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RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 8:01:14 AM

JeffBC

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Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cordeliasub
I can understand it, and I am speaking as someone who could stand to lose some weight. We can argue all we want....but people who are past a certain level of obesity and heavy smokers, etc ARE at a higher risk for certain diseases and complications.

I agree... sort of. Yes, certain groups are at a higher risk (and I'm not in any of them right now that I know of). But this sort of thing makes me hugely glad I moved myself and Carol to Canada. The whole point of insurance is to spread risk. If they are no longer doing so then what they are doing is simply charging you a premium for nothing. What a crock.

_____________________________

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(in reply to cordeliasub)

Post #: 21

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 8:38:42 AM

Powergamz1

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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Full price is full price. Giving discounts is optional.

If people want a senior citizen's or a military veteran's discount in a store or restaurant that offers such, they can have it. All they have to do is join the discounted group.

If people want a safe driver's discount or a driver's ed discount from their auto insurer, they can have it, same method.

On health insurance, if people want a non-smoker's discount, they can have it. If people want a healthy lifestyle discount, they can earn it.

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(in reply to JeffBC)

Post #: 22

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 10:31:38 AM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweets1966

At my company they have recently given a discount to non smokers. They so give a bonus on increments of $50 for having a physical, your spouse having a physical, participating in health related events such as a walking team and a health fair. They have let it be known this is a precursor to them charging more eventually if your BMI is out of range. It is becoming a fairly common thing. They already so it on the state level here and at a local hospital.
Live healthy or pay more. *shrugs*

Recently I read an article about a school that started sending home letters to parents of children with high BMIs'. The article was about a young boy (12 or under) who was active in sports, and based on the video of him, I wouldn't consider him overweight at all. Yet the school sent home a letter saying his BMI indicated he was obese. That's the problem with all those "standards" like BMI, and the insurance weight charts; every person is different, and none of them take into account muscle mass. This means that the tests, when used across the board are kind of meaningless.

The boy in the article was certainly not obese, so his BMI was ridiculous and should be ignored. My BMI is not good, but yes, I am overweight, however, I didn't need to check my BMI to figure that out.

(in reply to sweets1966)

Post #: 23

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 10:35:07 AM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: cordeliasub

I can understand it, and I am speaking as someone who could stand to lose some weight. We can argue all we want....but people who are past a certain level of obesity and heavy smokers, etc ARE at a higher risk for certain diseases and complications. That is a fact. So if a company wants to give people an incentive to get healthy or stay healthy I don't see a problem. If the place where I work did that, I would bet it would be recommended that I make some lifestyle changes. And ya know, the recommendations would be on target. it's the same reason the insurance is higher on a sports car than a sedan. Where the risk is greater, the cost is greater.

(Now I regret eating that donut earlier...... )

The problem is that simply meeting with some health counselor really isn't going to do much for most people. After all, most of us know what we should be doing, and we don't need some "health professional" to tell us. The reason I used the quotes is because most of these "professionals" have little medical training.

Now if the companies REALLY want to offer incentives to "high risk" people, they should cover the costs of dietitians, programs like Weight Watchers, gym memberships, smoking cessation medication (not all do), etc. to actually provide those people with the necessary tools to get where the insurance company wants them. Do they do this? Some may, but most don't.

(in reply to cordeliasub)

Post #: 24

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 10:38:10 AM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Full price is full price. Giving discounts is optional.

If people want a senior citizen's or a military veteran's discount in a store or restaurant that offers such, they can have it. All they have to do is join the discounted group.

If people want a safe driver's discount or a driver's ed discount from their auto insurer, they can have it, same method.

On health insurance, if people want a non-smoker's discount, they can have it. If people want a healthy lifestyle discount, they can earn it.

A discount is lowering the price for those who participate in the group, not raising the price for those who don't.

It's like the supermarket and pharmacy chains with savings cards. They have specials for the people who have the cards, they don't say, "here is the price, but if you don't have a card, we are going to make you pay 10% more." Unless of course, you are going to BJ's, Costco, etc. where you can shop there without a membership but pay more.

(in reply to Powergamz1)

Post #: 25

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 12:06:09 PM

Powergamz1

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
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It has been a while since I checked, but unlike groceries, insurance premiums are set by the governmental regulatory agencies, so no one is raising the price above the maximum allowed by law and charging smokers etc. more than the full price.
They pay the higher rate because they don't get the discounted one.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LafayetteLady

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powergamz1

Full price is full price. Giving discounts is optional.

If people want a senior citizen's or a military veteran's discount in a store or restaurant that offers such, they can have it. All they have to do is join the discounted group.

If people want a safe driver's discount or a driver's ed discount from their auto insurer, they can have it, same method.

On health insurance, if people want a non-smoker's discount, they can have it. If people want a healthy lifestyle discount, they can earn it.

A discount is lowering the price for those who participate in the group, not raising the price for those who don't.

It's like the supermarket and pharmacy chains with savings cards. They have specials for the people who have the cards, they don't say, "here is the price, but if you don't have a card, we are going to make you pay 10% more." Unless of course, you are going to BJ's, Costco, etc. where you can shop there without a membership but pay more.

_____________________________

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" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 26

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 12:32:42 PM

Muttling

Posts: 1612
Joined: 9/30/2007
Status: offline

It's all about capitalism folks. If you have ANY health issue that will cost more for the insurance company, they will pass it down and companies can't hire you.

Think I'm lying or exaggerating???? Try me. I'm a sever juvenile diabetic and have been since 1985, I'm an expensive health insurance issue. I've had small businesses who wanted to hire me for my engineering expertise (which includes a professional engineer's license in 5 states and professional geologist's license in 1 state.) They couldn't because my health issues which are totally genetic and are in exceptional control would double the health insurance rates for their employees after 1 year.

Health care is ONLY for the healthy in the U.S. of A. If you are one of us who is unfortunate enough to have a chronic medical issue that requires regular treatment, you job prospects will be limited and don't even think about trying to be an entrepreneur.

(in reply to cordeliasub)

Post #: 27

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 12:33:17 PM

FunCouple5280

Posts: 559
Joined: 10/30/2012
Status: offline

really, everyone whines about the cost of health insurance, then they whine about a program to lower the cost???? Gotta decide whether you want your cake, or eat your cake.

(in reply to Powergamz1)

Post #: 28

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 1:27:37 PM

freedomdwarf1

Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280
really, everyone whines about the cost of health insurance, then they whine about a program to lower the cost???? Gotta decide whether you want your cake, or eat your cake.

I can have both!!

I choose to live in a country where I don't have to pay privately for health insurance.
And this is one of the major reasons I decided not to emigrate to the US.
This sort of issue just doesn't arise here.

I tried it for 8 months. It's pretty good for the most part...
Pros: Wages are generally much better for the same sort of job - up to 3x better.
Food portions are much bigger for the same price.
The bottomless coffee cup - virtually unheard of over here.
Service in most stores is great by comparison.
Eat-all-you-want for a price less than a standard McD's here - cheaper than buying groceries and no washing up!
Most things are about half the price compared to over here - often even less.
Cons: Health costs/insurance - I could never afford it. Not with my conditions.
Guns... Coming from a gun-free culture I don't understand the need for them and don't understand the mentality.
Couldn't get over the sheer number of drivers that had pets or kids on their lap whilst driving.
Witnessed more drunk drivers in one day than I see over here in a year.
Tips!! The world and wages relies on tips - not over here.
Crap housing. Most are nothing more than glorified garden sheds with partitions.
Excessive additives in food and mostly unlabelled - particularly sugar, salt and fats.
Most of the guys I met were overbearing asshat chauvenists.
Having to pay for incoming as well as outgoing texts/calls on cell phones.
Lack of public transport (even though I don't use it).
Far too much religious garbage even outside of the bible belt.
Adverts on TV are waaay too long and far too frequent - even on cable.

Naaaa.... I'll stay over here thanks.

(in reply to FunCouple5280)

Post #: 29

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 2:03:36 PM

FunCouple5280

Posts: 559
Joined: 10/30/2012
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

I can have both!!
I choose to live in a country where I don't have to pay privately for health insurance.
And this is one of the major reasons I decided not to emigrate to the US.
This sort of issue just doesn't arise here.

You pay one way or the other....via taxes or voluntary you pay...Even if it is sales taxes or VAT on way or the other the Doctors have to get paid.

quote:

I tried it for 8 months. It's pretty good for the most part...
Pros: Wages are generally much better for the same sort of job - up to 3x better.

Means you can afford more

quote:

Food portions are much bigger for the same price.
The bottomless coffee cup - virtually unheard of over here.
Service in most stores is great by comparison.
Eat-all-you-want for a price less than a standard McD's here - cheaper than buying groceries and no washing up!
Most things are about half the price compared to over here - often even less.

Means you can afford more other stuff like healthcare....

quote:

Cons: Health costs/insurance - I could never afford it. Not with my conditions.
Guns... Coming from a gun-free culture I don't understand the need for them and don't understand the mentality.

That's your opinion, has no bearing on whats better or worse. Furthermore, is not the rule in the US. You can find many a anti-gun communities.

quote:

Couldn't get over the sheer number of drivers that had pets or kids on their lap whilst driving.
Witnessed more drunk drivers in one day than I see over here in a year.

Agreed, as spread out as the US is people drive everywhere, whether they should or not. Although, I would like to see a source for that one.

quote:

Tips!! The world and wages relies on tips - not over here.

Lol, I love tipped jobs!!!! I was a Parking Valet in college made effectively $40/hour off of tips and worked 15 hours a week.... That was the best for a student. Sure the wafflehouse my make lousy tips, but don't knock it because you had to cough up a few coins to a working class shlub. When I travel, I still believe in tipping.

quote:

Crap housing. Most are nothing more than glorified garden sheds with partitions.

Where did you live, Detroit? When I lived in Germany as a student, I was in shit box housing too, but I wouldn't have the audacity to say that all the housing was shitty.

quote:

Excessive additives in food and mostly unlabelled - particularly sugar, salt and fats.

Well, if all you ate was processed junk, sure...you just have the right to buy that crap here. You can also buy apples and fresh meat and cook it yourself. No one forces you to eat crap here.

quote:

Most of the guys I met were overbearing asshat chauvenists.

Again, where did you live?

quote:

Having to pay for incoming as well as outgoing texts/calls on cell phones.
Lack of public transport (even though I don't use it).

Phones---blame that on the government and how they tax cells....
Transit, well that varies from city to city, but I have to agree, on the otherhand it is so cheap to have a car here, why bother.

quote:

Far too much religious garbage even outside of the bible belt.
Adverts on TV are waaay too long and far too frequent - even on cable.

Yes, a sad fact, too many religious zealots.
I don't watch tv like that, a dvr and Hulu solves that bs.

< Message edited by FunCouple5280 -- 3/21/2013 2:05:00 PM >

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)

Post #: 30

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 2:05:49 PM

ForgedWill

Posts: 25
Joined: 9/28/2012
Status: offline

I think the ACLU will be involved before long. I believe it is an inherent right of anyone, to live as they see fit. Not a corporation, not a government.

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(in reply to freedomdwarf1)

Post #: 31

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 2:58:16 PM

Powergamz1

Posts: 1927
Joined: 9/3/2011
Status: offline

Snore. Seriously... That's the best you've got?

Everyone should be freeeeeee to do anything they want?

Like discriminate against other races and religions, or have sex with children?

All you have to do is shoulder some of the costs and consequences of your actions instead of expecting everyone else to pay for your mess... And you are whining that your 'right' to shit on others is being infringed, and invoking the ACLU?

quote:

ORIGINAL: ForgedWill

I think the ACLU will be involved before long. I believe it is an inherent right of anyone, to live as they see fit. Not a corporation, not a government.

_____________________________

"DOMA is unconstitutional as a deprivation of the equal liberty of persons that is protected by the Fifth Amendment" Anthony McLeod Kennedy

" About damn time...wooot!!' Me

(in reply to ForgedWill)

Post #: 32

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 5:05:55 PM

kalikshama

Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline

quote:

Now if the companies REALLY want to offer incentives to "high risk" people, they should cover the costs of dietitians, programs like Weight Watchers, gym memberships, smoking cessation medication (not all do), etc. to actually provide those people with the necessary tools to get where the insurance company wants them. Do they do this? Some may, but most don't.

When I worked at Smith College, we had a lot of these benefits. We definitely had Weight Watchers, a gym, lunchtime yoga and aerobics. Health Insurance was a pittance. We got dental as well. Much effort was put into employee wellness.

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 33

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 5:25:47 PM

lmpishlilhellcat

Posts: 500
Joined: 8/25/2011
Status: offline

I worked for a company that forced us to get a yearly physical or we had to pay more money for insurance. They didn't pay for it either. We had to pay the copay to do so. Another company I worked for made you sign a waiver saying your weren't a smoker. If you were, you paid more for insurance. I think it's becoming more and more regular for insurance companies to convince/offer incentives to companies who push their employees to do these types of things.

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Post #: 34

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/21/2013 6:27:52 PM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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Which is great, but like I said, the employers that offer that are not that common. Most are like Impishlilhellcat's. They make demands on the employees about complying with health requirements but don't provide the resources to do so.

(in reply to kalikshama)

Post #: 35

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/22/2013 7:31:00 AM

sweets1966

Posts: 58
Joined: 1/14/2013
Status: offline

My company provides incentives for wellness activities. They offer free smoking cessation programs as well as discounts at two gyms. They covers many meds for HBP and high cholesterol as well as diabetes at no charge.
We are self funded. All these things should help lower the overall cost the company pays and those who participate will benefit from wellness discounts. Those who don't will pay full price.
*removes rose colored glasses*
What we need to do is speak out and not allow them to go further. For some reason it makes me think of the programs in nazi germany that started out innocent enough and became... Well we have seen too often what happens when people don't speak up to support each other.

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)

Post #: 36

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/22/2013 7:39:09 AM

JeffBC

Posts: 5799
Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280
really, everyone whines about the cost of health insurance, then they whine about a program to lower the cost???? Gotta decide whether you want your cake, or eat your cake.

Spoken like an American. Honestly I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that it makes no sense to ask Americans about health care systems. Demonstrably you're looking at a group of people who have no clue how to make an effective one and don't want a clue.

_____________________________

I'm a lover of "what is", not because I'm a spiritual person, but because it hurts when I argue with reality. -- Bryon Katie
"You're humbly arrogant" -- sunshinemiss
officially a member of the K Crowd

(in reply to FunCouple5280)

Post #: 37

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/22/2013 7:03:50 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
Status: offline

I personally would look at it as a great motivator to get in better shape. So I don't have a problem with it at all.

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Everything has changed

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Post #: 38

RE: CVS To Employees: Tell Us Your Weight, or Else - 3/22/2013 7:18:52 PM

tj444

Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

http://touch.latimes.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-74927023/

Out of bounds, or?

well,.. I hate to say it but.. the company could choose option "C" and just get rid of the whole issue by cutting every employees hours to less than 30 hours/week.. so if its a choice between get healthier or pay more or an 10 hour/wage cut.. I wonder what people would prefer..

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Post #: 39

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