treated as independent free thinking individuals. And thus, much scripture from many of the religions contain passages that absolutely do not square with contemporary society.

So again, it simply takes us back to why scripture (of any religion) ought to have any great weight on how we resolve contemporary issues. On issues relating to women, almost all the major religions would not support anything even remotely resembling equal rights for women. So falling back on religion to help us answer these questions seems ill-guided to me. I think you would agree.



P.S. WOOT my powers back.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/31/2012 4:19:47 PM   
GotSteel


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
Your hatred for anything and eveything religious is well known. I dont expect you to accept anything anyone has to say about it in any regards that conflict with your own narrow thinking.


I don't expect you to agree with my position on religion but next time before you go to insult my thinking, take a moment to remember that I used to be a Congregational Christian. In order to get to my current position I like many atheists had to transition across the majority of the spectrum of theistic positions.

The thoughts I've had on this subject are anything but narrow.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/31/2012 5:09:30 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		It doesnt matter what you used to be, what you are now, or what you will be in the future. When it comes to this, you are narrow minded even in spite of those who make it their life work to study the Bible. You "transitioning" does not make you an expert. Your hatred of religion makes you even less so.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to GotSteel)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 10/31/2012 8:31:37 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

I don't expect you to agree with my position on religion but next time before you go to insult my thinking, take a moment to remember that I used to be a Congregational Christian.

Well damn, if that doesn't qualify someone as an expert on religion, I don't know what does.

quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

In order to get to my current position I like many atheists had to transition across the majority of the spectrum of theistic positions.

The majority of the spectrum, eh? And how old are you?

K.

(in reply to GotSteel)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 5:13:18 AM   
DomYngBlk


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Joined: 3/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Ah yes, anyone who doesnt agree with you must be illiterate...

It's not a matter of agreeing with me. It's a matter of English. Obviously you don't understand that, so I'm pleased you have chosen to demonstrate my point yet again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

It doesnt say "God intends rape" it says "Now God intended rape" The OP makes quite clear who the target is.

My apologies, I misunderstood. So your claim is actually that previously God did not intend rape to happen, but Mourdock "said" that God has changed his mind and "now" he does. Well that's an interesting take on it. If you can find the time, I'd be fascinated to hear what you think of this.

K.



Why do you attribute words to me that I didnt utter. Is this down to your illiteracy or your ignorance ?


PS I'd say it is the twins Illiteracy and Ignorance....

(in reply to Politesub53)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 5:49:03 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		I always thought He was a Jesuit...

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to vincentML)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 6:04:41 AM   
GotSteel


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Joined: 2/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
It doesnt matter what you used to be, what you are now, or what you will be in the future.

How could that possibly not matter?

It's not that I'm unwilling to listen to or think about a position. It's that hearing the same tired argument for the tenth or even hundredth time doesn't somehow magically make the argument any better. In a pretty sizable chunk of this theist vs. atheist stuff I've been the theist. I've pushed those arguments, I've pushed those positions. I've figured out or been told the problems with them, thought them through and subsequently rejected them.

So when someone shows up on here advocating the same stuff I used to and doing a worse job of it, how could I possibly be expected to find it compelling?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
When it comes to this, you are narrow minded even in spite of those who make it their life work to study the Bible. You "transitioning" does not make you an expert. Your hatred of religion makes you even less so.


Speaking of narrow minded here's something you might want to think about, what would you call somebody who's spent years talking to atheists and just keeps telling us what our positions are instead of actually listening to us that it's something different?







(in reply to tazzygirl)
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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 6:12:35 AM   
Kirata


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From: USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I always thought He was a Jesuit...

Nah, he never liked Catholics even before he became a Presbyterian.

K.





< Message edited by Kirata -- 11/1/2012 6:17:21 AM >

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RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 6:43:08 AM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

Speaking of narrow minded here's something you might want to think about, what would you call somebody who's spent years talking to atheists and just keeps telling us what our positions are instead of actually listening to us that it's something different?

Well for starters, "positions" is plural but "it's" is singular. So, you seem a bit confused. Would a dictionary help?

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 11/1/2012 6:53:17 AM >

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 435
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 6:50:13 AM   
bamaladie


Posts: 1
Joined: 7/8/2011
Status: offline 		REALLY?????!!!!

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 436
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 7:22:41 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
It doesnt matter what you used to be, what you are now, or what you will be in the future.

How could that possibly not matter?

It's not that I'm unwilling to listen to or think about a position. It's that hearing the same tired argument for the tenth or even hundredth time doesn't somehow magically make the argument any better. In a pretty sizable chunk of this theist vs. atheist stuff I've been the theist. I've pushed those arguments, I've pushed those positions. I've figured out or been told the problems with them, thought them through and subsequently rejected them.

So when someone shows up on here advocating the same stuff I used to and doing a worse job of it, how could I possibly be expected to find it compelling?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
When it comes to this, you are narrow minded even in spite of those who make it their life work to study the Bible. You "transitioning" does not make you an expert. Your hatred of religion makes you even less so.


Speaking of narrow minded here's something you might want to think about, what would you call somebody who's spent years talking to atheists and just keeps telling us what our positions are instead of actually listening to us that it's something different?



And we are to just take your word that you have more knowledge than the experts?

As far as tell atheists what their positions are... I dont.

YOUR position is quite clear.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 11/1/2012 7:23:37 AM >

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 437
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 12:38:23 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Well for starters, "positions" is plural but "it's" is singular. So, you seem a bit confused. Would a dictionary help?

K.[/font][/size]





Now now Mr English Major, it`s is an abbreviation of it is ?




(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 438
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 2:16:46 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Well for starters, "positions" is plural but "it's" is singular. So, you seem a bit confused. Would a dictionary help?

Now now Mr English Major, it`s is an abbreviation of it is ?

Okay, by the numbers...

1. You keep harping on this, accusing me of "spouting off" about being an English major and now descending into calling me cocky names. But I only mentioned it once in passing when responding to this:

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

For a few years after college, I was a volunteer ESL teacher, and I've been a professional wordsmith for a quarter of a century now...

2. In the sentence quoted, "positions" is plural and therefore the correct pronoun is "they" not "it"; i.e., "they are" not "it is" (contracted or otherwise). Most people learn this kind of simple shit before they graduate from primary school, so I'll thank you again for demonstrating your illiteracy yet a third time.

Let me know if you want to go for four.

K.


< Message edited by Kirata -- 11/1/2012 2:27:55 PM >

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 439
RE: Now God intended rape to happen. - 11/1/2012 3:56:56 PM   
dcnovice


Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
Status: offline
quote:

1. You keep harping on this, accusing me of "spouting off" about being an English major and now descending into calling me cocky names. But I only mentioned it once in passing when responding to this:

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

For a few years after college, I was a volunteer ESL teacher, and I've been a professional wordsmith for a quarter of a century now...



Which in turn was in response to . . .

quote:

Maybe an ESL course would help you.


I generally try to avoid playing grammar cop online, since I gave at the office.



_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to Kirata)
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