RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 8:55:39 AM)

Its good to be an original!



BamaD -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:07:08 AM)

no you aren't



tazzygirl -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:31:09 AM)

tsk tsk.. dont be jealous!



Nosathro -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:31:48 AM)

What is known is the Prosecution said she was not in a Hospital, this was in response to O'Mara asking for her medical records. This issue is concerning her whereabouts the day of Martin funeral not the night of the shooting. Witness 8 did not say herself she lied. there is nothing about the conversation she had with Martin the night of the shooting. The defense wanted Judge Debra Nelson to question prosecutors about how they learned that this claim was not true, but Nelson refused. How this effects the trial is anybody guess.



farglebargle -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:41:04 AM)

I'm thinking that since the defense is trying to make a mountain out of the IRRELEVANT actions of a witness OUTSIDE of any context of the trial or her relevant testimony, and that they passed on any prior hearings, that the defense is really scared that since Zimmerman is in fact guilty, that they won't be able to get him off.

That "included lesser manslaughter" offense is what is going to send him up for a long time. Yeah, you didn't *plan* on killing him, but, you killed him, and legally, you didn't have any right to kill him, since it's your own mischief which caused the entire incident. Tough Shit, Convict.



TheRyan7 -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:41:31 AM)

As long as theres media and the likes of Nancy Grace. High profile cases will always be pre judged guilty
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam
I dunno, K. If they had deposed her, they would know more about her. According to the article, they don't even know her age. I'd say that would be part of a deposition. (DOB, legal address and other vital statistics)

I don't know either, of course, but it was the Martin family's attorney who said that the witness was 16 years old. If she was asked and confirmed that under oath, it will be yet another black mark against her credibility. People have been prejudging this case from the very start. I hope we're not going to go there again.

K.




farglebargle -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:42:55 AM)

Comparing the XYZ axes of the cellphones is going to be great, too. "Who was where" is pretty clear.

Anyone own a FitBug? Like that.




Powergamz1 -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:48:59 AM)

When you give a sworn statement to law enforcement and sign it, it is effectively the same as sworn testimony in court.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Maybe I'm being nitpicky but I don't think she has given any testimony in court yet.

In fact, from your article "Police said that as of that point they had not interviewed her."

Wouldn't this mean she hasn't been sworn in?
It's kinda tough to lie under oath if one hasn't been sworn in as a witness or even been interviewed by the police

That's some really crappy and ignorant reporting..

As for the phone call, there should be a record.




Kirata -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:50:06 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I'm thinking that since the defense is trying to make a mountain out of the IRRELEVANT actions of a witness

Another vote for lying under oath being irrelevant. Fucking amazing.

K.



Powergamz1 -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 9:51:00 AM)

Think that all you want. In the real world, you are utterly wrong on every count. If the prosecution had the case you wished they had, they wouldn't be playing these games.
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I'm thinking that since the defense is trying to make a mountain out of the IRRELEVANT actions of a witness OUTSIDE of any context of the trial or her relevant testimony, and that they passed on any prior hearings, that the defense is really scared that since Zimmerman is in fact guilty, that they won't be able to get him off.

That "included lesser manslaughter" offense is what is going to send him up for a long time. Yeah, you didn't *plan* on killing him, but, you killed him, and legally, you didn't have any right to kill him, since it's your own mischief which caused the entire incident. Tough Shit, Convict.




Owner59 -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 10:01:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam


quote:

ORIGINAL: RacerJim


quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59

Obviously.......Zimmy getting caught lying under oath has his sycophants grasping and hoping for something similar......Ha ha....[:D]


If/when both sides get caught lying under oath the law, innocent until proven guilty, favors the Defendant......HA HA

Are you saying it's OK for someone to lie under oath and get away with killing someone because a witness on the other side lied?

Nope. Just saying what the law says. Of course, some might consider it payback for OJ lying under oath and getting away with murdering two people.

Oh really.......a lawyer now?[sm=rofl.gif]


Show us the case law .....[:D]



Hillwilliam -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 10:05:34 AM)

Tis true but did you read the article?

The salient points in the article were the headline screaming "Witness lied under oath"
Then below that was "Police said that as of that point they had not interviewed her."
She MAY have been deposed by an attorney but the article didn't say so but there is no way she could have given a sworn statement to LE if they have not even talked to her.

That was my point about the quality of reporting.

If I were a HS English teacher and this was an article for the school paper, I'd have given it a C- because the headline wasn't supported by the text of the article.

The authors were supposedly professionals.[8|]


quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

When you give a sworn statement to law enforcement and sign it, it is effectively the same as sworn testimony in court.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Maybe I'm being nitpicky but I don't think she has given any testimony in court yet.

In fact, from your article "Police said that as of that point they had not interviewed her."

Wouldn't this mean she hasn't been sworn in?
It's kinda tough to lie under oath if one hasn't been sworn in as a witness or even been interviewed by the police

That's some really crappy and ignorant reporting..

As for the phone call, there should be a record.






BamaD -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 11:10:32 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

tsk tsk.. dont be jealous!

not in the least



tazzygirl -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 11:23:07 AM)

Im fabulous and I know it.

Dont be a hater [8D]



farglebargle -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 11:40:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Think that all you want. In the real world, you are utterly wrong on every count. If the prosecution had the case you wished they had, they wouldn't be playing these games.
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I'm thinking that since the defense is trying to make a mountain out of the IRRELEVANT actions of a witness OUTSIDE of any context of the trial or her relevant testimony, and that they passed on any prior hearings, that the defense is really scared that since Zimmerman is in fact guilty, that they won't be able to get him off.

That "included lesser manslaughter" offense is what is going to send him up for a long time. Yeah, you didn't *plan* on killing him, but, you killed him, and legally, you didn't have any right to kill him, since it's your own mischief which caused the entire incident. Tough Shit, Convict.




You're making the mistake of thinking that if the defense gets this witness impeached, that the prosecution has no case left.

This is, of course, incorrect. Since it's not about Stand Your Ground, we're back to "Zimmerman caused the entire incident, and he needs to now prove that he didn't try to run first after provoking Martin into trying to ( and failing ) to defend his own life"

Good luck with that.



Raiikun -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 11:44:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Maybe I'm being nitpicky but I don't think she has given any testimony in court yet.



My understanding is that she gave sworn statement(s).



Yes. On April 2nd, W8 was interviewed by Bernie de la Rionda, this statement was under oath. In it, she was asked if she missed the wake due to going to the hospital, and she said "Yeah", that she had high blood pressure.

The Defense requested a subpoena for her medical records, and was told by the Prosecution there would be none, because she didn't go to the hospital.

Thus she lied under oath.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=V7aVLbKXZnQ

Also in other news, ABC released a segment of it's recording with W8, which reveals a 3rd version of her testimony of that night:

http://diwataman.wordpress.com/2013/03/07/abc-released-some-of-its-recording-of-the-crump-deedee-interview/



Raiikun -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 11:48:56 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

This is, of course, incorrect. Since it's not about Stand Your Ground, we're back to "Zimmerman caused the entire incident, and he needs to now prove that he didn't try to run first after provoking Martin into trying to ( and failing ) to defend his own life"



1) There's still no proof that George is the aggressor.
2) George doesn't have to prove anything. The Defense only requires reasonable doubt.
3) Florida precedent is that even staggering from a blow is sufficient to claim that you have no reasonable ability to escape, even if George was the aggressor, so, that the forensics are consistent with Trayvon being on top of George at the moment the shot was fired meets that criteria.



farglebargle -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 11:53:24 AM)

Do you think people will forget how Zimmerman and his wife lied about all that money because this girl lied about being too fucking overwhelmed to go to the funeral of her boyfriend who she heard get murdered?

I don't. See, there's the whole issue of CONTEXT. And the CONTEXT of lying about your finances DURING YOUR TRIAL and sitting there while your lawyer lies for you and not correct him, really puts her being too freaked out to go to the funeral in the proper light.

Again, the more the scream about this trivial matter, the more it shows that there really is no defense for Zimmerman's choice to go after Martin.

Pretty much, once Zimmerman got out of his car to track down Martin, he caused the whole incident. ANYONE being chased at night by a stranger has a duty to defend themselves. There is no crime in trying to defend yourself from someone who might very well want to lynch you. And NOW I'm going to hear about how there's no racists in the south and blacks have NOTHING to fear in the matter of violence like that.

And I'll point to the gay black man found dead in the south last week.

They dragged him behind the car, right? And people will suggest that Martin wouldn't have any cause to fear for his life after seeing Zimmerman following him in his car, and then exiting his car to track him down?

Facsinating.



Raiikun -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 12:00:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Do you think people will forget how Zimmerman and his wife lied about all that money because this girl lied about being too fucking overwhelmed to go to the funeral of her boyfriend who she heard get murdered?



George didn't even testify on that account, so you'd be hard pressed to point out a lie that he himself gave. As it turns out though, George did in fact tell his attorney about the funds prior to the bond hearing, and tried to turn it over (was rejected by paypal due to being a payment larger than 10k), so there's a very reasonable possibility it was a misunderstanding between George and his attorney. So, no proof of a lie there.

quote:

Pretty much, once Zimmerman got out of his car to track down Martin, he caused the whole incident.


In Florida, getting out of a vehicle to report on someone's location to the police is not sufficient to make you the aggressor. Especially since evidence shows he had ceased following long before Trayvon's attack on George.

Florida case law says that to be the aggressor requires an act contemporaneous with the use of force against him...nothing on that NEN call was contemporaneous with Trayvon's attack on George. The State needed more, which it kinda sorta had with W8...except she had multiple, contradicting versions of her story, and has lied under oath.

So, there's really nothing legally that demonstrates George is the aggressor.



inkyblacknight -> RE: Witness lied under oath in Trayvon Martin case (3/7/2013 12:34:45 PM)

Maybe I'm missing something but seriously, we're saying a black kid attacked a grown white man because the grown white man was following him, in the dark, which is how people get attacked, and he had right to be fearful of being attacked by a white man seeing as he was black, and white people are the major racists in the world.

As a person of the brown persuasion, I don't excuse Trayvon potentially having attacked George, but I understand where he might have come from. If a white person followed me in the dark, in any part of town, I would be scared out of my wits and would definitely be ready to defend myself at any perceived threat.

I can't wait for the white people to come out of the woodwork just to say "All white people aren't like that!" and "YOU'RE being racist against white people!" We're all splitting hairs about legality and trying to deny the fact that Zimmerman shot a teenage boy because he was afraid he would be attacked for following someone in the dark. He was doing something that is extremely threatening to a person of color, or any minority, at that, and then was surprised when the teenage boy preemptively defended himself. That's what this all sounds like, to me. "Well he wasn't TECHNICALLY the aggressor, so he wasn't actually being threatening lol" doesn't cut it. Racism plays a huge factor here, which I think no one wants to talk about.

I don't think half the people on this forum understand how frightening it is to be walking down a dark street, and having someone of privilege following you within a couple feet, or inches, in some cases. If Zimmerman was so close that Martin even had the proximity to turn and tussle with him, he was probably far too close to be innocently following someone.



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