DesideriScuri
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ORIGINAL: Zonie63
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ORIGINAL: Phydeaux
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I don't doubt any of this, but does that constitute thousands of times more value? A janitor's job is unpleasant, can often involve long hours (most likely working nights/weekends), and can even involve some degree of risk (machinery, cleaning chemicals, etc.). Everyone always thinks that their job is harder, more indispensable, and therefore should be worth more.
Um. Yes. Yes it does.
I don't really care what individual people think their job is worth. Capitalist markets do a pretty good job at determining what the relative values are.
Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. I don't think I would put all my eggs in that basket, though. If capitalist markets did such a good job as you say, there wouldn't be all this hullabaloo we're seeing now over Obamacare. There would have been no need for such a program if everything was working so well. Moreover, if capitalist markets did such a good job, we would never have had a history of labor unrest or strikes in this country (or in other countries, for that matter).
The way I see it, if something is counterproductive to political harmony and stability, then it can't be all that good.
The question, then, is, why aren't the markets working properly? What is impacting the market and causing the distortions we see?
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How much would you pay a man that could save your life. I bet if you were close to dying you'd rather have the doctor, not the janitor.
It would depend. Chances are, if someone is in an accident or otherwise in need of emergency medical services, it's unlikely that they'll have all the money they need to save their life. But fear of dying might compel someone to agree to sign anything just as long as they can get medical care, even if the end result is bankruptcy and destitution.
It also depends on the quality of life one might expect. The doctor may be able to save my life, but I could end up in the poor house as an invalid for my last few remaining years on Earth. In that case, the doctor's "services" wouldn't be worth 10¢ to me.
Doctors are not gods. Just as with any profession, there may be a few good ones out there, but there are a lot of bad ones too. However, it seems that they're just being paid based on their diploma and title, not on the actual quality of their work or their level of dedication towards saving lives.
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Now, 1000 times more skillful doesn't command 1000 times more money. Economies of scale. But the average janitor might make 25,000 in most place. The average doctor 250,000.
Seems fair to me.
If you want numbers to justify:
330,000,000 million people in the us. At least 100,000,000 potential janitors.
800,000 doctors. About 125 times more rare. Worth it? You bet.
Perhaps, although there are a few general points I would make here.
- Over the past 10-15 years, I've heard a great deal of outcry over labor shortages in some of the lower-end occupations (such as janitor, fast-food worker, grape picker, etc.), leading many to conclude that these are jobs Americans don't want and use it as an argument to justify and excuse illegal immigration. If these occupations were actually paid what they were worth, then there would be no labor shortages and Americans would actually want those jobs. There would be no need for capitalists to illegally fix the game as they have done.
- In the medical field, as far as I can tell, there seems to be a far more critical shortage of nursing and support staff than anything else. If there is a shortage of doctors and/or they're somewhat rare in the marketplace these days, then I would put that on the medical schools to expand their size and enrollment so that more doctors can be trained and put out there so they're not quite so rare. I think nursing schools are also working to increase their enrollment and attract more people to the profession (including active efforts to encourage more men to enter nursing college).
- My point throughout all this has been that the whole argument around "skills" is a bit of a red herring. I don't think people are paid based on the number of years they went to school or IQ points or what their actual "skills" might be. I think that there are many arbitrary assumptions about occupations and what they "should" make based on assumed perceptions about their value. But as to "value," one man's "art" is another man's "junk." There's no logic to it; it's just what they "feel." Not that there's anything wrong with that, as it's a valid part of the human condition, but let's just call it what it is, not what it isn't.
- This isn't about what's "fair," strictly speaking. I'm not so naive as to believe that anything in this world can be made "fair." However, this is about making sensible business and financial decisions for this country. I'm sure you don't want the country to go broke, and neither do I. I don't like to see our tax dollars wasted as they have been, but this whole side discussion about salaries came about when DS and I were discussing the issue of "true costs." What are the true costs here, and what are we paying for? If the costs are so high just because some people "feel" that they "deserve" to earn such high salaries, then maybe that's something we should look at. Part of my money goes towards feeding these money-hungry egotists, so I think I (and millions of other Americans) have an interest in knowing whether we're getting our money's worth.
What's neato, is that the markets worked, to a degree, in the fast food employee market. The fast food chains were having issues getting employees, so they started offering higher wages.
Nurse shortages? Why would that be? The pay and benefits can't be terrible. They're unionized.
Now, "true costs" was more of a reference to the entire cost of a service, and not just the salary of a Dr. For instance, how much does it really cost to perform an MRI? Obviously, there are human resource costs, power costs, cost of the machine, etc. But, if it costs 1/3 as much in Germany as it does in the US, why?
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What I support:
- A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
- Personal Responsibility
- Help for the truly needy
- Limited Government
- Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
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RE: Budget Battles and the Growth of the Administrative... - 
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