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Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in new d... - 12/13/2012 4:52:14 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		There is no "debt ceiling". THEY VOTED FOR THE DEBT. Maybe they just can't add or something?

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RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 5:41:26 AM   
subspaceseven


Posts: 467
Joined: 3/2/2012
Status: offline 		I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..

How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP

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RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 12:18:33 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subspaceseven
I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..
How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP


And in the last Administration, the Dem's pissed, moaned, bitched and fussed about the deficits,. but now that their Party is in the White House...

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RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 12:45:25 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: subspaceseven
I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..
How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP


And in the last Administration, the Dem's pissed, moaned, bitched and fussed about the deficits,. but now that their Party is in the White House...


Yes, going into debt to invade the wrong country in order to help out Iran and Al Queda seemed, well, kinda dumb.

Going into debt to offset a depression is classic and effective keynisian economics.

Debt is a tool, there are wrong ways to use it and correct ways, in this case the Republicans missused it, and the dems are using it correctly.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 12:53:15 PM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: subspaceseven
I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..
How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP


And in the last Administration, the Dem's pissed, moaned, bitched and fussed about the deficits,. but now that their Party is in the White House...

Not even close. From 00 to 06 the dems were told they didn't even need to show up.

Like I've been writing and will continue...there are NO 'fiscal' conservatives in Wash.

The '$6 trillion' vote is revealing in that it would require an annual increase in the debt ceiling.

"Why even have a 'debt ceiling ?' Neither party sticks to it." Former Senator (C-NY) and retired federal judge James Buckley...the last and only member of the conservative party (to my knowledge) elected to the senate.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 12:55:57 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: subspaceseven
I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..
How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP

And in the last Administration, the Dem's pissed, moaned, bitched and fussed about the deficits,. but now that their Party is in the White House...

Yes, going into debt to invade the wrong country in order to help out Iran and Al Queda seemed, well, kinda dumb.


Interestingly enough, neither of those was why we went to the ME. Are you saying that invading Afghanistan was wrong?

quote:

Going into debt to offset a depression is classic and effective keynisian economics.


Um, "effective?" Using government spending to make up for lack of Market demand isn't really smart economics. Much better to let the Market correct and divest itself of the bad investments. That would be Austrian Economic policies.

quote:

Debt is a tool, there are wrong ways to use it and correct ways, in this case the Republicans missused it, and the dems are using it correctly.


Debt absolutely is a tool, but it's use isn't typically a good thing. You become beholden to your creditors, and overspend, leading to more Market failures in the future. Better to let the Market fix itself (no, I'm not calling for zero regulation by government) than to have government "fix" what they broke with "more of the same."


_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 12:58:07 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: subspaceseven
I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..
How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP

And in the last Administration, the Dem's pissed, moaned, bitched and fussed about the deficits,. but now that their Party is in the White House...

Yes, going into debt to invade the wrong country in order to help out Iran and Al Queda seemed, well, kinda dumb.


Interestingly enough, neither of those was why we went to the ME. Are you saying that invading Afghanistan was wrong?

So Hussein had WMDs then, did he?

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(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:02:36 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		I will keep this simple in the hopes you might understand.

Iraq

Freidman has been debunked

Next...

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:06:20 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: subspaceseven
I think that just shows how little people know,,,the money has been spent already, this is just to pay the dam bills, You know how only the GOP House can authorize spending, but it is still the Dems fault..
How during the last Admin, why the GOP only approved the debt what 8-9 times with out once bitching about where the money is coming from.....But NOWWWWWWW they get all worked up....Hmmm who was it who said"Deficits don't matter"??????? Wasn't that the shrine of the GOP

And in the last Administration, the Dem's pissed, moaned, bitched and fussed about the deficits,. but now that their Party is in the White House...

Not even close. From 00 to 06 the dems were told they didn't even need to show up.


That's hilarious.

Senate:
    '99-'01: Dem's held 45 seats.
    '01-'03: Dem's held 50 seats
    '03-'05: Dem's held 48 seats
    '05-'07: Dem's held 44 seats

The worst Senate mix for the Democrats was 44 - 55.

House of Rep's:
    '99-'01: Dem's held 211 seats
    '01-'03: Dem's held 212 seats
    '03-'05: Dem's held 205 seats
    '05-'07: Dem's held 202 seats


Regardless of whether or not the R's told D's to not even show up, there was a need for Democrat votes in the Senate.

quote:

Like I've been writing and will continue...there are NO 'fiscal' conservatives in Wash.


There are a limited few, but, in general, you are absolutely correct, and I'm not happy about it.

quote:

The '$6 trillion' vote is revealing in that it would require an annual increase in the debt ceiling.
"Why even have a 'debt ceiling ?' Neither party sticks to it." Former Senator (C-NY) and retired federal judge James Buckley...the last and only member of the conservative party (to my knowledge) elected to the senate.


What $6T vote? There was no link provided.

(edited because I forgot to put in a "" to end the indent.)

< Message edited by DesideriScuri -- 12/13/2012 1:07:57 PM >

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:09:06 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead
So Hussein had WMDs then, did he?


And here I thought we went into Afghanistan first....

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:11:46 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
I will keep this simple in the hopes you might understand.
Iraq
Freidman has been debunked
Next...


Afghanistan was first (and, didn't we go into debt with that War?).

Friedman debunked?!? LOL! Keyne's has been debunked. Better to follow Hayek, von Mises and Rothbard, IMO.



_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:14:04 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead
So Hussein had WMDs then, did he?


And here I thought we went into Afghanistan first....

No.
That was the UN went into Afghanistan.


_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:17:10 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead
So Hussein had WMDs then, did he?

And here I thought we went into Afghanistan first....

No.
That was the UN went into Afghanistan.



lol.. true enough... but, I do think we took center stage on that one, and it still did something to our deficits, didn't it?

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 1:19:09 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Well yes, but I don't think the chimp took out a bunch of foreign debts to pay for it as he knew that the Congress wouldn't budget it unless he presented it as a fait accompli, did he?

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I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 2:10:52 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		What the fuck has going into Afghanistan (and fucking that up) got to do with invading Iraq? One of the least involved ME countries outside of Iran? Invading Iraq cost trillions, destroyed decades of good will, and seriously fucked up our military.

Anyone ignorant enough to think deficit spending isnt the favored method of republicans has been asleep since reagan. Thus the joke "borrow and spend" for republican budget strategies.

Dems arent saints but Carter and Clinton were saints of fiscal restraint compared with Raygun and Bush.

Much of the debt ascribed to Obama was penned by Bush. In addition, Obama had an actual problem facing,gim, not a manufactured one. Oh, and he actually nailed Bin Laudin.

I am no fan of Obama, weakest of a rather strong field of candidates. Blew the opportunity to break wallstreets stranglehold and end its butchering of this country and the middle class. Much of the money was spent on short term gains without a greater strategic vision. Mcain and that dipshot broad would have us invading Iran and subsidizing the oil industry, etc.

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RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 2:46:34 PM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline 		But but but I thought the republicans were being obstructionists... Make up our fucking minds already!

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RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 2:49:58 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

But but but I thought the republicans were being obstructionists... Make up our fucking minds already!


You are, when you whine and pout because you didnt win the WH.


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Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 6:15:09 PM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael
What the fuck has going into Afghanistan (and fucking that up) got to do with invading Iraq? One of the least involved ME countries outside of Iran? Invading Iraq cost trillions, destroyed decades of good will, and seriously fucked up our military.


And, Afghanistan cost us mere pennies, right? No ill will (decades? really?), and no impact on our military, then? Is that what bullshit you want me to believe?!?

quote:

Anyone ignorant enough to think deficit spending isnt the favored method of republicans has been asleep since reagan. Thus the joke "borrow and spend" for republican budget strategies.


Who said Republicans don't engage in deficit spending? I know I never did. And, trust me, I hate that Republicans haven't been fiscal conservatives. I was completely stunned when Bush claimed that he had to discard capitalist practices to save capitalism (or however he worded it).

quote:

Dems arent saints but Carter and Clinton were saints of fiscal restraint compared with Raygun and Bush.
Much of the debt ascribed to Obama was penned by Bush. In addition, Obama had an actual problem facing,gim, not a manufactured one. Oh, and he actually nailed Bin Laudin.


Really? When? I thought it was the House of Representatives that passed spending bills? Since January 2007, that's been the Democrats, remember? And, don't forget that spending bills can be changed by Congress (including ending funding for Afghanistan/Iraq). Your claim of Obama nailing bin Laden is horseshit, and can just as easily be chalked up to the work done under Bush's Administration. So, don't bring that bullshit.

quote:

I am no fan of Obama, weakest of a rather strong field of candidates. Blew the opportunity to break wallstreets stranglehold and end its butchering of this country and the middle class. Much of the money was spent on short term gains without a greater strategic vision. Mcain and that dipshot broad would have us invading Iran and subsidizing the oil industry, etc.


I was not a fan of McCain/Palin by a long shot. I did cast my vote R, but it was more voting against Obama than it was for McCain. Obama isn't going to disconnect Wall Street from DC. It's simply not going to happen. The Democrats are bought, too.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to SimplyMichael)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 7:59:47 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline 		Wow, your intellect overcomes my patience.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Last year, Republicans voted to add 6 trillion in n... - 12/13/2012 8:00:12 PM   
Edwynn


Posts: 4105
Joined: 10/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Friedman debunked?!? LOL! Keyne's has been debunked. Better to follow Hayek, von Mises and Rothbard, IMO.


There we go. The Republicans finally found themselves to be thoroughly polluted by the ideology of the above via Reagan, as did Thatcher in England, and economic and financial calamity ensued.

But now you want to blame it all on the Democrats and Republicans, right? whose only cause was in service free-marketeerism as advocated by Mises, Hayek and Rothbard. Reagan and Clinton deregulation, almost word-for-word what the three marketeers prescribed. Greenspan was the Randian Mandarin of choice for that job, as he suckered them all in, which is why he never left until he had done the job so thoroughly that he could not have done anymore damage in that cause.

Reaganomics and Rubinomics (Clinton Sec. Treas. Goldman Sachs CEO Robert Rubin) and Greenspan (Ayn Rand acolyte) Randianomics, the economically lethal trio.

The deregulation they advocated and that the Republicans and Democrats were stupid enough to implement has cost well over $4 trillion in outright taxpayer expenses, to date, along with a conservatively estimated $12 trillion hit to aggregate household wealth, still counting regarding both numbers.

Hail Mises, hail Hayek, hail Rothbard.

The most expensive and wealth-destructing idiots since all of post-Medieval history.





< Message edited by Edwynn -- 12/13/2012 9:00:10 PM >

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
Profile   Post #: 20
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