RE: Question for the Sadists out there?

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sexblob -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/11/2007 1:05:29 AM)
I identify (partly) as a masochist. But recieving pain is hard work. For me it never stops hurting. Nor does it ever stop giving. There's a paradox inherent in masochism. Pain is a doorway to transcendence. But it also hurts like a mofo. What are you gonna do?

Guilty1974 -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/11/2007 1:24:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sexblob I identify (partly) as a masochist. But recieving pain is hard work. For me it never stops hurting. Nor does it ever stop giving. There's a paradox inherent in masochism. Pain is a doorway to transcendence. But it also hurts like a mofo. As I said, I'll try to find the point where it becomes less pleasurable. The point where you would like to "please untie me". Perhaps I will try to distract you. To disallow transcendence. Or find a type of pain you can handle less well. There's a chance of course that point does not exist, but so far I've almost always succeeded. For instance, my girlfriend can handle 45 minutese fully suspended in ropes, and in general handles the pain of bondage very well. But a pair of clothespins on her nipples will break her easily.

SailingBum -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/14/2007 4:07:47 AM)
My bitch will take the pain for me. BadOne

Owner4SexSlave -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/14/2007 4:26:07 AM)
This is a bit of a puzzle for me. If I am with a pain slut I am very happy to dish out the wonderful pain. Knowing that she finds pleasure in it ultimately. Now, I have my own sadist side, where I take pleasure in dishing out pain, Hell even have moment where I'm sexually arroused by whimpers, sighs, and even tears. The thing is playing within the limits. For instance I have become more sexually arroused by the pain of somebody with a lower pain tolerence compared to a pain slut... OK, my mind is fried what was the question again? My brain sort of split in half and fell apart. Because it's a bit of mixture for me. I'm a sort of ethical or empathic sadist. Fluffy to a point as LA mentioned in her post. However, I have teeth and claws too. The reaction I get from somebody is what I enjoy most, be it pain, pleasure, or teasing or whatever it is. if somebody lays there like a limp motionless mouse, well it does not do a thing for me.

DomDG -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/14/2007 9:51:30 PM)
I play with every type you have mentioned. I admit that I fly as a dom better when she is submitting to pain wether she likes it or not. I also find that subs tend to go into subspace from it quicker when they are submitting to it to please me. I think that is because the subspace starts when she lets go and knows it is only for my pleasure at the moment. Now understand I am also a sensual sadist, and the sub will be well rewarded for her submission!

TMaster2 -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/15/2007 6:30:51 AM)
good question -- the dichotomy of this is something I have wondered about too. For me, I like to dish out the pain, but I want someone who will take it, agrees to take it, or likes to take it. I care about that other person, so even though it is pain I like to give, I do not like to give it to someone who will not/cannot take it. I will cause pain, but I do NOT want to cause trauma. And I want to to give it out in doses encapsulated in sensual surrounds, as much as possible, to keep them wanting more. To learn that the pain CAN equal the pleasure, eh? This doesn't work with everyone, obviously. My wife just can't take a very high dose, so we turn to other things, but all are good in their own way. However, when I look for another person I always insist on the pain willingness, if not total masochistic behavior. One thing I have never had to deal with, but would be daunting if I did, was if I had a masochist whose pain level I could not reach... I'd hate to do all I liked and have him/her give me that "is that all you got?" look... lol

beltainefaerie -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/15/2007 8:34:27 AM)
I like playing with a maschist and starting at the pain they enjoy and find arousing, then move on to discover what toys and sensations they hate. (Since I am a painslut too, I know we all have something we dislike). I get off on their pain, whether mixed with pleasure or not. Sometimes it is nice to have them getting as hot as I am and other times, it is nice to watch them squirm and beg, or take things they usually wouldn't like, just to submit to me. Either can be hot. Incidentally, my Master also enjoys both. I think he takes special delight in making me do things I hate. (and I love submitting to them for him).

Leatherist -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/15/2007 6:14:39 PM)
I never enjoyed a bottom who liked it too much. I think people get sadism and sensualism confused.

ItalianSMistress -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/15/2007 6:29:03 PM)
I prefer someone that is not enjoying it, but will endure it for Me. If they do enjoy it, I will push them until they are not any longer. I am highly sadistic and will always push that further and further.

BayouSub -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/17/2007 5:59:01 PM)
quote: MstrssPassion: The sadist is concerned with the sexual pleasure of their "victim" & they do not wish to exclude their pleasure & many sadists regard that pleasure as essential to his/her own satisfaction. I must respectfully disagree. What a true sadist wants is to inflict physical or psychological suffering on his/her victim. Being concerned with the victim's pleasure is inconsistent with a desire to inflict suffering. I'm not an expert on this but I found this on the internet: Diagnostic criteria for 302.84 Sexual Sadism A. Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving acts (real, not simulated) in which the psychological or physical suffering (including humiliation) of the victim is sexually exciting to the person. B. The person has acted on these urges with a nonconsenting person, or the sexual urges or fantasies cause marked distress or interpersonal difficulty. http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/sexsadismTR.htm On another board, a sadist posted: "My fun begins when yours ends." I think this describes the sadist mindset very well. quote: LuckyAlbatross: Reposted: I happen to think actual sadism is incompatible with actual masochism. A sadist wants the other person to feel PAIN, not pleasure. A masochist feels pain AS pleasure. Fluffy sadists however, who want the other person to enjoy the pain, works perfect with a masochist. If a masochist feels pain as pleasure, then pain will not provide the masochist what he/she wants. A masochist seeks suffering. Certainly, pain can be suffering if pain is felt AS pain. Humiliation can provide suffering. Being made to do something you hate to do can also be suffering. Diagnostic criteria for 302.83 Sexual Masochism A. Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving the act (real, not simulated) of being humiliated, beaten, bound, or otherwise made to suffer. B. The fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/sexmasochism.htm In summary, in my humble opinion, if you are concerned about your victim's pleasure, you are not an actual sadist. Additionally, if you only desire to experience pain as pleasure and have no desire to suffer, you are not a masochist. I'm Not trying to start a definitional war here but just putting in my 2 cents.

erebus -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/20/2007 3:44:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: heartfeltsub Though i originally asked this question a while ago, i am very glad that someone brought the thread back up as it has become applicable to me again. i recently (in the last few of months) went through about 4 operations (girl stuff) and got off of birth control pills and have found that was once a rather high pain tolerance had dramatically changed. Also the frequency of play has also decreased which has had an effect on my pain tolerance. So while stressing about the fact that my pain tolerance is not what it once was and may not ever be that again, One of the Dominants who i serve made sure i realized that He is not so concerned with how much pain i can take but rather is concerned with my obedience. Which was a very reassuring thought for me. While i can not control what my pain tolerance will be in the future, i can control whether i will obey or not. Thank you one and all for your replies. So, does this end this thread? I found it interesting.

kingbeef31 -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/20/2007 8:50:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: heartfeltsub For those of you who are sadists, may i ask do you prefer to "play with" or look for someone who enjoys the pain for pain sake or someone who doesn't really enjoy the pain for pain sake but submits to it for your sake? Also on the same vein, do you prefer to "play with" or look for someone who can go into sub space from the pain or someone who doesn't end up floating from the pain, but stays in the moment. i see so many profiles from people who are sadists who say they are looking for masochists and they always make me wonder, because if inflicting pain is what arouses a person sexually, if the person receiving the pain processes it as pleasure, i would think that would lessen the "pleasure" of inflicting the pain. Hence the question. Thank you in advance for your answers. heartfelt *editted because i can't seem to type lately. I personally enjoy someone who enjoys the pain, but also is willing to submit to my Sadistic whims. As for the second question, I enjoy the fact that a sub is in space in their own world. It's a turn on to see that transformation.

heartfeltsub -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/21/2007 2:45:30 AM)
It doesn't seem to be the end of the thread, just my most recent input on a thread that had been revived. The answers have all been very interesting. heartfelt

ShibariJon -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/21/2007 2:50:31 AM)
The first yelp is always the sweetest ... Yet so often I have seen other Doms, and on occasion even I have raised welts on a backside of a submissive like the rumble strip of a highway and not a murmer of discontent. Physically it's a good workout , but emotionally I find the experiance lacking..

heartfeltsub -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/21/2007 11:39:45 AM)
Although i really don't identify as a masochist, i used to be a heavier player than i currently am, initially i am quiet, but then as the pain builds, i tend to make more noise. The silence is to try to be able to process the pain, because with the exception on one time, i stay in the moment, feeling everything. Thank everyone for their posts. heartfelt

Aswad -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/21/2007 2:26:47 PM)
quote: My fun begins when yours ends. That one sums it up pretty well with regard to the sadism bit. I also enjoy other angles, but the point where she's not enjoying herself anymore is the point where it starts to be fun for the sadist in me. As LadyHugs said, it's a different kind of fun. And, as Noah said, it's not one-dimensional. There are many different responses that occur in concert with each other, or as a counterpoint to each other. But the sadism part is pretty clear cut. But the diagnostic criterion are pretty irrelevant, and the DSM IV-TR ones don't care if it's consensual. Health, al-Aswad.

heartfeltsub -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/21/2007 2:45:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aswad quote: My fun begins when yours ends. That one sums it up pretty well with regard to the sadism bit. I also enjoy other angles, but the point where she's not enjoying herself anymore is the point where it starts to be fun for the sadist in me. As LadyHugs said, it's a different kind of fun. And, as Noah said, it's not one-dimensional. There are many different responses that occur in concert with each other, or as a counterpoint to each other. But the sadism part is pretty clear cut. But the diagnostic criterion are pretty irrelevant, and the DSM IV-TR ones don't care if it's consensual. Health, al-Aswad. That was the point of my original question, if a Sadist's fun starts when the submissive is not enjoying it, then why would a Sadist want to play with a masochist who did enjoy the pain. Or is it a matter of when playing with a masochist, the level of pain that can get inflicted is greater because it takes a higher level for them to no longer enjoy it? heartfelt

Noah -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/21/2007 6:33:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BayouSub quote: MstrssPassion: The sadist is concerned with the sexual pleasure of their "victim" & they do not wish to exclude their pleasure & many sadists regard that pleasure as essential to his/her own satisfaction. I must respectfully disagree. What a true sadist wants is to inflict physical or psychological suffering on his/her victim. Being concerned with the victim's pleasure is inconsistent with a desire to inflict suffering. I'm not an expert on this but I found this on the internet: Diagnostic criteria for 302.84 Sexual Sadism A. Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving acts (real, not simulated) in which the psychological or physical suffering (including humiliation) of the victim is sexually exciting to the person. B. The person has acted on these urges with a nonconsenting person, or the sexual urges or fantasies cause marked distress or interpersonal difficulty. http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/sexsadismTR.htm On another board, a sadist posted: "My fun begins when yours ends." I think this describes the sadist mindset very well. quote: LuckyAlbatross: Reposted: I happen to think actual sadism is incompatible with actual masochism. A sadist wants the other person to feel PAIN, not pleasure. A masochist feels pain AS pleasure. Fluffy sadists however, who want the other person to enjoy the pain, works perfect with a masochist. If a masochist feels pain as pleasure, then pain will not provide the masochist what he/she wants. A masochist seeks suffering. Certainly, pain can be suffering if pain is felt AS pain. Humiliation can provide suffering. Being made to do something you hate to do can also be suffering. Diagnostic criteria for 302.83 Sexual Masochism A. Over a period of at least 6 months, recurrent, intense sexually arousing fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors involving the act (real, not simulated) of being humiliated, beaten, bound, or otherwise made to suffer. B. The fantasies, sexual urges, or behaviors cause clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning. http://www.behavenet.com/capsules/disorders/sexmasochism.htm In summary, in my humble opinion, if you are concerned about your victim's pleasure, you are not an actual sadist. Additionally, if you only desire to experience pain as pleasure and have no desire to suffer, you are not a masochist. I'm Not trying to start a definitional war here but just putting in my 2 cents. Any word can have multiple meanings. "Sadism" does and so does "masochism." The word sadist can be and has been used to refer to a mental disorder. The same is true of the definition you have offered for the word masochist. Masochism can be a word that names an illness, but that isn't usually the sense of the word that people here seem to be talking about. And the same goes for the word sadism. "Cold" can be a word that names an illness, but not everyone who truthfully says "I'm cold" is sick. If you were learning English and unsure of what "cold" meant the first time you heard the word--and went to a list of medical disorders to get your definition instead of consulting a good dictionary or two--you'd probably end up confused. By the way, it looks as though the reference source from which you took those definitions is out of date. As indicated on the page you cite it was published all the way back in 1994, and replaced by another edition in 2000. If I'm not mistaken there have been further revisions since. It might be interesting to have a look at the latest edition of the same source and see if the terms are still being defined the same way. If you are (or if anyone present is) able and decide to do so, I'd be grateful if you would return here to share the results of that research.

Peridot -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/23/2007 8:58:53 AM)
People are taking this shit way too seriously

BayouSub -> RE: Question for the Sadists out there? (12/23/2007 11:47:04 AM)
Peridot: quote: People are taking this shit way too seriously Initially, let me thank the original poster for bring up this interesting issue and for all the persons who have taken the time to post rational responses. It is possible that we "are taking this shit way too seriously" but, hey, its our time to waste and some of us find it enjoyable. Noah, I agree with you that words can have different meanings. However, the meaning of an english word is what is generally accepted by English speakers. My post was in response to MstressPassion who stated (discussing Havelock Ellis): quote: The sadist is concerned with the sexual pleasure of their "victim" & they do not wish to exclude their pleasure & many sadists regard that pleasure as essential to his/her own satisfaction. If we accept this, then the definition of sadism would include a person who wants to give their victim sexual pleasure. Do you think that English speakers generally think that a sadist is interested in giving his/her victims pleasure? In fact, being concerned with a victim's pleasure seems to be the opposite of sadism as I understand it. LuckyAlbatross: quote: Reposted: I happen to think actual sadism is incompatible with actual masochism. A sadist wants the other person to feel PAIN, not pleasure. A masochist feels pain AS pleasure. Fluffy sadists however, who want the other person to enjoy the pain, works perfect with a masochist. I think we are on the same page. You use "fluffy sadists" and I think I would use "quasi sadists" because what they do resembles sadism on the surface but, in reality, is not sadism.

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