RE: Dommes With No Real Clue

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Arturas -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 1:37:54 AM)
quote: It's a sad fact that a malesub will be expected to pay for a Domme's meal on a first date, and a femsub will be expected to be paid for, or go Dutch on a first date. That's one reason why she could get away with that demand, while a male Dom couldn't. Thank you, Steven. I'm going to follow your lead here as I will be the first to admit to not knowing the Domme/submissive dynamics and am glad for your reply, everyone's replies for that matter. Well wishes, Arturas

LadyPact -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 3:57:53 AM)
Fast reply..... Here is how I see this. I didn't consider the "when will you take Me to dinner" response as presumptuous. We have no idea if that was a stipulation for a f2f meet that was outlined in the profile or something the OP offered in the first contact. Many female Dominants outline such things/requirements for contact, so it's not that unusual. Most women (on either side of the slash) will say they are only willing to deal with people under certain conditions. The OP said he wasn't available until January. Cool. That means that anything else he had to say in November or December doesn't matter much. I'll have hundreds of messages between now and then, so it doesn't matter. I can't speak for Dominant males. Dominant women don't have any need whatsoever to hang around and wait. If somebody (locally) couldn't meet Me for dinner, yet wanted to yap via emails in such a time wasting fashion, I don't stick around for it. Seven billion people on the planet, folks. I'm pretty sure I can find a dinner companion.

NullHypothesis -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 4:23:46 AM)
My initial contact with Ms. Vxxxxx was strictly a "hello ... I'd like to introduce myself ... I'm looking only to make contacts in the local area at this time." I did not ask to meet, to play, to serve, etc. I do admit that I over reacted with my responses. I appreciate those who have backed my viewpoint ... I also appreciate those who have voiced otherwise.

AthenaSurrenders -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 5:00:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NullHypothesis My initial contact with Ms. Vxxxxx was strictly a "hello ... I'd like to introduce myself ... I'm looking only to make contacts in the local area at this time." I did not ask to meet, to play, to serve, etc. I do admit that I over reacted with my responses. I appreciate those who have backed my viewpoint ... I also appreciate those who have voiced otherwise. Thank you for having a mature response. So many people get pissy and start throwing around the insults when a thread doesn't go as hoped.

sunshinemiss -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 5:15:48 AM)
Sunny Quote of the Day goes to LadyPact for [sm=microwave.gif] Seven billion people on the planet, folks. I'm pretty sure I can find a dinner companion. http://www.collarchat.com/m_4597469/mpage_3/key_/tm.htm#4598154

NullHypothesis -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 6:31:15 AM)
Collarme's profile editor should come with the caveat that selecting "Dominant" as your orientation does not confer upon you any semblance of omniscience or omnipotence. As I said earlier, my initial contact was merely to introduce myself to her. After receiving her first response I should have just let it go.

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 6:46:04 AM)
No, it shouldn't. The way it is now allows people to quickly weed out the clueless. Besides, teh profile side is for those who wnat to hook up in some way. It's THIS side, the discussion side, that is all about education.

RedMagic1 -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 6:50:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NullHypothesis Collarme's profile editor should come with the caveat that selecting "Dominant" as your orientation does not confer upon you any semblance of omniscience or omnipotence. As I said earlier, my initial contact was merely to introduce myself to her. After receiving her first response I should have just let it go. Or only write women when you are able to meet in real life within 48 hours of your first email. After you explained your initial email, her response about dinner made perfect sense to me. She isn't interested in "contact." She's interested in potential suitors, and she's asking you to write again once you're in that frame of mind. It's like writing to a woman who is far away, and she responds, "Please let me know when you are in town," or, "Please let me know when you have moved here." She's interested in getting to know you if you're within her distance requirement, and not, otherwise. Honestly, you come off as a bit of a fantasist. Unable to find two-to-four hours to meet someone in real life over a two-month stretch? And writing to women you have no intention of meeting? Just like 99.9% of the other messages in a dominant woman's inbox.

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 6:53:50 AM)
Yeah, that two month stretch said 'married and cheating' to me. It just sounds hinky.

DarkSteven -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 7:48:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NullHypothesis Collarme's profile editor should come with the caveat that selecting "Dominant" as your orientation does not confer upon you any semblance of omniscience or omnipotence. No, it shouldn't say that. Mere humanity should be assumed for all people here.

Ladytisha -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 7:59:06 AM)
The only thing I expect is you to be who and what you say you are, when you assume that dinner is on the sub you make an ass out of you. quote: ORIGINAL: Arturas quote: It's a sad fact that a malesub will be expected to pay for a Domme's meal on a first date, and a femsub will be expected to be paid for, or go Dutch on a first date. That's one reason why she could get away with that demand, while a male Dom couldn't. Thank you, Steven. I'm going to follow your lead here as I will be the first to admit to not knowing the Domme/submissive dynamics and am glad for your reply, everyone's replies for that matter. Well wishes, Arturas

Rochsub2009 -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 8:34:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NullHypothesis I'm looking only to make contacts in the local area at this time." I did not ask to meet, to play, to serve, etc. I guess I don't understand why you were seeking to "make contacts" if you weren't able to meet, play, or serve. Were you simply looking for an on-line pen pal? Most people probably have little desire to simple exchange messages with people with no purpose in mind. If you want to simply "make contact" with people in the local community, my suggestion would be to go to a munch. Sending e-mail messages to random women doesn't really constitute "making contact". Rather, I think they call it "spam". If you know that you can't meet, play, or serve, then don't write to them until you can. Otherwise, you're simply wasting their time.

Rochsub2009 -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 8:54:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arturas quote: It's a sad fact that a malesub will be expected to pay for a Domme's meal on a first date, and a femsub will be expected to be paid for, or go Dutch on a first date. That's one reason why she could get away with that demand, while a male Dom couldn't. Thank you, Steven. I'm going to follow your lead here as I will be the first to admit to not knowing the Domme/submissive dynamics and am glad for your reply, everyone's replies for that matter. Arturas Arturas, I may be able to help you. You seem to be of the opinion that since the Domme is the dominant party in the interaction, she should therefore take on the male role in the interaction. She should become the suitor, and she should pay for dates, meals, etc. just as a male would in a traditional vanilla relationship. However, in my experience, that usually isn't the case. While every individual will have their own way of doing things (and surely SOME women will pay for the first date), most of the Dommes that I have interacted with have clung to the traditional "man should pay" format for dates (particularly first dates). I have NEVER had a Domme pay for the first meeting. But unlike you, I didn't find this to be problematic. You see, in vanilla dating I always paid for first dates (and most of the follow-up dates). That's simply how it is in most cultures. The man pays. It's like the old joke about prostitutes; "Men may as well pay a prostitute, since we're going to end up paying for sex anyway". While Dommes identify as "dominant", most seem to still want to be treated like ladies. They tend to enjoy being courted. They want to be swept off their feet. They like being wined and dined. They enjoy receiving flowers. They enjoy receiving nice gifts. In general, I find that Dommes aren't very different than what you've probably experienced with your wife or vanilla girlfriends. Quite simply, women are women. It does become confusing sometimes. But I have found that it is safest to assume that I should behave as an old-fashioned gentleman. When I am trying to get to know a Domme, I buy them flowers, open doors, help them with their coat, pull out their chair, pay for meals etc. At some point, the Domme will correct me and tell me the behaviors that she doesn't want to see from me, or instruct me on the behaviors that she DOES want to see from me. But until I have been given that direction, I have always found that chivalry is generally an acceptable mode of behavior. I hope that helps. -Roch

Rochsub2009 -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 9:09:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RedMagic1 Honestly, you come off as a bit of a fantasist. Unable to find two-to-four hours to meet someone in real life over a two-month stretch? And writing to women you have no intention of meeting? That's how I saw it as well. I'm pretty busy. I own my own company, I'm heavily involved in the community, I sit on a few boards, I serve as a mentor for troubled youth, I coach youth basketball, and I have a personal life. Yet, I doubt there has ever been a time when I couldn't carve out a few hours to have lunch or dinner with someone if I truly wanted to. I may have had to put them off for a week or two, but never for 2 whole months. The OP sounds like a time waster. But I don't think he realizes that's what he's doing. He seems to think there's value in "making contact". [8\|] Ain't nobody got time for that.

ResidentSadist -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 11:43:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NullHypothesis My initial contact with Ms. Vxxxxx was strictly a "hello ... I'd like to introduce myself ... I'm looking only to make contacts in the local area at this time." I did not ask to meet, to play, to serve, etc. I do admit that I over reacted with my responses. I appreciate those who have backed my viewpoint ... I also appreciate those who have voiced otherwise. I'm glad to see perceive the mistake and accept it. My mom used to say, "Everyone makes mistakes. The mark of a professional is being able to recognize their mistakes and correct them." With that, I wish you better luck next time.

Arturas -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 12:29:41 PM)
quote: You seem to be of the opinion that since the Domme is the dominant party in the interaction, she should therefore take on the male role in the interaction. She should become the suitor, and she should pay for dates, meals, etc. just as a male would in a traditional vanilla relationship. However, in my experience, that usually isn't the case. Thanks very much, Roch. I happen to agree with and hope I understand everything you said and appreciate you writing. I did hope I had not come across as this having to do with buying dinner but rather in the tone used by the Domme in talking to a new submissive. I also admit to not knowing the Domme and submissive dynamics as it relates to the initial communications between the two as the one shown differs greatly with my approach and the approach female submissives (I have known and know of or have read in their journals) take when first getting to know the male Dom and he the submissive. For example, all my initial contacts with submissives are via cmail or other email and then phone contacts which consist of getting to know her and she also me and in mostly vanilla terms and never ever ordering her or making demands of a new female submissive until we have met and developed a relationship of trust and transparency and that clearly is not the approach presented in the OP by the Domme even though the male sub was taking the exact approach female submissives (I have known or know of) take with a male Dom. Interesting that, don't you think? I also note that when this subject of an initial contact comes up in most forum threads, most participants write of getting to know the Dom first in phone calls before ever considering submission and never have I felt the Dom/submissive communications were once sided with the Dom never receptive to the views of his or her submissive person. Still, I once asked a particular alpha I briefly dated long ago why alpha women (she actually) seem to give men a lot of crap and trouble in conversations, at least at first, and her reply was honest and even predictable, "because I can" she said with a smile. I suspect this is the dynamic here, that if you contact a woman who has this outlook then you need to be looking for this or you need to move on to the next person who is more your type in vanilla or kink. But, that is just me and the Domme/male sub dynamic is obviously different since I am the minority opinion here and I respect that. Well wishes, Roch, and thanks for your well thought out reply and your time. Arturas and star

LadyPact -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 12:40:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NullHypothesis Collarme's profile editor should come with the caveat that selecting "Dominant" as your orientation does not confer upon you any semblance of omniscience or omnipotence. As I said earlier, my initial contact was merely to introduce myself to her. After receiving her first response I should have just let it go. That was precisely the thing. You were very good about following the forum guideline that says you can't use the other party's name here. I feel that is excellent. However, that means that none of the responders here have the opportunity to see her profile for ourselves, which could very well include phrases like, "I am only interested in those who propose dinner or coffee for first time meetings." I'm not saying that it did. I'm saying the possibility existed and those of us responding to the thread had no way to know one way or the other. I'm not an avid profile reader, but I do read the forums quite a bit. From doing so, I have the perception that it is women more often than men who are more likely to stipulate terms of contact. They will tell people to use a certain phrase that they have included in their profile so that it shows the person sending the email has read it or say they are only interested in receiving mail from those who can meet in person. My own profile says that I'm only interested in receiving messages from certain categories of people. (Only those I've already met, people from the forums, or those local to Me.) From reading conversations here, I know I'm not the only female who does that.

Arturas -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 12:44:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Ladytisha The only thing I expect is you to be who and what you say you are, when you assume that dinner is on the sub you make an ass out of you. quote: ORIGINAL: Arturas quote: It's a sad fact that a malesub will be expected to pay for a Domme's meal on a first date, and a femsub will be expected to be paid for, or go Dutch on a first date. That's one reason why she could get away with that demand, while a male Dom couldn't. Thank you, Steven. I'm going to follow your lead here as I will be the first to admit to not knowing the Domme/submissive dynamics and am glad for your reply, everyone's replies for that matter. Well wishes, Arturas Thank you for this view. I always buy and never considered making a sub buy the dinner, so perhaps I am not so much in the minority thinking here as I, well, as I thought. But, when I look at this closer, did the OP really meet a submissive who is trying to look like a Domme and so triggered my internal "she is insecure" sensor I have when in fact she is a submissive being awkward at being a Domme? I suppose not, since most here feel she was right and the submissive was wrong. But I cannot help but get that impression even more strongly the more I think about it. So I won't think about it any more! Well wishes, Arturas

Rochsub2009 -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 1:13:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Arturas Still, I once asked a particular alpha I briefly dated long ago why alpha women (she actually) seem to give men a lot of crap and trouble in conversations, at least at first, and her reply was honest and even predictable, "because I can" she said with a smile. I suspect this is the dynamic here, that if you contact a woman who has this outlook then you need to be looking for this or you need to move on to the next person who is more your type in vanilla or kink. I agree. Many do it simply because they can. Frankly, I think the Domme in question was a little bit over-the-top in her language. But there's more to it than that. Many Dommes do that because they feel that they have to. Far too many male subs get their ideas from porn. So they don't want to take the time to get to know the woman first. Instead, they expect an "insta-Domme". If the Domme doesn't act bossy and demanding right from the beginning, many male subs will accuse her of "not being dominant enough". More importantly, some male subs will get indignant and send nasty messages to the Domme. Others will simply move on until they find an "insta-Domme" who matches their fantasy. I'm sure that some of the ladies here will confirm that opinion. I don't envy the Dommes. There are a lot of guys out there who self-identify as "subs", but in reality, they are simply fetishists who want someone to bring their fantasy to life. Submission is far less important to them than getting their kinky itch scratched. Topping from the bottom is the norm, and the ladies are usually expected to act more like service tops than actual Dommes. It's a tough situation. The Dommes have to weed through a lot of frogs before they find a single prince. Frankly, I think it's fair to say that 90% of the male "subs" are frogs. I get embarrassed when I see how some of the male subs behave. And I don't have to weed through 100 emails per week like the ladies do.

Rochsub2009 -> RE: Dommes With No Real Clue (12/6/2013 1:22:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact I have the perception that it is women more often than men who are more likely to stipulate terms of contact. They will tell people to use a certain phrase that they have included in their profile so that it shows the person sending the email has read it or say they are only interested in receiving mail from those who can meet in person. I agree completely. As a male sub, I probably look at a lot more Domme profiles than you do, and that is exactly my experience. I doubt that many male Doms put specific instructions in their profile like "Begin any correspondence with me with the phrase 'Thank you Mistress XYZ' to prove that you've actually read my profile." But I see instructions like that quite often in Domme profiles. I think the issue is that men are much more visually oriented than women are. So they'll see a hot picture, and zap off an email reply without even taking the time to read the profile to see if they're a match with that particular Domme. So to minimize the garbage emails that they have to weed through, the Dommes include instructions like the one I mentioned above to eliminate the messages from horny guys who didn't even take the time to read their profile. While both Doms and Dommes identify as dominant partners, I think it's clear that the experiences of male Doms and female Dommes can be quite different.

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