This probably belongs in P&R, but...

This probably belongs in P&R, but... (Full Version)

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jlf1961 -> This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/23/2013 11:03:25 PM)
I was informed today, that due to a large legal settlement, that a project idea that I have been dreaming about may be financed on the condition that I involve my grandson Thomas and my great nephew Damian (15 months) Now, this means that I will be building a pair of mirrored 32 ford coupes. I dont like fiberglass so I have found steel repro bodies for both models. They can be purchased with a chop in the body, 4 inches in the front, 3 in the back. The paint scheme for one is metal flake sapphire blue with metal flake red ghost flames, the second will have the opposite paint scheme. Both will have 389 Pontiac engines, 4 speed transmissions, and racing rear ends. They will not have electronic ignition, pollution limiting systems... in other words, they will for all intents and purposes be a direct throw back to the 50's and early 60's with the exception of the engine, which did not show up till the late 60's. Estimated total cost for the pair, $75 thousand. These are going to be gas guzzling, thunder roaring monsters for me and my niece. And far from eco friendly as I said.

BlkTallFullfig -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 1:29:19 AM)
I'm not going to guess why, but ask why do that? Build Gas guzzlers on purpose? I know I don't understand the motivation behind it (?family building original machine we feel nostalgic about), but it's probably because I'm of the mindset that, if I can buy similar or better already made, possibly cheaper, why make it? M

Level -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 4:31:49 AM)
M, you touched on it-- creating something by hand, together, can give the cars meaning that just buying them wouldn't, at least in theory. Jeff, take lots of pics and share'em.

jlf1961 -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:16:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig I'm not going to guess why, but ask why do that? Build Gas guzzlers on purpose? I know I don't understand the motivation behind it (?family building original machine we feel nostalgic about), but it's probably because I'm of the mindset that, if I can buy similar or better already made, possibly cheaper, why make it? M For one thing, you cant buy one of these types of cars off the show room floor. Secondly, having one built for you defeats the purpose. Third, in the world of motorheads, cars like these are works of art. While the body style is a tribute to the classic hot rods of the fifties ( watch the movie American graffiti) pay attention to the yellow coupe in the movie driven by the character Milner. Also these are not cars you drive everyday, these are for car club cruise nights, hot rod rallies (fund raising timed events over two to three days) and just to show. Personally, I have been around hot rods or muscle cars most of my life, my first car was a 66 dodge charger that I restored myself, being the third owner, the local vice squad was the first, and my mom was the second. My second car was a 69 Camero SS convertible with a 350 and four speed. Then I bought a 63 corvette split window and restored it. Of course that was back in the days when gas was just over a dollar a gallon, actually when I got my first car, it was $.69.9 a gallon. While I could go with an OEM powerplant with the electronic ignition and pollution controls, I wont. Primarily because I dont have a clue as to how to work on the damn things. I will try to find some pics of the two cars to put in the thread, but right now collarme is being a pain and wont let me upload.

theshytype -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:16:27 AM)
I'd like to rebuild an old car. And by that, I mean stand around and watch until its all done and I can ride in it (I know absolutely nothing about cars except looks good and/or drives fast). My personal preference would be a 69 Camaro. Do you know approximately when you get to start this wonderful project? I'd love to see pics, too!

jlf1961 -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:20:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: theshytype I'd like to rebuild an old car. And by that, I mean stand around and watch until its all done and I can ride in it (I know absolutely nothing about cars except looks good and/or drives fast). My personal preference would be a 69 Camaro. Do you know approximately when you get to start this wonderful project? I'd love to see pics, too! Not sure, it depends on when bro in law gets his settlement check. A company he used to drive truck for knowingly exposed him and the other drivers to toxic waste and other hazardous materials without telling them what they were loading, unloading and hauling. Happened 9 years ago, and the court just made a freaking decision.

theshytype -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:22:16 AM)
Yikes! I hope he's okay and no long-lasting effects!

jlf1961 -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:23:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: theshytype Yikes! I hope he's okay and no long-lasting effects! He is, but the settlement includes full medical coverage just in case something shows up.

TahoeSadist -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:35:08 AM)
I can understand the coupes, and like 4 speeds, but Pontiac???? TS

MAINEiacMISTRESS -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:43:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 I was informed today, that due to a large legal settlement, that a project idea that I have been dreaming about may be financed on the condition that I involve my grandson Thomas and my great nephew Damian (15 months) Now, this means that I will be building a pair of mirrored 32 ford coupes. I dont like fiberglass so I have found steel repro bodies for both models. They can be purchased with a chop in the body, 4 inches in the front, 3 in the back. The paint scheme for one is metal flake sapphire blue with metal flake red ghost flames, the second will have the opposite paint scheme. Both will have 389 Pontiac engines, 4 speed transmissions, and racing rear ends. They will not have electronic ignition, pollution limiting systems... in other words, they will for all intents and purposes be a direct throw back to the 50's and early 60's with the exception of the engine, which did not show up till the late 60's. Estimated total cost for the pair, $75 thousand. These are going to be gas guzzling, thunder roaring monsters for me and my niece. And far from eco friendly as I said. That's FOREPLAY talk, right there. I used to restore classic cars. There is nothing like hand building body panels, hunting through catalogs and hornet-infested junk yards for replacement parts, deciding to customize or restore, getting the engine to run just right, planning the paint color and type of upholstery. The smell of grease on your clothing and the tiny scrapes and blisters reminding you of your work when you are done for the day. When the finished product has your loving touch all over it, and you've brought the thing (back) to life--with a roar--it's even more beautiful than the original factory built form. Folks, you've got to live through it to understand. --MM

MasterCaneman -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 6:50:12 AM)
That totally rocks. I love old iron like that. One of the dream machines on my personal bucket list is a T-bucket someday. I'll buck the trend and actually use Ford engines instead of the de rigeur Chevy 350. Would love to see the pics when they're done. Make sure you document the steps during the build. I have a buddy who's two-thirds the way through a '68 Chevelle before he realized that.

WantsOfTheFlesh -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 7:01:25 AM)
very nice cars to restore tho if yr speaking of the deuce then maybe more a throwback to tha 40s?

DesFIP -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 9:26:42 AM)
The idea is fabulous but to be practical, what about putting the money aside as a college fund for the baby?

jlf1961 -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 10:49:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TahoeSadist I can understand the coupes, and like 4 speeds, but Pontiac???? TS The 389 pontiac rat motor was the pontiac high pro motor. Back in the day they put out about 425hp, the company I am going to buy from has theirs rated at 510 hp. The only other choice is a Chevy 383 small block. This project should make some people happy, at least I aint adding to my gun collection. lol

DomKen -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 10:58:41 AM)
Some things to keep in mind 1) Keep every parts receipt. You'll need them to get a VIN which you'll need to get a title. 2) I would think about putting in at east a catalytic converter. Where you live may, for now, not require a vehicle to pass an emissions test but what if the kid moves omewhere that does or if where you live starts requiring them.

jlf1961 -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 11:30:44 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP The idea is fabulous but to be practical, what about putting the money aside as a college fund for the baby? College funds are already taken care of. The project is going to be a family affair, and the idea is to give my grandson a sense of belonging. He has had some major issues since my son decided to pull a mid life crisis at 28 and run off with another woman.

outlier -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 1:03:25 PM)
Why do you say the engine did not show up until the late 60s? Pontiac brought out the 389 in 59. I understand using one for sentimental reasons. There is a fair amount of hot rod equipment available for the 389, 421, 455 block. But there is much more available for the small block Chevy alternative you mentioned. And it would be lighter. Because there is so much more available the price for an equivalent motor would be much cheaper. Also why stop at a 4 speed when you could probably mate it to a 5 speed for the same or less money? Good luck with it. A project like that can teach a young man a great deal. Not just about mechanics but about work habits, discipline and how to deal with real problems in an effective efficient fashion. Please keep us posted.

erieangel -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/24/2013 9:42:34 PM)
Sounds like a fun project. My former brother-in-law is rebuilding a '63 Chrysler that had belonged to his grandfather. He was planning on giving it to my son a few years ago but at the time my son had no place to store an old car during the winter months. Now the brother-in-law has decided that he's going to have the body dipped and repainted. Everything else has been restored. The car has fewer than 17,000 miles on it--it spent about 25 years sitting in a garage after the original owner died, got towed from Philly to the Poconos and spent another few years in a garage until my late father-in-law died. He was never going to do anything with the car. 8 years ago, my former brother-in-law began restoring it. He's also got a '57 Chevy and a '65 Ford truck. He got both those vehicles from former renters that he sued when they didn't pay for the house they rented from him. He is in the process of restoring those vehicles as well and will be giving them to other nephews, as he does not have children of his own.

DarkSteven -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/25/2013 4:15:58 AM)
How old is the grandson? How will he be participating? Will he be alongside you torquing wrenches? I wish I had craftsman abilities.

FrostedFlake -> RE: This probably belongs in P&R, but... (4/25/2013 9:15:28 AM)
Congrats all the way around. But, without intending condescension (see other thread), I think you are planning to make some mistakes. Let me bend your ear a minute. You NEED a catalytic converter. It is illegal in many places to run without one, and your project does not appear to merit a 'Classic car exemption' unless you are building it with a title extant. You WANT a catalytic converter because, without a classic title, you are subject to emissions testing almost everywhere. Omitting the cat will hurt VALUE because it will be difficult to sell. You want a 5-speed overdrive. Mileage. You want electronic ignition. EI has been factory available since the 1963 Pontiac Delcotronic. The advantages are ; 1/ Any mechanic can work on it. 2/ No points, no condenser, and no fiddling. 3/ Cap, rotor and plugs last twice as long. 4/ Better power. 5/ Better mileage. 6/ If you spend enough, you can tune it from the drivers seat for mild or wild. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYx8J_5l5wY I think you should go with the $5-$7 plugs. You can pay a lot more, but you need faith. I no got. You can pay less, but Bosch Platinums last. And last. And last. Go with the open face type, either annular or 4 post. These expose the spark to more fuel. http://www.boschautoparts.com/sparkplugs/pages/platinum4.aspx I think you should think twice before going with the carburetor. Fuel injection is just too easy and just too efficient to just shrug off. Carbs are as expensive, finicky and just keep getting smaller in the rearview. I think you should get blown. Nothing beats cubic inches... except a blower. And nothing looks better in a Deuce. I think you should use an electric fan. The belt driven fan is a constant load that costs power and mileage and also delays spin-up. I think you should use bucket seats with headrests. More stayputedness with less head snap offishness. I think you should engineer yourself some shoulder belt mounts. I bent the steering wheel of my '66 ford with my nose. Brother Kevin bit the dash. Both of us were wearing lap belts. I think you should go with disc brakes all around and a DOUBLE reservoir. It's 2013. Not 1932. I think you should go with fully modern lights, including LEDs. Don't forget to light the rear plate. Lighting up the engine would look good too. I think the best way to treat old parts for rust is soak them for weeks in a 10% solution of Molasses. Don't believe? Try it with something small, right now. And... (DRUM ROLL) get a good camera and take thousands of shots starting with the first wrench you put to it. Electric film is free. I hope that makes things more fun, rather than less.

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