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ORIGINAL: Level
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobileweb/2013/03/18/elizabeth-warren-minimum-wage_n_2900984.html

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The $14.75 also didn't go into the cost of the final product, either.

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ORIGINAL: vincentML

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The $14.75 also didn't go into the cost of the final product, either.

How do you know that to be true? If the company is able to purchase a machine to produce more widgets it suggest there has been a greater demand for widgets leading to a price increase thus allowing and motivating the company to buy the machine. The company's profits increase to the benefit of management and shareholders who also did nothing to increase productivity. In the final analysis the increase in productivity was due to demand from the consumers.
All of which is sort of moot because Sen Warren is talking about social justice, isnt she?

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ORIGINAL: bossman777

If minimum wages were a good idea, we should just raise them to $100 an hour.

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
A guy with a shovel is 3x more productive in digging ditches today than a guy with a shovel in the 60's? I hardly think so.

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: vincentML

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The $14.75 also didn't go into the cost of the final product, either.

How do you know that to be true? If the company is able to purchase a machine to produce more widgets it suggest there has been a greater demand for widgets leading to a price increase thus allowing and motivating the company to buy the machine. The company's profits increase to the benefit of management and shareholders who also did nothing to increase productivity. In the final analysis the increase in productivity was due to demand from the consumers.
All of which is sort of moot because Sen Warren is talking about social justice, isnt she?

Prices rise and fall with the supply/demand interaction. If demand increases, price won't rise much when supply rises to meet it, unless there is a perceived value that supports the increased cost. Prices will rise much faster if there isn't any increase in supply and demand stays high.

Import stuff that has the same perceived value as the domestically produced stuff generally costs less. Why? Could it be that it costs the supplier less, so to make the same profit margin, a lower cost still fits the bill? No, couldn't be that.

Where are all the Liberal white knight business owners that want to pay high wages and benefits? Why aren't the workers flocking to these businesses? Wouldn't the supply of labor decreasing for the "evil capitalist swine" not cause an increase in the wages and benefits offered? That's businesses' strategy. Pay what you have to to get enough employees to make your product and then charge as much as you can to sell as much of your products, minimizing loss.

If a worker is more productive because he or she is a better worker than the next person in the line, using the same machinery, then that first worker should be paid more. If the first worker is more productive than the other solely because of machinery or systems put in place, then it isn't necessarily right for the first worker to be paid more.

When wages are artificially raised, there will be an expectation of increased labor value commensurate with that increased wage. You aren't going to pay "blue ribbon" wages to the ones who fail to even place, are you?

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ORIGINAL: vincentML

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The $14.75 also didn't go into the cost of the final product, either.

How do you know that to be true? If the company is able to purchase a machine to produce more widgets it suggest there has been a greater demand for widgets leading to a price increase thus allowing and motivating the company to buy the machine. The company's profits increase to the benefit of management and shareholders who also did nothing to increase productivity. In the final analysis the increase in productivity was due to demand from the consumers.

All of which is sort of moot because Sen Warren is talking about social justice, isnt she?

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When wages are artificially raised, there will be an expectation of increased labor value commensurate with that increased wage. You aren't going to pay "blue ribbon" wages to the ones who fail to even place, are you?

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ORIGINAL: Nosathro
Why is the minimum wage such a big deal, as the most common excuse is it will destory business when the excutives of that same business reward themselves with millions of dollars in bonus and such.

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Some will wave this off as a "slippery slope" fallacy, but if you raise the minimum wage, what happens to all those who are making wages that used to be higher than the minimum wage? Obviously, their wage rate will also rise to the minimum wage, right?

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ORIGINAL: Nosathro
Why is the minimum wage such a big deal, as the most common excuse is it will destory business when the excutives of that same business reward themselves with millions of dollars in bonus and such.

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ORIGINAL: vincentML

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When wages are artificially raised, there will be an expectation of increased labor value commensurate with that increased wage. You aren't going to pay "blue ribbon" wages to the ones who fail to even place, are you?

Currently, the minimum wage set by Law is $7.25/hour.
Production workers on average earn $14.97
Top 10% of all production workers earn a median wage of $24.77
Workers in motor vehicle manufacturing earn $27.48
Workers in metal ore mining earn $26.87
Workers in natural gas distribution earn $25.83
Workers in the Federal Government earn $23.52 SOURCE
For heaven's sake . . $7.25/hour!
Obviously the minimum wage Law does not effect manufacturing which is the basis of your argument against. All the demand side and supply side arguments are just irrelevent talk.
Who gets paid minimum wage? hamburger flippers, hotel maids, waitresses and busboys, car washers, healthcare attendents, etc. Low range service jobs. The very people who are struggling to make a living and are candidates for food stamps and TANF.
The minimum wage is an issue of social justice, of helping those on the lower rungs of the ladder to get a share of the pie that will allow them to be self sufficient. We bitch when these people get welfare and we bitch with faux economic arguments when businesses are required to increase the minimum wage. We want these folks to pull themselves up by their boot straps when they often don't have boots or the boots have no straps.
You said elsewhere we have to come together as a community, which is commendable. Increasing the minimum wage is a mechanism for bringing us together, however reluctantly, as a community.
Minimum wage legislation is about social fairness . . . not widget economics.

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The "below minimum wage" people will get raises, too. Whether or not it's the same raise or the same % would have to be seen later, but they'll get an increase. If you want to simply talk about those who get minimum wage, it was 2.1% of all hourly paid workers 16 years old or older (below min % is 2.6%; 4.7% of all hourly paid workers are at or below minimum wage). 24.1% of all hourly paid workers 16 years old or older that get paid at or below the minimum wage fall in the 16-19 age category. 65.2% of all hourly paid workers 16 years or older getting paid at or below the minimum wage have never been married. 57.4% work less than 35 hours/week. Have we really had such an amazing productivity increase in the no/low-skill labor force?

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65.2% of all hourly paid workers 16 years or older getting paid at or below the minimum wage have never been married. 57.4% work less than 35 hours/week. Have we really had such an amazing productivity increase in the no/low-skill labor force?

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And, yes, we'll be talking about manufacturing. A guy getting paid 3x the minimum wage is generally going to consider that he is being paid more for increased skills, experience, talent, etc. Raising the labor rate for the low/no skill work force makes that rate difference smaller, demeaning the talent, experience, and or skills that the low/no skill worker doesn't have. What happens? All hourly wage rates will eventually rise. So, yeah, it will get to manufacturing, too.

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ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

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ORIGINAL: Nosathro
Why is the minimum wage such a big deal, as the most common excuse is it will destory business when the excutives of that same business reward themselves with millions of dollars in bonus and such.

Some will wave this off as a "slippery slope" fallacy, but if you raise the minimum wage, what happens to all those who are making wages that used to be higher than the minimum wage? Obviously, their wage rate will also rise to the minimum wage, right? Or, will it rise by the same amount the minimum wage rose? If I'm making $10.25/hr. ($3+min.) and they raise the minimum wage to $10.25, will my wage change to $13.25, or will it remain at $10.25? Obviously, the person working longer than those that typically get minimum wage will feel they, too, deserve a wage that is higher. Unions love minimum wage hikes. It's pretty much a guarantee that they'll be able to get wage increases the next time negotiations are opened.

So, raising the minimum wage, while it may sound like a good thing, ends up raising pretty much every hourly-paid worker's pay rate, regardless of any increase in productivity or economic impact.