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VexAndSilence -> "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 3:11:46 PM)

Hi there! Its me Sex And Viol,... Vex And Silence again with another question of kinds.

I'll start it off by saying these experiences are not all my own, They are some my friends struggle with as well, and are too shy to seek a response.

Most of these are not 'right', but i'm wondering who the fault really lay with. Is it my/my friend's fault? Or the Doms'?

1: Is it right to lead the life style with a contract, and somehow let the master void that contract daily?
Survey says "No!" but at the same time I see it every day. And lived it for about 4 years.

Example: For 4 years I had an owner who I loved dearly. Being his pet, I specifically asked for attention and devotion when he felt I earned it. I'm a bit of a cuddle whore as a sub, i have no trouble admitting this and i told him straight up and i quote "I require a certain level of gratification. Be it as simple as a pat on the head or a 'good boy' remark when I do well."

At the time, I loved every second with my first master. He was teaching me so much and i worked very hard at doing nothing but pleaseing him and learning anything he had to offer. But,... nothing i ever did was right. Nothing I ever did was good enough. And even when I would go WAY out of my way and do some things I wish as a dom i'd have my subs do for me,... he didn't even thank me. Much less tell me i was a good boy. With our relationship clearly defined, was it right of him to be able to do that?


2: A strictly non-switch relationship starts flip-flopping. Is this right?
My second master was not much better. Instead he would come home, and be tired as all hell and tell me "I'm too tired to be dominate." Well maintaining my place in his life i massaged his sore feet, rubbed his stiff back, and still nothing. He thanked me but again with the same request never gave a good boy or any sort of physical affection. Matter of fact he would start groaning and practically begging me to dom him... and most days being as submissive as i was i would try and act dominate to sate his needs. It.... was degrading to me in a way i didn't enjoy. I even spoke with him about it and when we got to talking of it he simply would say "Its stressing me out, i order you not to speak of it anymore" And,... it was an order I had to obey.

3: Is it right to have doms give orders that may get you in trouble in public places?
Example: A friend of mine and his mistress where going out on the town to a club. But there was a catch. They where cross dressing. When they got to the bar/club (i forget which) The staff asks the sub to leave. Instead of complying he refused to leave his mistress' side as he was a very shy boy. She however refused to leave without at least 1 daiquiri and told them to allow him in. They would not let the man in, and they came to an agreement that the man would have to wait outside. I don't know what happened at this point on save that she left his leash tied to a rail outside the bar/club. What I do know is it has scarred him in a personal way and she still refuses to admit it was anything wrong.

4: At one point in my life, I was Forced, for sheer amusement of an owner's friend, to be celibate and driven to the edge time and time again for over a month. Blue balls aside, I developed a fairly substantial health issue regarding an infection in my fellows. When asked how or why the doctor said ' It could be due to lack of release and over stimulation of the sexual organs.' My owner, not only let his friend play with me, but encouraged me never to finish, saying i would be punished if i did. I CLEARLY had celibacy as a major turn off and something he and I agreed would never have happen in any "overly prolonged" periods.

5: One of my masters was a total leach. He did love me,... or so i thought. He respected me, told me i was a good boy, and even helped me regain some confidence. However, he was a kleptomaniac, with a drug headed family. I thought he often bought gifts for me when he had no job, said he did odd jobs just to get me presents and make me feel better. But,... latter,... i learned he got these things with stolen credit cards, and five finger discounts... making me accessory to theft. When i found all this out, needless to say i was stunned. Thankfully I got off with just a little community service for testifying against him. But... after he got out of jail, his mother had died, and he had no place to stay, so guess who he called. He called and ordered me to find a place for him to live... I did,... a local church. He lived there for a few months before he bought himself a bus ticket to Cali. I learned that he had since got hooked on meth and crack, and been to rehab. He cam back to thank me for it all, He said "I remembered when in rehab how happy you made me, And how dedicated to you i was. I'm sorry.

That... Tore me up. But to this day I cant bring myself to become some one else' real pet again. Am I wrong for having so little faith in doms? Or is it my place to be afraid?



That's all for now, but i'll say this.... it has lead me away from being submissive and now I even seek to be purely dominate because of some of the treatments I've had. Am I wrong in assuming anything better from this life style? Or am i right to feel a bit neglected?



muhly22222 -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 3:36:30 PM)

quote:

1: Is it right to lead the life style with a contract, and somehow let the master void that contract daily?
Survey says "No!" but at the same time I see it every day. And lived it for about 4 years.

Example: For 4 years I had an owner who I loved dearly. Being his pet, I specifically asked for attention and devotion when he felt I earned it. I'm a bit of a cuddle whore as a sub, i have no trouble admitting this and i told him straight up and i quote "I require a certain level of gratification. Be it as simple as a pat on the head or a 'good boy' remark when I do well."

At the time, I loved every second with my first master. He was teaching me so much and i worked very hard at doing nothing but pleaseing him and learning anything he had to offer. But,... nothing i ever did was right. Nothing I ever did was good enough. And even when I would go WAY out of my way and do some things I wish as a dom i'd have my subs do for me,... he didn't even thank me. Much less tell me i was a good boy. With our relationship clearly defined, was it right of him to be able to do that?


I presume that something was working that you stayed with it for four years. But if he wasn't meeting your needs, he wasn't right for you. You expressed your need for attention and gratification, and he chose not to meet it. I'd say you had more than ample reason to walk away.

quote:

2: A strictly non-switch relationship starts flip-flopping. Is this right?
My second master was not much better. Instead he would come home, and be tired as all hell and tell me "I'm too tired to be dominate." Well maintaining my place in his life i massaged his sore feet, rubbed his stiff back, and still nothing. He thanked me but again with the same request never gave a good boy or any sort of physical affection. Matter of fact he would start groaning and practically begging me to dom him... and most days being as submissive as i was i would try and act dominate to sate his needs. It.... was degrading to me in a way i didn't enjoy. I even spoke with him about it and when we got to talking of it he simply would say "Its stressing me out, i order you not to speak of it anymore" And,... it was an order I had to obey.


This seems like a major issue. I've heard of submissive persons posing as dominants and trying to flip the tables once they got a sub. It sounds like you may have gotten one of those. But the real issue to me is that you tried to speak to him about it, and he ordered you to shut up. I would walk away from any situation like that in a heartbeat.

quote:

3: Is it right to have doms give orders that may get you in trouble in public places?
Example: A friend of mine and his mistress where going out on the town to a club. But there was a catch. They where cross dressing. When they got to the bar/club (i forget which) The staff asks the sub to leave. Instead of complying he refused to leave his mistress' side as he was a very shy boy. She however refused to leave without at least 1 daiquiri and told them to allow him in. They would not let the man in, and they came to an agreement that the man would have to wait outside. I don't know what happened at this point on save that she left his leash tied to a rail outside the bar/club. What I do know is it has scarred him in a personal way and she still refuses to admit it was anything wrong.


I am firmly against any type of "play" that results in trouble for either person. But to me, the biggest problem here was that your friend's mistress just left him in a situation in which he was quite clearly uncomfortable, and now refuses to apologize for it. I understand that for some people, part of the allure can be placing others/being placed in uncomfortable situations. I also understand that when a person's dynamic includes that, it's possible for one person to go too far...at which point they need to make amends. Apologizing, helping the sub get over the issues that situation caused. If she's not admitting that she made a mistake, and your friend is traumatized, she's not doing her job.

quote:

5: One of my masters was a total leach. He did love me,... or so i thought. He respected me, told me i was a good boy, and even helped me regain some confidence. However, he was a kleptomaniac, with a drug headed family. I thought he often bought gifts for me when he had no job, said he did odd jobs just to get me presents and make me feel better. But,... latter,... i learned he got these things with stolen credit cards, and five finger discounts... making me accessory to theft. When i found all this out, needless to say i was stunned. Thankfully I got off with just a little community service for testifying against him. But... after he got out of jail, his mother had died, and he had no place to stay, so guess who he called. He called and ordered me to find a place for him to live... I did,... a local church. He lived there for a few months before he bought himself a bus ticket to Cali. I learned that he had since got hooked on meth and crack, and been to rehab. He cam back to thank me for it all, He said "I remembered when in rehab how happy you made me, And how dedicated to you i was. I'm sorry.

That... Tore me up. But to this day I cant bring myself to become some one else' real pet again. Am I wrong for having so little faith in doms? Or is it my place to be afraid?


This is somebody else's irresponsibility. He broke the law, and he dragged you down with him (though thankfully not as far as he went himself).

Do you have a right to be afraid? Absolutely. But nobody hits 1.000 when they're hunting for a relationship. The past can scar you, but you shouldn't dwell on past events. Learn from them, then continue with your life.



VexAndSilence -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 3:55:11 PM)

Thanks.


In response to the first,... no. Nothing was working honestly. I was more or less stuck through my sheer devotion and determination to make it work. It ended with him telling me that "I never loved you and you where nothing but a hassle"... So it left me more than upset. Then again I was young at the time (legal since he himself was within 5 years of my age).

The second response i guess i'm at fault for letting it drag on. Again i'm too devoted and ready to defend my master from... well, the truth.

Third i'm with you on it I just wanted to see if i was right or not for my friend's sake.

Fifth, well,... i learned a little? I didn't defend him in court that's for sure. Not to say it didn't hurt like hell. ._.

I'm just more than a little curious if these things are normal or not. I've seen some things that suggest both ways and it isn't as clear cut for subs what is and isn't acceptable. At least not me and my passel of subs/sub friends.

I was fairly hesitant to post these, my submissive side of me is rather shy and reserved. But i'll be damned if i'm not a cat as far as curiosity is concerned so i had to ask some people who have been there before.

The only reason i'm a switch is so i can spare my submissives the pains of having a bad master. In a sense i'm so submissive i've become dominate ^^; but my pets don't complain even if it is digital relationships for now. Though that brings up another question for another time thinking about it .><



kalikshama -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 4:03:17 PM)

The issue isn't D/s but your choice of partners. Therapy helped me recognize my poor choices and might do the same for you. Don't submit until you are able to chose someone worthy of it who is also compatible with you.

I suggest you strive for interdependence rather than codependence.



DesFIP -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 4:23:37 PM)

In each of these cases the sub deliberately picked a dominant they were not compatible with. The question is why? If you know you need a lot of positive reinforcement, then you will know within the first few dates that this person doesn't do that. Yet you committed to them knowing they were unable to fulfill your needs.

I have to assume you are picking people who won't make you happy as a result of early experiences. Magically hoping to repeat unpleasant childhood experiences and have it somehow come out right. That's your fault. Setting healthy boundaries, picking compatible partners - all that is your responsibility.

Yet in all these experiences you accept no responsibility. You blame other people for being who they are and for not changing for you. You accept bad experiences and blame the dominant instead of telling them the relationship didn't work for you.

I suggest therapy.



angelikaJ -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 4:48:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: VexAndSilence

Hi there! Its me Sex And Viol,... Vex And Silence again with another question of kinds.

I'll start it off by saying these experiences are not all my own, They are some my friends struggle with as well, and are too shy to seek a response.

Most of these are not 'right', but i'm wondering who the fault really lay with. Is it my/my friend's fault? Or the Doms'?

1: Is it right to lead the life style with a contract, and somehow let the master void that contract daily?
Survey says "No!" but at the same time I see it every day. And lived it for about 4 years.

Example: For 4 years I had an owner who I loved dearly. Being his pet, I specifically asked for attention and devotion when he felt I earned it. I'm a bit of a cuddle whore as a sub, i have no trouble admitting this and i told him straight up and i quote "I require a certain level of gratification. Be it as simple as a pat on the head or a 'good boy' remark when I do well."

At the time, I loved every second with my first master. He was teaching me so much and i worked very hard at doing nothing but pleaseing him and learning anything he had to offer. But,... nothing i ever did was right. Nothing I ever did was good enough. And even when I would go WAY out of my way and do some things I wish as a dom i'd have my subs do for me,... he didn't even thank me. Much less tell me i was a good boy. With our relationship clearly defined, was it right of him to be able to do that?

You told him what you needed, essentially setting a limit.
He did not give you what you needed but you stayed anyway which reinforced he behavior.
The minute you allow a limit to be wiggled, it becomes less important to the point where it is voided.
Was your need for affection written into the contract?
Contracts are only as good as the word of the person who signs them.
His end of the contract may have been important to him, but it does not sound as if your side was.

Was he a bad master or were you just unsuited to each other.
There are s-types who don't need what you did.
I am not one of them, so that kind of a relationship would not work for me.


2: A strictly non-switch relationship starts flip-flopping. Is this right?
My second master was not much better. Instead he would come home, and be tired as all hell and tell me "I'm too tired to be dominate." Well maintaining my place in his life i massaged his sore feet, rubbed his stiff back, and still nothing. He thanked me but again with the same request never gave a good boy or any sort of physical affection. Matter of fact he would start groaning and practically begging me to dom him... and most days being as submissive as i was i would try and act dominate to sate his needs. It.... was degrading to me in a way i didn't enjoy. I even spoke with him about it and when we got to talking of it he simply would say "Its stressing me out, i order you not to speak of it anymore" And,... it was an order I had to obey.

How did you dominate him as you are not giving any examples.

And again, you stayed in a relationship with a partner who was unwilling to meet your need for affection.

3: Is it right to have doms give orders that may get you in trouble in public places?
Example: A friend of mine and his mistress where going out on the town to a club. But there was a catch. They where cross dressing. When they got to the bar/club (i forget which) The staff asks the sub to leave. Instead of complying he refused to leave his mistress' side as he was a very shy boy. She however refused to leave without at least 1 daiquiri and told them to allow him in. They would not let the man in, and they came to an agreement that the man would have to wait outside. I don't know what happened at this point on save that she left his leash tied to a rail outside the bar/club. What I do know is it has scarred him in a personal way and she still refuses to admit it was anything wrong.



4: At one point in my life, I was Forced, for sheer amusement of an owner's friend, to be celibate and driven to the edge time and time again for over a month. Blue balls aside, I developed a fairly substantial health issue regarding an infection in my fellows. When asked how or why the doctor said ' It could be due to lack of release and over stimulation of the sexual organs.' My owner, not only let his friend play with me, but encouraged me never to finish, saying i would be punished if i did. I CLEARLY had celibacy as a major turn off and something he and I agreed would never have happen in any "overly prolonged" periods.

Yes, I have read that sort of thing can least to prostatitis.
But again, you set up a boundary or limit and then your master walked all over it.


5: One of my masters was a total leach. He did love me,... or so i thought. He respected me, told me i was a good boy, and even helped me regain some confidence. However, he was a kleptomaniac, with a drug headed family. I thought he often bought gifts for me when he had no job, said he did odd jobs just to get me presents and make me feel better. But,... latter,... i learned he got these things with stolen credit cards, and five finger discounts... making me accessory to theft. When i found all this out, needless to say i was stunned. Thankfully I got off with just a little community service for testifying against him. But... after he got out of jail, his mother had died, and he had no place to stay, so guess who he called. He called and ordered me to find a place for him to live... I did,... a local church. He lived there for a few months before he bought himself a bus ticket to Cali. I learned that he had since got hooked on meth and crack, and been to rehab. He cam back to thank me for it all, He said "I remembered when in rehab how happy you made me, And how dedicated to you i was. I'm sorry.



That... Tore me up. But to this day I cant bring myself to become some one else' real pet again. Am I wrong for having so little faith in doms? Or is it my place to be afraid?

Your issue is not with trusting too much but with your people picker.
You need to make better choices in who you choose to be your partner.
You need to decide what your limits and personal boundaries are and then adhere to them.
You need to work on your sense of self-preservation.
Being submissive does not mean being someone's door mat.



That's all for now, but i'll say this.... it has lead me away from being submissive and now I even seek to be purely dominate because of some of the treatments I've had. Am I wrong in assuming anything better from this life style? Or am i right to feel a bit neglected?


Have you considered therapy?
My guess is if you could make better choices you would have... and so perhaps you need to be taught some tools.
You are young, and that may be a part of it, but if you don't know what a healthy relationship is, how are you going to find one?




kalikshama -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/2/2013 6:54:58 PM)

Saw this on a profile and thought it fits this thread:

[image]http://www.collarme.com/photos/1640921.jpg[/image]



LadyPact -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/4/2013 10:41:11 PM)

This is kind of long, but I'll see if I can lend a hand.

quote:

ORIGINAL: VexAndSilence

Hi there! Its me Sex And Viol,... Vex And Silence again with another question of kinds.

I'll start it off by saying these experiences are not all my own, They are some my friends struggle with as well, and are too shy to seek a response.

OK, I'm going to stop you there for a sec. Do yourself a favor. Don't try to figure out other people's dynamics. Unless you are a party to such a dynamic, you don't *really* know what's going on or if you have a good grasp on their understanding, what's been influenced by hurt feelings, or any of that other crap. What you saw, isn't necessarily the whole thing. I used to have a sig line that read, "I really appreciate your opinion and all, but My dynamic is not a democracy and you don't get a vote".

Moving on.......


quote:

Most of these are not 'right', but i'm wondering who the fault really lay with. Is it my/my friend's fault? Or the Doms'?

1: Is it right to lead the life style with a contract, and somehow let the master void that contract daily?
Survey says "No!" but at the same time I see it every day. And lived it for about 4 years.

Example: For 4 years I had an owner who I loved dearly. Being his pet, I specifically asked for attention and devotion when he felt I earned it. I'm a bit of a cuddle whore as a sub, i have no trouble admitting this and i told him straight up and i quote "I require a certain level of gratification. Be it as simple as a pat on the head or a 'good boy' remark when I do well."

At the time, I loved every second with my first master. He was teaching me so much and i worked very hard at doing nothing but pleaseing him and learning anything he had to offer. But,... nothing i ever did was right. Nothing I ever did was good enough. And even when I would go WAY out of my way and do some things I wish as a dom i'd have my subs do for me,... he didn't even thank me. Much less tell me i was a good boy. With our relationship clearly defined, was it right of him to be able to do that?

This may be hard for you to hear, but I'm trying to give you a good example.

There's a difference in the concepts of obedience, anticipatory service, and more is better. Obedience is doing what you are told. No more, no less. Anticipatory service is the stuff that you *KNOW* the Master wants. How is coffee made? If it comes with a splash of cream and heavy sugar, when you bring it in the morning, you *KNOW* that's how he wants it. More is better is the concept of you *THINK* you know what someone wants. Same thing. Coffee in the morning, but you *think* to yourself "he likes whipped cream, I'll put whipped cream in there instead." Well, you were trying to do a nice thing, but that's not really what he wanted. The man just wanted his coffee the way he's had it for the last number of years. Now, he's got to wait for the coffee that he wanted his way to begin with to wake up in the morning, which throws off his routine, and he's not happy. In your mind, you are thinking service. In his mind, you are not obeying.



quote:

2: A strictly non-switch relationship starts flip-flopping. Is this right?

I'm not the best resource to help you with this because I don't switch. Anybody putting Me in the position to submit would be shown the door.



quote:

3: Is it right to have doms give orders that may get you in trouble in public places?
Example: A friend of mine and his mistress where going out on the town to a club. But there was a catch. They where cross dressing. When they got to the bar/club (i forget which) The staff asks the sub to leave. Instead of complying he refused to leave his mistress' side as he was a very shy boy. She however refused to leave without at least 1 daiquiri and told them to allow him in. They would not let the man in, and they came to an agreement that the man would have to wait outside. I don't know what happened at this point on save that she left his leash tied to a rail outside the bar/club. What I do know is it has scarred him in a personal way and she still refuses to admit it was anything wrong.

The above is not My style. I'm an old chick. I would be worried about the safety of the situation, first. If this had been at a non public club where only kinksters go, I might have a different opinion. I'm still used to cross dressing being an unspoken invite for some very bad things to happen. That's a primary concern for Me.

On the other hand, if I was at a play party/private club/leather bar, I'd have been totally cool with leashing the boy just inside the door. I'm not anti-mind fuck by any means.


quote:

4: At one point in my life, I was Forced, for sheer amusement of an owner's friend, to be celibate and driven to the edge time and time again for over a month. Blue balls aside, I developed a fairly substantial health issue regarding an infection in my fellows. When asked how or why the doctor said ' It could be due to lack of release and over stimulation of the sexual organs.' My owner, not only let his friend play with me, but encouraged me never to finish, saying i would be punished if i did. I CLEARLY had celibacy as a major turn off and something he and I agreed would never have happen in any "overly prolonged" periods.

Major turn off and obedience are two different things.

If you were ill, I'd have rectified that issue with milking. It's not your orgasm that promotes prostate health. Fun is fun, but when a person's health comes into play, certain adjustments or postponements apply.

At the same time, it depends on a person's perception as to what is considered a prolonged period.

quote:

5: One of my masters was a total leach. He did love me,... or so i thought. He respected me, told me i was a good boy, and even helped me regain some confidence. However, he was a kleptomaniac, with a drug headed family. I thought he often bought gifts for me when he had no job, said he did odd jobs just to get me presents and make me feel better. But,... latter,... i learned he got these things with stolen credit cards, and five finger discounts... making me accessory to theft. When i found all this out, needless to say i was stunned. Thankfully I got off with just a little community service for testifying against him. But... after he got out of jail, his mother had died, and he had no place to stay, so guess who he called. He called and ordered me to find a place for him to live... I did,... a local church. He lived there for a few months before he bought himself a bus ticket to Cali. I learned that he had since got hooked on meth and crack, and been to rehab. He cam back to thank me for it all, He said "I remembered when in rehab how happy you made me, And how dedicated to you i was. I'm sorry.

The during part seems to have sucked. I will commend for the after part. It's not always easy to own one's mistakes.

It sounds like you really stepped up. Kudos for that. (I can't tell you "good boy" because I don't know you well enough for that.)


quote:

That... Tore me up. But to this day I cant bring myself to become some one else' real pet again. Am I wrong for having so little faith in doms? Or is it my place to be afraid?

No. It is your place, however, to examine two things. One is understanding, like it or not, that the common denominator in all of your relationships is you. There might be a reason that you allow yourself to have partners that aren't in your best interest.

The other is compatibility. I do think you need to choose more wisely. If that is the case, it's not going to matter which side of the kneel you prefer. Being on the other side of the kneel doesn't relieve you of that.

Perhaps, some time for personal reflection is in order.


quote:

That's all for now, but i'll say this.... it has lead me away from being submissive and now I even seek to be purely dominate because of some of the treatments I've had. Am I wrong in assuming anything better from this life style? Or am i right to feel a bit neglected?
Dominant, dear. Please.

Neglected isn't the right term, either. That is a term for a person/thing that has no choice. The other choice, leaving, may not have been palatable for you, but it was still choice. In accepting life situations, it may have been passive, but it is still choice.

What you may need to work on is better choices. Reassess what you really want.

I wish you the best of luck in your endeavors.




UllrsIshtar -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/5/2013 2:07:28 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: VexAndSilence


That's all for now, but i'll say this.... it has lead me away from being submissive and now I even seek to be purely dominate because of some of the treatments I've had. Am I wrong in assuming anything better from this life style? Or am i right to feel a bit neglected?



First of all, because you make this mistake several times in your post: "dominate" is a verb, something you do to; "dominant" is a noun or an adjective, it's something that describes a class of things, or a personal attribute.
You can't "seek to be purely dominate"; instead you'd seek to be purely dominant.

Secondly, the thing all these guys (except #3) have in common is you.

Why are you consistently with guys who don't make you happy?

Why are you consistently with guys who aren't dominant?

You're asking if you can assume something better, and the answer is of course... tons of people have way better experiences than what you're describing. You just can't expect anything better as long as you keep selecting losers to be your partners.

As far as you feeling neglected, its you who is neglecting yourself by not expecting more from the men you're with. You can't expect more from them. They are the way they are when you continued to choose to be with them. The pattern of neglect is not one that they inflicted on you, but one that you inflicted on yourself by remaining in the relationships with them long after it became clear that they weren't right for you.

If you want better experiences, you need to set better standards, have better expectations of your partners, and take better care of yourself by leaving situations that are bad/harmful/unsatisfying to you.



chatterbox24 -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/5/2013 5:38:01 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: VexAndSilence

Hi there! Its me Sex And Viol,... Vex And Silence again with another question of kinds.

I'll start it off by saying these experiences are not all my own, They are some my friends struggle with as well, and are too shy to seek a response.

Most of these are not 'right', but i'm wondering who the fault really lay with. Is it my/my friend's fault? Or the Doms'?

1: Is it right to lead the life style with a contract, and somehow let the master void that contract daily?
Survey says "No!" but at the same time I see it every day. And lived it for about 4 years.

Example: For 4 years I had an owner who I loved dearly. Being his pet, I specifically asked for attention and devotion when he felt I earned it. I'm a bit of a cuddle whore as a sub, i have no trouble admitting this and i told him straight up and i quote "I require a certain level of gratification. Be it as simple as a pat on the head or a 'good boy' remark when I do well."

At the time, I loved every second with my first master. He was teaching me so much and i worked very hard at doing nothing but pleaseing him and learning anything he had to offer. But,... nothing i ever did was right. Nothing I ever did was good enough. And even when I would go WAY out of my way and do some things I wish as a dom i'd have my subs do for me,... he didn't even thank me. Much less tell me i was a good boy. With our relationship clearly defined, was it right of him to be able to do that?

No it was not right. If it was stated, and he agreed, then some validation was in order. Sounds like he didn't much care how you felt, he was more centered on him getting what he wanted and thats all that mattered. I do believe some so called Doms think if no validation or appreciation is given, the sub will work even harder to please them because the sub wants that validation they never seem to get. Dom gets more, sub is left feeling neglected and unappreciated, that doesnt work well over time. Leads to burn out, I myself need appreciation also, if its not given, resentment builds. I am curious, how did this relationship end by the way? Did he throw you away?


2: A strictly non-switch relationship starts flip-flopping. Is this right?
My second master was not much better. Instead he would come home, and be tired as all hell and tell me "I'm too tired to be dominate." Well maintaining my place in his life i massaged his sore feet, rubbed his stiff back, and still nothing. He thanked me but again with the same request never gave a good boy or any sort of physical affection. Matter of fact he would start groaning and practically begging me to dom him... and most days being as submissive as i was i would try and act dominate to sate his needs. It.... was degrading to me in a way i didn't enjoy. I even spoke with him about it and when we got to talking of it he simply would say "Its stressing me out, i order you not to speak of it anymore" And,... it was an order I had to obey.

THis so called Dom, doesnt sound much different then the first.

3: Is it right to have doms give orders that may get you in trouble in public places?
Example: A friend of mine and his mistress where going out on the town to a club. But there was a catch. They where cross dressing. When they got to the bar/club (i forget which) The staff asks the sub to leave. Instead of complying he refused to leave his mistress' side as he was a very shy boy. She however refused to leave without at least 1 daiquiri and told them to allow him in. They would not let the man in, and they came to an agreement that the man would have to wait outside. I don't know what happened at this point on save that she left his leash tied to a rail outside the bar/club. What I do know is it has scarred him in a personal way and she still refuses to admit it was anything wrong.

I absolutely don't agree with this at all. BUt I am not into public humiliation, and there isn't a master alive going to put me in that situation with me agreeing to it.

4: At one point in my life, I was Forced, for sheer amusement of an owner's friend, to be celibate and driven to the edge time and time again for over a month. Blue balls aside, I developed a fairly substantial health issue regarding an infection in my fellows. When asked how or why the doctor said ' It could be due to lack of release and over stimulation of the sexual organs.' My owner, not only let his friend play with me, but encouraged me never to finish, saying i would be punished if i did. I CLEARLY had celibacy as a major turn off and something he and I agreed would never have happen in any "overly prolonged" periods.

This is just wrong, wrong, wrong. Thats devotion gone to far, thats when the sub should jump up and take a stand. A good fuck you IM done, should do. AM I telling you to disobey? Damn right I am.[:D]

5: One of my masters was a total leach. He did love me,... or so i thought. He respected me, told me i was a good boy, and even helped me regain some confidence. However, he was a kleptomaniac, with a drug headed family. I thought he often bought gifts for me when he had no job, said he did odd jobs just to get me presents and make me feel better. But,... latter,... i learned he got these things with stolen credit cards, and five finger discounts... making me accessory to theft. When i found all this out, needless to say i was stunned. Thankfully I got off with just a little community service for testifying against him. But... after he got out of jail, his mother had died, and he had no place to stay, so guess who he called. He called and ordered me to find a place for him to live... I did,... a local church. He lived there for a few months before he bought himself a bus ticket to Cali. I learned that he had since got hooked on meth and crack, and been to rehab. He cam back to thank me for it all, He said "I remembered when in rehab how happy you made me, And how dedicated to you i was. I'm sorry.

NO comment on this one

That... Tore me up. But to this day I cant bring myself to become some one else' real pet again. Am I wrong for having so little faith in doms? Or is it my place to be afraid?

Considering your experiences, heck yah. BE AFRAID. What faith really did they deserve?



That's all for now, but i'll say this.... it has lead me away from being submissive and now I even seek to be purely dominate because of some of the treatments I've had. Am I wrong in assuming anything better from this life style? Or am i right to feel a bit neglected?


YOu have every right to expect more, not only expect it but get it. You really should look at yourself first and identify why you are picking the type of people who aren't treating you the way you want to be treated. YOur not a doormat, you want to be an appreciated sub



LanceHughes -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/5/2013 9:58:51 AM)

FR on part #1

Contract broken?
Contracted ENDED - leave.
Yes, yes, I know it's easier said than done. And in response to that, I say, see all the posts about "Wrong choices."
Part one is making the same wrong choice over and over (and expecting different results. <== Ah! Definition of being crazy.)



ChatteParfaitt -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/5/2013 10:55:14 AM)

You say these experiences are not your own, very well, I shall take you at your word.

BDSM relationships are still relationships like any other. There are many people, some into BDSM and some not, who are not emotionally healthy enough to be in a relationship.

Whose fault this is I will allow others to determine, with the caveat that is has nothing to do with BDSM and everything to do with emotional health.

Now, are there some who use BDSM to play the victim card or to prey on others? Yes, and that's regrettable. I'm not sure what you think this forum can do about that except preach emotional health before pursuing a relationship, which is does now and has done since I've been here (+5 years).

But thanks for preaching to the choir.




SacredDepravity -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/6/2013 3:44:57 PM)

The doms are culpable in these, as far as we have been given insight, but so are you. Don't you dare lay all this at the dominants' feet and cry about whether you can ever trust again. You made choices with negative outcomes. YOU. Don't worry about "them". Work on YOU.

SD
whose opinion comes from a lot of tough life lessons...



littlewonder -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/6/2013 6:06:45 PM)

Quit going out with guys for awhile. Take a break and get your head on straight. Ask yourself why you keep making the same choices over and over and then talk to a therapist or counselor.



Bhruic -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (4/8/2013 8:11:09 AM)

One person's wrong is another person's right. There are no rules beyond what is satisfying you. The only thing I'd go out on a limb and classify as "wrong" is staying in a relationship that does not satisfy you... that seems emotionally unhealthy.



orgasmdenial12 -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (6/2/2013 10:28:06 AM)

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.

It's one thing to have a bad date or a bad experience. It's another thing to willingly continue it for years, and then blame the other party.

In all these cases the other party did not act as they should have. But in all these cases the questioner did not act as they should have.

It doesn't matter whether you are a sub, slave, bottom, masochist, kinky, switch, whatever. You are still a legally responsible human being with responsibility for your actions, especially when dealing with the public.

If you broke your own morals to try and get attention / affection then shame on you. Next time, be firm with them but be even firmer with yourself.



JeffBC -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (6/2/2013 10:59:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: VexAndSilence
I'll start it off by saying these experiences are not all my own

So then I'll just focus on the ones that ARE your own if that's OK. As LadyPact said, trying to understand other people's relationships is a fool's errand. You shouldn't try. And I am surely not going to try based on a few sentences relayed 3rd hand through a message board.

At the time, I loved every second with my first master. He was teaching me so much and i worked very hard at doing nothing but pleaseing him and learning anything he had to offer. But,... nothing i ever did was right. Nothing I ever did was good enough. And even when I would go WAY out of my way and do some things I wish as a dom i'd have my subs do for me,... he didn't even thank me.
Can you explain to me how the two bolded parts line up. You loved every second yet you were always wrong?

2: A strictly non-switch relationship starts flip-flopping. Is this right?
My second master was not much better. Instead he would come home, and be tired as all hell and tell me "I'm too tired to be dominate."
I am sometimes too -- at least in the way he meant it I suspect. So what? Yes it's right. Other things in the story are less "right".

3: Is it right to have doms give orders that may get you in trouble in public places?
Dunno but I spent a few years doing something similar to Carol. Out of curiosity, how do you define "right" and "wrong" in these situations?

4: At one point in my life, I was Forced, for sheer amusement of an owner's friend, to be celibate and driven to the edge time and time again for over a month. Blue balls aside, I developed a fairly substantial health issue regarding an infection in my fellows. When asked how or why the doctor said ' It could be due to lack of release and over stimulation of the sexual organs.' My owner, not only let his friend play with me, but encouraged me never to finish, saying i would be punished if i did. I CLEARLY had celibacy as a major turn off and something he and I agreed would never have happen in any "overly prolonged" periods.
So some guy who "owned" you wanted you to do something you didn't like. The issue of medical complication seems like smoke screen to me but if that were actually true it could be handled as LP said.

5: One of my masters was a total leach.
That sucks. I'd recommend avoiding making pledges of undying loyalty and obedience to "total leaches"

My advice? Get some counselling. Find out why you can't seem to attract a reasonably functional human being. Fix that. One of my favorite posters from here (now long gone) once said something like, "Happily I didn't pick an asshat as an owner so the bills get paid and the children get fed even if I do obey." There's wisdom in that for you.



evesgrden -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (6/2/2013 12:59:22 PM)



Regardless of lifestyle or relationship...

What you permit, you promote.



kiwisub12 -> RE: "Is this right?" - Experiences i'm left pondering over (6/2/2013 1:52:55 PM)

Have to agree with ALL the posters. The one constant in all these stories is you. You allowed these men to do whatever they wanted with no consequences. I rather think you need to google the word "co-dependent" and find someone who can treat you for it.

and just so you know, i stayed in a marraige for 13 years. 13 longggg and loveless years, and and then spent 10 years alone - because i was too afraid to trust a man again. Thankfully, i found a kink friendly therapist, and three years later was in a wonderful relationship with a fabulous man. The talk therapy gave me the courage to be open and vulnerable to him, and our relationship showed it. You can have a wonderful relationship - you just need to understand why you choose bad men (bad in that they aren't capable of giving you what you want and need to be happy).

edited for spelling and grammatical mistake. Oops.



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