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Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 9:22:42 PM

solitarycrowd

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I recently read the following on another Thread:

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

I don't see that you're submissive. I only see that you want to have your kinks catered to. There's a difference and most dominant women are well aware of that and steer clear of guys who don't actually submit.

It shouldn't be hard to say that you enjoy pampering your woman and have her take the lead in the relationship. That sentence is about relationship dynamics, not about kink. The way you talk about kink is not to lay yours out on the line while expecting her to submit to doing them for you, but by asking about what she really loves sexually, which should then easily transfer into what you really love sexually as well.

If all you want is to have someone do you sexually in the way you want, then that's the point where we recommend paying someone to provide you with the service you desire.

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 9:28:49 PM

littlewonder

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Does he tell you what to do? Is he only submissive to you when you are dominating him? Does he do other things such as clean the dishes, wash the clothes, run errands, give you pedicures and manicures? Is the only time he's submissive is when he orgasms but after that he isn't?

It's simple really and I'm not even a Domme.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 9:30:35 PM

SacredDepravity

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I look for signs of life beyond the end of his penis. Does he talk about family, friends, hobbies, volunteer work, career, ANYTHING besides constant bdsm ramblings? I also look for discussion centering around how they view and practice power exchange, sadism, masochism, etc. I want to see interest in me, my limits, my limitations, and points of view. If I don't see these things, I figure he needs more porn, not a woman whom he might break by not handling with care.

SD

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 9:38:49 PM

JeffBC

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Stop fulfilling them and see what happens? The problem with answering your question is that for me it's pretty critical to understand the motives before even trying to control in any serious way. If ypu are already controlling without understanding the motives it looks like trying to land a 747 without understanding all those knobs and lights on the instrument panel.

The other problem I have here is that the question implies a lack of trust in your sub which raises a raft of much more urgent questions in my head. Otherwise you'd just ask the sub which is my go to strategy when I want to understand Carol.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 9:43:11 PM

SylvereApLeanan

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

How can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

quote:

ORIGINAL: SacredDepravity

I look for signs of life beyond the end of his penis.

I nominate this exchange for Sunny Quote of the Day!

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 10:02:40 PM

RedMagic1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd
how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

Why not both?

Not meant as a snarky answer. Stop feeding even the most obedient dog, and it will either leave or eat you.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 10:27:00 PM

TheBoyDownBelow

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

Ever since I started to explore my kinky side, there isn't a day that I don't think about this exact situation. To throw you an additional curve-ball, I give you a third option. For example body worship, when he does it in devotion just to please you. That isn't exactly submission either. My question is, does it really matter, as long as he follows her wishes? Does only the dominant have to be one who gets anything from such an activity? Sorry I am new to this, and have absolute no experience. But the way I see it, the motivation can shift from activity to activity. IMHO as long as both are happy with each other, there shouldn't be any insisting that it has to be submission in order to be true. Am I wrong? Good topic and am looking for some more answers for myself!

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/29/2012 10:35:34 PM

JeffBC

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I agree with you that outcome is most important. No matter what the subs motives are if the Dom has perfect control then the sub will be perfect. I just doubt the ability to get any real control without already knowing the answer to the question.

Oh... And I think it's GREAT when carol wins also. I command her to hug me all the time and I'm not disappointed that she enjoys it too. Nor do I worry my head over the fact that she doesn't submit for some mystical BDSM reason. She does it because she loves me. That bitch!

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 1:39:36 AM

plesto

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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder

Does he tell you what to do? Is he only submissive to you when you are dominating him? Does he do other things such as clean the dishes, wash the clothes, run errands, give you pedicures and manicures? Is the only time he's submissive is when he orgasms but after that he isn't?

The only problem I can find with some of those criteria is if you have a service orientated sub. I could be wrong as its not an area I have great knowledge or experience in.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 4:41:28 AM

stellauk

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

In any given situation, who's thoughts and feelings get priority (or take precedence) and are considered first and foremost?

In a good D/s relationship both sides work as a team to fulfil the needs and wants of both, but the answer to who is really in control and dominant can be easily worked out usually by answering the above question.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 6:17:02 AM

DarkSteven

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd
Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

I don't understand the point of the question. If you as a Domme are Dom outside the bedroom and you're getting YOUR kinky fetishes fulfilled, and your sub is happy, who cares what box the relationship fits in?

If the relationship contains both service oriented submission and bedroom submission, and you're worried about which one is more important to him and whether he's only doing one of them to satisfy his desire for the other... you're thinking too much.

You as the Domme are in charge. It's your responsibility to ensure that both parties are fulfilled. If he'd rather do A than B, so be it - he'll still do B if you want it.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 6:56:02 AM

Kana

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

I recently read the following on another Thread:

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

I don't see that you're submissive. I only see that you want to have your kinks catered to. There's a difference and most dominant women are well aware of that and steer clear of guys who don't actually submit.

It shouldn't be hard to say that you enjoy pampering your woman and have her take the lead in the relationship. That sentence is about relationship dynamics, not about kink. The way you talk about kink is not to lay yours out on the line while expecting her to submit to doing them for you, but by asking about what she really loves sexually, which should then easily transfer into what you really love sexually as well.

If all you want is to have someone do you sexually in the way you want, then that's the point where we recommend paying someone to provide you with the service you desire.

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

Have him do things he don't wanna-often.
Not just that, but learn to twist him until your wants/desires become his.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 8:18:50 AM

evesgrden

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Yes.

People end relationships because they're not getting what they want and need out of them.

Not rocket science.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 8:38:17 AM

DonRosti

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 9:15:22 AM

RumpusParable

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

I recently read the following on another Thread:

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

I don't see that you're submissive. I only see that you want to have your kinks catered to. There's a difference and most dominant women are well aware of that and steer clear of guys who don't actually submit.

It shouldn't be hard to say that you enjoy pampering your woman and have her take the lead in the relationship. That sentence is about relationship dynamics, not about kink. The way you talk about kink is not to lay yours out on the line while expecting her to submit to doing them for you, but by asking about what she really loves sexually, which should then easily transfer into what you really love sexually as well.

If all you want is to have someone do you sexually in the way you want, then that's the point where we recommend paying someone to provide you with the service you desire.

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

Well, IME, the key clue is if they actually talk to me like a person with my own interests and desires and such or not.

Those who want to honestly submit tend to want to know how I'll treat them (as in, not just "how often will you spank my ass all nice and red until I cry and cry my mistress?"), what I'm looking for in a relationship, what I'm like as a person.

They basically approach it as "are we a match?" and not as "how will you get me off?".

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 9:17:19 AM

RumpusParable

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Oops, sorry, I answered in a "we're just starting to talk and I'm weeding out folks" way, not in a "we're already in a relationship" way. So here goes:

We do things other than doing or talking about his fantasies. He doesn't try to angle everything back to them or push me to fulfill them constantly. They are a *part* of our interactions, not the focus.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 10:37:33 AM

JeffBC

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stellauk
In any given situation, who's thoughts and feelings get priority (or take precedence) and are considered first and foremost?

In a good D/s relationship both sides work as a team to fulfil the needs and wants of both, but the answer to who is really in control and dominant can be easily worked out usually by answering the above question.

*chuckles* I think that is probably more or less correct although it sure doesn't apply to Carol and I. Happily, I'm none to worried about "who is really in control".

Actually, that'd put Carol in control. Each of us strongly favors giving to the other rather than taking for ourselves. But.. you know... I'm in the decision making chair which means HER thoughts & feelings take precedence.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 11:05:40 AM

DesFIP

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Don't have sex right away, date instead. Like normal people.

Don't just talk about sex either. Talk about your life and what a miserable day you had with a tire going flat in the rain. If he wants to hear about your real life, and is sincerely sympathetic then he wants more than just a fetish delivery system. If he tries to switch the conversation back to you kicking him in the balls, then he isn't someone capable of having a relationship.

This isn't rocket science. It's normal relationship skills.

Oh and if you got into the relationship before discovering this, then you have put the cart before the horse. Stop doing that.

< Message edited by DesFIP -- 12/30/2012 11:06:57 AM >

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 12:37:26 PM

Nakhla

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

I think this might be a difficult one to figure out for a lot of submissives, even ones entirely honest about their intent, as for a lot of us dominance is in and of itself enjoyable and can make what's ordered enjoyable even if it wasn't in our heads to begin with. We may "get off" on pleasing even if we're not centered on one specific act, and through serving someone else be serving our personal needs simultaneously.

I enjoy someone I'm intimate with taking the lead in and out of the bedroom, but does that mean when they do I'm somehow using them to fulfill my needs? Well, maybe I am, but if his needs are being satisfied too, perhaps then we're just in some iniquitous loop of mutual fulfillment.

For that matter, I don't see bedroom-only submissives as being less sincere for it. If someone's submissive in the bedroom only, it doesn't mean they can't be a fantastic all-round partner in life outside it. I think too often in the BDSM scene there is a false dichotomy of constant submission equals sincerely seeking long-term; bedroom submission equals looking for a kinky hook-up, and that's something not reflected in the real-time relations I've encountered. Someone can have submission as fetish only and sincerely care how your day at work went today.

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RE: Is he a sub or just looking for fetish delivery? - 12/30/2012 2:36:01 PM

seekingreality

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quote:

ORIGINAL: solitarycrowd

I recently read the following on another Thread:

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

I don't see that you're submissive. I only see that you want to have your kinks catered to. There's a difference and most dominant women are well aware of that and steer clear of guys who don't actually submit.

It shouldn't be hard to say that you enjoy pampering your woman and have her take the lead in the relationship. That sentence is about relationship dynamics, not about kink. The way you talk about kink is not to lay yours out on the line while expecting her to submit to doing them for you, but by asking about what she really loves sexually, which should then easily transfer into what you really love sexually as well.

If all you want is to have someone do you sexually in the way you want, then that's the point where we recommend paying someone to provide you with the service you desire.

I think this is a great question. Assuming you are in a real-time relationship, not online or searching for a date, how can you tell if your sub is really wanting to be submissive to you, or if he really just wants his kinky fetishes fulfilled?

I think that's pretty easy: Just be real. Engage with the submission as a real person and don't focus on kinky stuff. When you talk about BDSM, clearly state what you're looking for and ask him to do the same thing. If you take things slowly and don't try to play some type of role or character, people will reveal who they are. Basically, I don't think it's much different than seeking a vanilla relationship.

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