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What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 11:39:42 AM   
CertainlyDom


Posts: 22
Joined: 7/18/2013
Status: offline 		I'll define the parameters here as a 24/7 LTR. In that, I assume the Dom shoulders the main responsibility for everything since the sub is, well, submissive. I'll say that the Dom can delegate, like tell the sub to write checks, plan meals or such. But ultimately, the Dom is still responsible to at least supervise and monitor. Part of the responsibility is the planning for the welfare of the sub now and in the future, death, breakup or not. Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?
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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 11:48:08 AM   
Extravagasm


Posts: 230
Joined: 9/22/2004
Status: offline 		Hint, suggest, communicate, leave, learn, grow.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 11:57:24 AM   
Moonlightmaddnes


Posts: 958
Joined: 6/4/2012
Status: offline 		I feel kinda bad for a Dom that has to work all day then come home to supervise meal planning. I know everyone is different and accept that but a sub can't plan a meal without needing guidance? Sounds like a friends ex girlfriend, they wanted a meatball recipe of mine that they loved. I gave it to her then got a phone call that I did not tell her to form the meat into balls. She mixed it up and threw the meat into a pan and expected it to magically turn into balls. I feel for anyone that has to put that kind of work into someone.



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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 12:16:55 PM   
littleone35


Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
Status: offline 		Talk to him. We cannot help you wih this if he refuses to talk you have 2 choices accept it or leave.

Matt's littleone

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 12:17:06 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom
Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?


Why would I stay with someone that wasn't responsible?

I wouldn't stay in a vanilla relationship with someone like that and adding D/s BDSM doesn't magically change that.




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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 12:51:35 PM   
orgasmdenial12


Posts: 613
Joined: 9/18/2012
Status: offline 		The fact of the matter is - most Doms simply are not / can not be responsible for every last little thing. It would exhaust them, it would irritate the sub to have to wait for him to do everything when she can do so much of it herself.

In my experience, it's best to take responsibility for stuff unless / until the Dom explicitly states that they want to take control of that aspect.

Giving up everything and waiting, helpless-like, for the Dom to turn into a magician who can lead two lives and have time left over for sex and spanking and all that fun stuff just isn't going to happen, imo.

My advice? Man up, get on with it. Don't believe everything you read in s&m books and on fetish forums.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 12:55:27 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline 		I don't expect a Dom to be omnipotent. My ex husband and I divided up responsibilities according to our strengths and inclinations. So, he got the cars and lawn, I got the perennials and annuals, he got the repairs, I got the every day cooking and cleaning, etc.

I'm a foodie, have had professional and volunteer cooking gigs, and have strong beliefs about sourcing food. Unless He is Michael Pollan, I don't want to be micromanaged in the kitchen. I'm happy to take requests, and then I will take it from there. And unless the veggies are on His Hard Limit list, He will be eating them!

(I've been called a Food Top before, lol.)

Now, if He wanted to be in charge of the finances, this would take a lot of negotiation and periodic re-evaluation. If it wasn't working out, I'd take back control of mine. Having given and taken back control once before, it's unlikely that I would consider doing it with someone else, with the possible exception of if we were married.

quote:

Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?

I don't think it's un-sub like to express needs and discuss things like adults.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 2:19:27 PM   
seekingreality


Posts: 599
Joined: 8/11/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom

I'll define the parameters here as a 24/7 LTR. In that, I assume the Dom shoulders the main responsibility for everything since the sub is, well, submissive. I'll say that the Dom can delegate, like tell the sub to write checks, plan meals or such. But ultimately, the Dom is still responsible to at least supervise and monitor. Part of the responsibility is the planning for the welfare of the sub now and in the future, death, breakup or not. Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?



I don't know how grounded in reality the scenario you paint is. (Sounds absolutely exhausting to be a dom in that situation.) I know very few people who genuinely practice 24-7 LTR, but even among those who do, day-to-day stuff tends to be more like a balanced relationship. You seem to be coming from the perspective that a sub has no opinions, no rights, no initiative, and is incompetent to deal with the world. There are certainly people who are like that, as well as people who allow themselves to be abused, but that's not a dom-sub model, as much as an abusive model.

To your main question, if the dom is not responsible, the dom/sub model is already broken. The sub should either correct the situation or leave.

Being dominant isn't some God given right. It's something that the sub partner allows. And just as the sub partner gives you that right, the sub partner can take it away from you at any time.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 2:53:16 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

Part of the responsibility is the planning for the welfare of the sub now and in the future, death, breakup or not.


Actually, if you're talking about planning for retirement, I have to disagree. I've been doing this since I was in my 20s. While I might ask for input, the responsibility for my assets and their diversification lies with me.

Now, if I didn't have a will, it would be fine with me if He insisted I get one (but not how to allocate my stuff.) But I've had one for decades and just updated it within the last two years.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 2:57:08 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

I don't expect a Dom to be omnipotent. My ex husband and I divided up responsibilities according to our strengths and inclinations.


That's exactly the way we are. I'm responsible for the areas in which we've agreed. He's responsible for the areas in which we've agreed. I'm not a kindegartner that needs to have someone follow me around to check my work. And just because he's Dominant doesn't mean he's qualified to check my work.


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Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 3:52:19 PM   
JeffBC


Posts: 5799
Joined: 2/12/2012
From: Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom
Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?

Well, in that exact scenario what Carol just did was say something to the effect of "I'm really worried about our retirement". Then again, we don't exactly have a dom/sub model. We just have a dominant and a submissive trying to be happily married.

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I'm a lover of "what is", not because I'm a spiritual person, but because it hurts when I argue with reality. -- Bryon Katie
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officially a member of the K Crowd

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 4:18:39 PM   
Missokyst


Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline 		I am confused here. Are we assuming the sub is either very young or in some way deficient? I was working from 13, buying, writing checks, paying credit cards just a few years after that. I even raised 2 girls without support. Was I supposed to chuck everything on my dominants shoulders when I met him?

quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom

I'll define the parameters here as a 24/7 LTR. In that, I assume the Dom shoulders the main responsibility for everything since the sub is, well, submissive. I'll say that the Dom can delegate, like tell the sub to write checks, plan meals or such. But ultimately, the Dom is still responsible to at least supervise and monitor. Part of the responsibility is the planning for the welfare of the sub now and in the future, death, breakup or not. Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?



_____________________________

pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

“The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for.”
― Bob Marley


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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 4:56:47 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		She shouldn't pick someone who is incompetent. He shouldn't either.
If they're both responsible adults, this situation will not arise.

I get the feeling the op is a white knight, hoping to rescue a certain someone. That's a set up for failure for both of you.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 6:02:45 PM   
SeekingTrinity


Posts: 1834
Joined: 5/29/2012
From: The 'burbs of Portland, OR
Status: offline 		~FRing it~

If the person I look to to be responsible is not acting responsibly, it affects trust in my eyes. If there is no trust, then the Dom/sub model is by default broken. If its broken, it needs to be fixed. If it can't be fixed, what's the point in being in a dynamic with someone who doesn't hold up their end of the deal?

Just because Im dominant, it doesn't mean I can act like irresponsible.....ESPECIALLY if I've taken on the responsibility for another person.

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 6:04:12 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		depends on what you mean by "irrresponsible".

I don't expect Master to read my mind. I don't expect him to be SuperMan. He's human. He makes mistakes. We both do.

With Master we both act like adults and we take responsibility for our parts in life no matter what we both may think that is. We also work together as a we.

If he really is irresponsible to the point where the bills are not getting paid because he's drinking it all away or just spending it all or not working or is just a plain ole dick, then she has two choices....stay and accept it and be happy with your choice or leave and be happy with your choice.



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Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 7:35:52 PM   
Endivius


Posts: 1238
Joined: 8/22/2011
Status: offline 		This is some kind of weird gorean fantasy right??! I can't imagine anyone living in reality expecting a sub to behave like a robot incapable of thought or action without command ( forgive my prejudices goreans). Would a Dom be responsible for the financial wellbeing of the sub? Not necessarily, she/he may have a higher income. Would a Dom be responsible for a sub changing clothes or remembering you are out of toothpaste? Not really. There really is no one size fits all answer here. I am certain a consensus could be reached on moral responsibilities but yet again it would not always be true. In the end each person is responsible for what they decide based on what the relationship is built around and the dynamic involved. Keep in mind rookie, there are many relationships with BDSM that are not sexual or romantic, and yet some dynamics are only sexual or romantic.

In the end, each person is accountable to a certain degree. That line can be danced across and argued vehemently because opinions and values will differ for each person. In my personal opinion if you can not be responsible with your own life you have no buisiness trying to take on another.

You're welcome.

quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom

I'll define the parameters here as a 24/7 LTR. In that, I assume the Dom shoulders the main responsibility for everything since the sub is, well, submissive. I'll say that the Dom can delegate, like tell the sub to write checks, plan meals or such. But ultimately, the Dom is still responsible to at least supervise and monitor. Part of the responsibility is the planning for the welfare of the sub now and in the future, death, breakup or not. Now, what can a sub do if the Dom is not responsible without breaking the Dom/sub model?



Edited to elaborate and fix a typo

< Message edited by Endivius -- 8/12/2013 7:41:05 PM >

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Basically if you can't inspire someone to trust you deeply, you aren't going to be able to buy that or a reasonable facsimile thereof. -DesFIP

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 7:39:56 PM   
CertainlyDom


Posts: 22
Joined: 7/18/2013
Status: offline 		I kind of expected these results. In theory a dominate should be in control and a submissive should be controlled. But in practice that would be exhausting for the dominate and really pretty stupid, As several pointed out, both have skills and intelligence that should be used. But when one reads these responses, they sound really normal, like most relationships. So, what makes the difference for a Dom/sub (I realize relationships differ). Do people tend to communicte better because they call themselves Dom/sub? Is it mostly sexual (interestingly, I haven't seen much talk of that)?

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 7:47:18 PM   
Endivius


Posts: 1238
Joined: 8/22/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom

I kind of expected these results. In theory a dominate should be in control and a submissive should be controlled. But in practice that would be exhausting for the dominate and really pretty stupid, As several pointed out, both have skills and intelligence that should be used. But when one reads these responses, they sound really normal, like most relationships. So, what makes the difference for a Dom/sub (I realize relationships differ). Do people tend to communicte better because they call themselves Dom/sub? Is it mostly sexual (interestingly, I haven't seen much talk of that)?



There is no real answer to this question. My grandparents were vanilla as it gets but communicated quite plainly and openly all their lives. D/s has a tendency to further communication sometimes but certainly this is not always the case. You would do well to pick up a couple of books that can more eloquently elaborate than I. I reccomend :
The loving dominant
When someone you love is kinky
His needs her needs


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Basically if you can't inspire someone to trust you deeply, you aren't going to be able to buy that or a reasonable facsimile thereof. -DesFIP

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 7:54:07 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		There is no difference...at least for me there isn't. It's why I just tell people I'm in an old fashioned traditional relationship. For me it's the same with any man I've dated...be they called it bdsm or vanilla or something else. Doesn't matter to me. It's all the same.


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Nothing has changed
Everything has changed

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RE: What can a sub do if the Dom is irresponsible? - 8/12/2013 8:28:53 PM   
Missokyst


Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline 		The difference?
Choice. I choose to concede to my mates wishes because that is how my mindset works.
And yeah... it is hugely sexual for me to step behind a leader, it makes me constantly ready.


quote:

ORIGINAL: CertainlyDom
So, what makes the difference for a Dom/sub (I realize relationships differ). Do people tend to communicte better because they call themselves Dom/sub? Is it mostly sexual (interestingly, I haven't seen much talk of that)?



< Message edited by Missokyst -- 8/12/2013 8:29:40 PM >

_____________________________

pain is the breaking of the shell that encloses your understanding ~Gibran, Kahlil

“The truth is, everyone is going to hurt you. You just got to find the ones worth suffering for.”
― Bob Marley


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