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Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 7:32:05 AM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline 		What are they worried about??? You would think they would Champion this and run proudly, making the passage and implementation of the AHA a center piece of their campaigns correct?



15 Democrat Senators complain to Obama about Obamacare
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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 7:51:53 AM   
thishereboi


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Wow, they must be racists

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 8:28:47 AM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
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Status: offline 		Clearly and they must hate America and women too

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 8:30:21 AM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Nah, its just nutsackers hysterically fantasizing that they are not shitting their pants.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 8:43:08 AM   
cloudboy


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Status: offline 		What's your idea to lower US healthcare costs to make it more accessible for individuals and more affordable for businesses?

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 9:11:17 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
What's your idea to lower US healthcare costs to make it more accessible for individuals and more affordable for businesses?


Obamacare doesn't lower health care costs.

Why should they support it under that premise?


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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 9:21:04 AM   
cloudboy


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If you don't like Obamacare, what's your alternative?

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 9:53:31 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
If you don't like Obamacare, what's your alternative?


It doesn't matter. The point is that you asked for solutions that would lower costs and make it more affordable for business. Obamacare does neither.

The product was fucked up from the get-go. The Democrats pushed to get it done rather than get it done right. So, we're going to suffer through a failed, fucked up product. Even some Democrats, as the article in the OP asserts, are running away from it.

The idea that there had to be something - anything - done was stupid. Change for the sake of change is rarely good.

I really liked what the article stated early on:
    quote:

    The Oval Office meeting allows the Senators to show themselves standing up for their constituents. That’s a remarkable split for a caucus that allowed parts of government to close in early October rather than accept any GOP reforms of Obamacare.




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What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 9:55:23 AM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Yeah, fuckin dailycaller, a nutsacker drooling hole, manned by cretins,   I don't put much stock in their hallucinations.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 10:04:15 AM   
cloudboy


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What is your alternative? What is your solution?

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 10:06:12 AM   
cloudboy


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Not one shred of journalism in that article, amazing. He needs to go back to reading Salon.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 10:14:19 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
What is your alternative? What is your solution?


A solution isn't a bigger clusterfuck, cloudboy. That's the point. Passing something just so they can say they tried is stupid. Even if the claims that Obamacare is a clusterfuck because of Republicans, it's still a clusterfuck and was known to be so even as it was being passed. The Democrats had to something - anything - so they could tout it and start buying voters.

Tort reform
Separating care providers from insurance companies
Preventing patent extension for Big Pharma

Those are things that could very easily have been done and weren't.

The Medicare "savings" that were touted by both sides of the aisle weren't passed until Obamacare because... why? If those savings were there, shouldn't they have been taken care of regardless of Obamacare or not? They were part of Paul Ryan's House budget proposal. They were touted by the President and the Democrats. Why wasn't it done outside of Obamacare?

The HEART Act of 1993 (the GOP alternative to Hillarycare) included an individual mandate for insurance, but it also offered tax incentives to businesses and to individuals for qualified medical expenditures. So, it had both a stick and a carrot, while Obamacare simply has a stick.




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What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 10:36:14 AM   
cloudboy


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Tort reform is rampant and hasn't done shit except screw victims of medical malpractice.

Get the GOP to get that Heart Act back on the table.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 10:38:55 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Tort reform is rampant and hasn't done shit except screw victims of medical malpractice.
Get the GOP to get that Heart Act back on the table.


Tort reform is rampant? Where?




_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 1:12:57 PM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Tort reform is rampant and hasn't done shit except screw victims of medical malpractice.
Get the GOP to get that Heart Act back on the table.


Tort reform is rampant? Where?




at the state level. many studies have shown it had little effect on medical costs.
http://www.nber.org/bah/2009no3/w15371.html

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 1:39:50 PM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Tort reform is rampant and hasn't done shit except screw victims of medical malpractice.
Get the GOP to get that Heart Act back on the table.

Tort reform is rampant? Where?

at the state level. many studies have shown it had little effect on medical costs.
http://www.nber.org/bah/2009no3/w15371.html


From your link:
    quote:

    The authors observe that their findings "constitute the first evidence that tort reform reduces healthcare expenditures broadly (albeit not in a managed-care environment)." However, they caution that "to understand the social welfare implications of these reforms... additional research on health outcomes and long-run costs is needed."


It may not have had a large effect, but, it still had an effect. That only means that it shouldn't be the only thing we do to lower costs...

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 1:40:46 PM   
papassion


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy
Tort reform is rampant and hasn't done shit except screw victims of medical malpractice.
Get the GOP to get that Heart Act back on the table.


Tort reform is rampant? Where?




at the state level. many studies have shown it had little effect on medical costs.
http://www.nber.org/bah/2009no3/w15371.html


A "report" can show anything you want to conclude. Your own common sense tells you a 50.00 doctor visit gets bumped to 200.00 or more because the Doctor orders tests that he knows you don't need, but orders them anyway to cover his ass if you did have some highly unlikely, rare condition. These "reports" only show settled court cases. not the much higher incidents of un-needed tests, etc to cover the docs. ass, that DON't show up in these "reports" finianced by the bar association.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 1:48:51 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
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Status: offline 		people pass off nonsense as common sense all the time. common sense is usually not viable in those who claim it.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 2:06:56 PM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy

What are they worried about??? You would think they would Champion this and run proudly, making the passage and implementation of the AHA a center piece of their campaigns correct?



15 Democrat Senators complain to Obama about Obamacare

If course they don't like it. It was Romney's idea in the first place.

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RE: Democrat Senators Running for the Hills on Obamacare - 11/7/2013 2:26:34 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		Lets see just a tad of "balance" to the OP...
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2013/11/06/obama-biden-meet-with-senate-democrats/

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