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RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 7:01:03 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
Id love to see a system where the brightest thinkers of either party get elected, and work together for the good of the nation.

I gather that you have no idea how a democracy functions.

There are several aspects to a parliament.

One of those is that there are conflicting interests - and hence corruption - and that results in the worst possible compromise solution.

And another one is that all parties (A1,A2,A3,..,Awhatever) are each infiltrated by secret interest groups X1 (and maybe also X2 and X3) that have their own secret agenda's, so that actually it does not matter what party is voted into power for the secret interest group will be voted into power in all cases.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
Too much of World Politics seems to be made up of people on the take and with only their own interests at heart.

Quite.

And what to do about that?

_____________________________

"I tend to pay attention when Rule speaks" - Aswad

"You are sweet, kind, and ever so smart, Rule. You ALWAYS stretch my mind and make me think further than I might have on my own" - Duskypearls

Si vis pacem, para bellum.

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 7:11:44 AM   
SadistDave


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This might seem bad, but there have been more polarized, argumentative, gerrymandering Congresses than the one we have now.

This is what happens when you have a disfunctional Congress.

As far as third parties are concerned, I'd settle for Democrats who don't try to destroy the Constitution, or Republicans who don't try to legislate based on their religious beliefs. Anything else is just a mirror
of one or the other.

-SD-

< Message edited by SadistDave -- 2/19/2013 7:12:37 AM >


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To whom it may concern: Just because someone is in a position of authority they do not get to make up their own facts. In spite of what some people here (who shall remain nameless) want to claim, someone over the age of 18 is NOT a fucking minor!

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Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 7:20:55 AM   
mnottertail


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In the cases with actual real demonstrable destroying of constitutions, it has been a republican endeavor.



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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 7:36:03 AM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
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Jesus....... after bush/dick urinated on our Constitution.....there must be a lot of shame/embarrassment........hence the lame claim....

Using words like distroy...lol....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIFqYVAOosM


The con`s abuse of our language is as just as vile as their abuse of our Constitution.

< Message edited by Owner59 -- 2/19/2013 7:39:50 AM >


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Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 10:42:10 AM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53
Id love to see a system where the brightest thinkers of either party get elected, and work together for the good of the nation.

I gather that you have no idea how a democracy functions.

Neither do you, if you believe that your laughable excuse for a Republic is a Democracy.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 12:04:57 PM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
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My country is a republic?

_____________________________

"I tend to pay attention when Rule speaks" - Aswad

"You are sweet, kind, and ever so smart, Rule. You ALWAYS stretch my mind and make me think further than I might have on my own" - Duskypearls

Si vis pacem, para bellum.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 6:00:53 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
I find it really interesting that no foaming at the mouth liberals have arrived, to tell us what guiding principles they would look for in a party to support. Or, and this would be even more interesting, what policies of the mainstream Democrats they would wish to distance themselves from, given the opportunity to do so.

No pacifists, who would want to ban the military? No greens, out to eliminate the internal combustion engine? Where are all the losers, demanding the government should give everyone a job and a home? Where are the Occupist's, insisting there should be 100% taxation on any income over a certain amount?

Surely they aren't ALL waiting for the answers to be given them by Rachel Maddow, or an email from whatever the Obama administration is calling their propaganda machine this week?

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 6:34:31 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

I find it really interesting that no foaming at the mouth liberals have arrived, to tell us what guiding principles they would look for in a party to support. Or, and this would be even more interesting, what policies of the mainstream Democrats they would wish to distance themselves from, given the opportunity to do so.

No pacifists, who would want to ban the military? No greens, out to eliminate the internal combustion engine? Where are all the losers, demanding the government should give everyone a job and a home? Where are the Occupist's, insisting there should be 100% taxation on any income over a certain amount?

Surely they aren't ALL waiting for the answers to be given them by Rachel Maddow, or an email from whatever the Obama administration is calling their propaganda machine this week?



Uh, I consider myself a liberal, even though I like guns, believe in the 2nd amendment, capital punishment and no import tariffs on scotch and Irish whiskey...

It is my opinion, that the people who run for office in both parties are the most extreme examples of terminally stupid the country has ever produced. Neither side will compromise, hell I doubt seriously they would agree that the sky is blue.

Instead of party line career politicians, we need common people with more than an small amount of common sense, and have the ability to compromise on issues that this country needs to get out of the hole it is in.

Either that or we make Lucylastic ruler for life, if we can get her to move from Canada.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 7:45:53 PM   
TheHeretic


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Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
Funny you should bring up guns, JLF. I've been having a ball lately, with my uncle the yellow-dog Dem. Every time he's gotten started on the Republicans this or that, I'll just remind him that he likes them right now. He'll ask why he would like any (5-minute stream of obscenities deleted) Republicans, and I'll say "guns." He says, "fuck," and changes to another topic.



_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 7:59:14 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline
In all honesty, I am slowly losing faith in both parties right now.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 9:12:12 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

In all honesty, I am slowly losing faith in both parties right now.



Really? Now? Slowly? I only hang on the R side because I figure the Democrats are a little bit more dangerous, and that, in the present structure, 3rd parties are useless kook gardens.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/19/2013 10:53:27 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

In all honesty, I am slowly losing faith in both parties right now.



Really? Now? Slowly? I only hang on the R side because I figure the Democrats are a little bit more dangerous, and that, in the present structure, 3rd parties are useless kook gardens.


It seems to boil down to a choice of right wing religious fanatics, or left wing liberal nut jobs who have no idea what is going on in the real world.

Green technology, great all for it, but be realistic, solar technology is no where near efficient to solve the power needs, wind technology on the large scale is an eyesore, and if you want to go to biofuels, quite paying farmers to not plant crops.

On the right side, yes I want to keep my guns, but I want somebody to come up with an effective way of taking them from criminals, I support nuclear energy but someone come up with a plan to deal with the waste, and by all means, put more than a token amount into Fusion research.

For both sides, get American working again!! Bring jobs back to the states. Do something to bring the standards of education back to, if not number one, at least in the top five.
Quit buying stuff for the military they dont want. And stop trying to be the world policeman. It is legal to have US troops to patrol the border, do it. I am sick and tired of tax dollars being used to support illegals with medicaid, food stamps, and jobs.

As for food stamps and welfare, do something to get those that can work to work. I see people at the food stamp office and food pantries driving 2010 to 2012 cars, and other people driving cars that are 10 or more years old.

If they are so poor that they need food stamps and to go to food pantries, how in the hell can they afford new cars and the latest smart phone?

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/20/2013 6:14:18 AM   
DesideriScuri


Posts: 12225
Joined: 1/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic
I find it really interesting that no foaming at the mouth liberals have arrived, to tell us what guiding principles they would look for in a party to support. Or, and this would be even more interesting, what policies of the mainstream Democrats they would wish to distance themselves from, given the opportunity to do so.
No pacifists, who would want to ban the military? No greens, out to eliminate the internal combustion engine? Where are all the losers, demanding the government should give everyone a job and a home? Where are the Occupist's, insisting there should be 100% taxation on any income over a certain amount?
Surely they aren't ALL waiting for the answers to be given them by Rachel Maddow, or an email from whatever the Obama administration is calling their propaganda machine this week?

Uh, I consider myself a liberal, even though I like guns, believe in the 2nd amendment, capital punishment and no import tariffs on scotch and Irish whiskey...
It is my opinion, that the people who run for office in both parties are the most extreme examples of terminally stupid the country has ever produced. Neither side will compromise, hell I doubt seriously they would agree that the sky is blue.
Instead of party line career politicians, we need common people with more than an small amount of common sense, and have the ability to compromise on issues that this country needs to get out of the hole it is in.
Either that or we make Lucylastic ruler for life, if we can get her to move from Canada.


To be fair, jlf, Rich did say "foaming at the mouth liberal." You do not fall into that category.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961
...
Green technology, great all for it, but be realistic, solar technology is no where near efficient to solve the power needs, wind technology on the large scale is an eyesore, and if you want to go to biofuels, quite paying farmers to not plant crops.


Quit paying people to not plant crops, period. Quit paying people to plant crops. I've heard it said that if we were to cover our roofs with solar power, we would have enough to power everything. I, personally, find that hard to believe considering the great variance in insolation in the US and that our houses have not been built, in general, with the optimal orientation for solar panel efficiency. If everyone took a personal responsibility in reducing our power grid needs (set up our own panels/turbines), it would help.

quote:

On the right side, yes I want to keep my guns, but I want somebody to come up with an effective way of taking them from criminals, I support nuclear energy but someone come up with a plan to deal with the waste, and by all means, put more than a token amount into Fusion research.


There has to be something that can be done with spent fuel rods. They are still radioactive. The has to be something that can be done with that.

quote:

For both sides, get American working again!! Bring jobs back to the states. Do something to bring the standards of education back to, if not number one, at least in the top five.
Quit buying stuff for the military they dont want. And stop trying to be the world policeman. It is legal to have US troops to patrol the border, do it. I am sick and tired of tax dollars being used to support illegals with medicaid, food stamps, and jobs.


See now? Even though you self-label as a liberal and I self-label as a conservative, we are pretty much completely in line with each other here.

quote:

As for food stamps and welfare, do something to get those that can work to work. I see people at the food stamp office and food pantries driving 2010 to 2012 cars, and other people driving cars that are 10 or more years old.
If they are so poor that they need food stamps and to go to food pantries, how in the hell can they afford new cars and the latest smart phone?


I support a work-requirement for welfare recipients that can work. Obviously, those receiving welfare because they can not work should not be required to work, but I do believe there has to be something the taxpayers get for supporting those who have the physical capacity to work, but don't. In my area, the Unions would prevent them from doing Union jobs because it would be taking away the work opportunity from a Union worker. There was unrest within the local Public Union when the City was considering allowing private citizens to volunteer to take care of the landscaping upkeep at various parks and flower areas. The City wasn't going to do it because it didn't have the money in the budget. Locals offered to take care of it. City considered it and the Union threw a hissy fit. It was nuts.

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/20/2013 6:19:37 AM   
Hillwilliam


Posts: 19394
Joined: 8/27/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

In all honesty, I am slowly losing faith in both parties right now.



Really? Now? Slowly? I only hang on the R side because I figure the Democrats are a little bit more dangerous, and that, in the present structure, 3rd parties are useless kook gardens.

I got news for ya. The 2 main parties are useless kook gardens.


_____________________________

Kinkier than a cheap garden hose.

Whoever said "Religion is the opiate of the masses" never heard Right Wing talk radio.

Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/20/2013 6:24:17 AM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

In all honesty, I am slowly losing faith in both parties right now.



Really? Now? Slowly? I only hang on the R side because I figure the Democrats are a little bit more dangerous, and that, in the present structure, 3rd parties are useless kook gardens.

I got news for ya. The 2 main parties are useless kook gardens.



With power, so we're kinda stuck.


_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to Hillwilliam)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Parties for proportional representation - 2/20/2013 8:27:55 PM   
GotSteel


Posts: 5871
Joined: 2/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SadistDave
This might seem bad, but there have been more polarized, argumentative, gerrymandering Congresses than the one we have now.

This is what happens when you have a disfunctional Congress.


Considering that we had a civil war not too long after, looking back at that period of history fills me with foreboding.

(in reply to SadistDave)
Profile   Post #: 76
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