This is rich....

This is rich.... (Full Version)

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Yachtie -> This is rich.... (9/19/2013 3:16:41 PM)
What it is - The bedroom tax penalises tenants if they have a “spare” bedroom by reducing their housing benefit by up to 25 per cent. What its done - Figures provided by 114 local authorities across Britain after Freedom of Information (FoI) requests by the campaign group False Economy show the impact of the bedroom tax over its first four months. The total number of affected council tenants across Britain is likely to be much higher than the 50,000 recorded in the sample of local authorities that responded to the FoI. At least another 30,000 people living in housing association properties have also fallen behind on rent payments since the bedroom tax came in, with potentially tens of thousands more also affected, according to separate research by the National Housing Federation. The shadow Work and Pensions Secretary, Liam Byrne, said: “These appalling figures prove that while this government stands up for a privileged few, a debt bombshell is exploding for a generation of people. Responding to the figures highlighted by The Independent, Mr Byrne told the BBC that "thousands and thousands of our neighbours are being pushed into foodbanks and into the hands of loan sharks because of this vicious policy”. "The vast majority of people living in these homes are people with a disability. Hitting largely disabled people with this horrific tax and plunging them into debt - surely the message and the conclusion is very clear - we need to drop this tax, and drop it now," he said. I thought England was part of the vanguard of applauded social practices. No matter, these people have healthcare.

TheHeretic -> RE: This is rich.... (9/19/2013 8:01:49 PM)
I'd need to know more about how they calculate what a "spare bedroom" is to form an opinion.

DsBound -> RE: This is rich.... (9/19/2013 10:28:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Yachtie What it is - The bedroom tax penalises tenants if they have a “spare” bedroom by reducing their housing benefit by up to 25 per cent. What its done - Figures provided by 114 local authorities across Britain after Freedom of Information (FoI) requests by the campaign group False Economy show the impact of the bedroom tax over its first four months. The total number of affected council tenants across Britain is likely to be much higher than the 50,000 recorded in the sample of local authorities that responded to the FoI. At least another 30,000 people living in housing association properties have also fallen behind on rent payments since the bedroom tax came in, with potentially tens of thousands more also affected, according to separate research by the National Housing Federation. The shadow Work and Pensions Secretary, Liam Byrne, said: “These appalling figures prove that while this government stands up for a privileged few, a debt bombshell is exploding for a generation of people. Responding to the figures highlighted by The Independent, Mr Byrne told the BBC that "thousands and thousands of our neighbours are being pushed into foodbanks and into the hands of loan sharks because of this vicious policy”. "The vast majority of people living in these homes are people with a disability. Hitting largely disabled people with this horrific tax and plunging them into debt - surely the message and the conclusion is very clear - we need to drop this tax, and drop it now," he said. I thought England was part of the vanguard of applauded social practices. No matter, these people have healthcare. Wow... you mean this is showing taxes have consequences??

DsBound -> RE: This is rich.... (9/19/2013 10:32:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic I'd need to know more about how they calculate what a "spare bedroom" is to form an opinion. Unless a spare bedroom is classified as detached villa in the back yard, I think this is ridiculous. Truth be told, even then I can't see how they justify this.

DesideriScuri -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 5:10:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DsBound quote: ORIGINAL: TheHeretic I'd need to know more about how they calculate what a "spare bedroom" is to form an opinion. Unless a spare bedroom is classified as detached villa in the back yard, I think this is ridiculous. Truth be told, even then I can't see how they justify this. If I read the article correctly, these people are in "public housing" of sorts. That is, I think the units are owned by the government, but not necessarily subsidized. I think the tax is to prevent people from taking a residence that is larger than "what they need," so as to make sure larger units are available for a larger family.

mnottertail -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 5:18:14 AM)
Rental death squads.

thezeppo -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 6:06:26 AM)
Yeah, its for social housing, where people pay rent to the government instead of private landlords for a reduced rate. Its the type of bold, cost-cutting initiative that is sure to have the deficit removed in no time [8\|]

mnottertail -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 6:11:52 AM)
I dont see it cutting costs as much as getting revenue. That's a very Tory outlook. Have you sold off all your forests now, and scratching for a few loose thrupendie bits from the skint?

graceadieu -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 10:14:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri If I read the article correctly, these people are in "public housing" of sorts. That is, I think the units are owned by the government, but not necessarily subsidized. I think the tax is to prevent people from taking a residence that is larger than "what they need," so as to make sure larger units are available for a larger family. That makes sense. They may also assume that the reason you want to have a "spare" bedroom is because you're subletting it.

thezeppo -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 11:08:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail I dont see it cutting costs as much as getting revenue. That's a very Tory outlook. Have you sold off all your forests now, and scratching for a few loose thrupendie bits from the skint? I thought it was cost-cutting, isn't it that benefits are reduced if there is a 'spare' bedroom in the house? I will have to check that again. It was meant as sarcasm anyway, I used the rolled eyes emoticon for the first time and everything. It all came in under the Welfare Reform Act 2012 which, in my opinion, makes for some horrifying reading. It sounds like a Tory outlook because its a Tory proposal, both in vision and execution. Iain Duncan Smith tried to take a case to the High Court before he provided an exemption for the disabled and armed forces. George Osborne said the previous housing benefit system trapped people in poverty, although everyone I know who is affected believes it makes them worse off than before.

mnottertail -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 11:13:18 AM)
Yeah, I aint your usual Yank, I am half norwegian and half english which is to say all norwegian, and can sarcas with the best of you imperialists. Ask Moonhead, or Polite or Peon.

Moonhead -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 11:20:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Yachtie lI thought England was part of the vanguard of applauded social practices. You thought wrong. Quite common among Americans who think that the whole of Europe is run by socialists...

Yachtie -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 11:49:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail Yeah, I ... can sarcas with the best of you imperialists. Ask Moonhead, or Polite or Peon. Wouldn't that be tantamount to asking opinion from the DailyMail or UKGuardian? [;)] [sm=rofl.gif]

mnottertail -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 12:02:05 PM)
Polite the Mail perhaps. (to read, not proffer even to yanks as a rag being of sound mind, or principled). Moon the guardian, as all right minded people peruse. Peon; I say Moon, can Peon read at all? Or is he strictly BBC and the telly?

Moonhead -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 12:05:40 PM)
He's literate old boy. Strictly a New Statesman and Private Eye man, I'm told.

BamaD -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 3:15:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead quote: ORIGINAL: Yachtie lI thought England was part of the vanguard of applauded social practices. You thought wrong. Quite common among Americans who think that the whole of Europe is run by socialists... And yet British have no problem commenting on the workings of our system, usually incorrectly.

Moonhead -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 3:22:48 PM)
No, that's Russians who have no idea how anything works: [img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-plyIOTWpAoc/UVR72sjh0aI/AAAAAAAADMY/vUxhWteqq7Y/s1600/ayn.jpg[/img]

deathtothepixies -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 5:02:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail I dont see it cutting costs as much as getting revenue. That's a very Tory outlook. Have you sold off all your forests now, and scratching for a few loose thrupendie bits from the skint? we are pretty skint, but as for the forests... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-21275432 there is an interesting campaign group over here which helped save the forests, maybe, for now at least http://www.38degrees.org.uk/

dcnovice -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 5:26:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Moonhead No, that's Russians who have no idea how anything works: [img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-plyIOTWpAoc/UVR72sjh0aI/AAAAAAAADMY/vUxhWteqq7Y/s1600/ayn.jpg[/img] "There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs." --Source unknown, alas

Politesub53 -> RE: This is rich.... (9/20/2013 5:29:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail Yeah, I aint your usual Yank, I am half norwegian and half english which is to say all norwegian, and can sarcas with the best of you imperialists. Ask Moonhead, or Polite or Peon. If you are half English, it must be the northern half. [;)] Some people on benefits get a housing allowance. This means the rent is covered and applies to anyone renting accomodation. AFAIK Home owners on benefit get the interest only portion of the mortgage covered. The Conservatives had the whizz of an idea only rich boys can have. Why dont we get people getting housing benefit to pay rent themselves for any unused room. Not only would this wheeze reduce the benefit cost (BTW most of that is spent on the elderly) Then we could force all those with an extra room to move to downsize, freeing up more social/rentable housing. the probelm being there isnt any downsized (One bedroom) social housing to downsize to. The whole idea was a sop to the right wing of the conservative/labour/liberal/UKIP party. What sickens me is several well known politicians have used expenses, paid for the taxpayer, to fund second homes, by means of dubious rule bending, then rented out these second homes at exhobitant rates. What this country needs, and has done for years, is more affordable social housing for low income families.

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