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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 3:14:10 PM   
Arturas


Posts: 3245
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wanderingjew

quote:

Would it all the old-timers or only the old-timers who no longer can use newbies to stroke their egos and play queen bee on this side? I am certain there are old-timers who would support and never run afoul of a harshly focused politeness rule. I suspect more regulars would enter and stay than leave and CM advertisers would benefit because they are not here to stroke their egos, they already have a healthy ego in the real world that need not be stroked on the backs of newbies and they will socialize and communicate and debate with an agreeable demeanor and a class of distinction.

You may well be right, however, my experience on a number of different discussion groups over the years tells me otherwise.


I am a romantic idealist. You are a realist. The middle point is where we meet.

Arturas

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 5:05:26 PM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		So..... when a newbie comes on and makes an ass of him/herself, we are supposed to be all sweetness and light to them? And the golden shower thread is a fairly typical read of this particular genre.

What I see on a regular basis is new people coming in and posting idiotic stuff, then getting butt hurt when people are ...............less than supportive.

What I also see is new people coming in, being intelligently engaged in what is going on and succeeding and ascending to delirious heights - one that springs to mind is AthenaSurrenders (I think is her nick). She is all of 21, articulate, intelligent and well worth reading. She writes more than one sentence and typically has a point. And a point of view.

So.......... who do you think we should encourage?
I know which type I would rather read on a regular basis.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 8:07:08 PM   
reverencia


Posts: 6
Joined: 1/28/2013
Status: offline 		FR

I may be a little late to the thread, but considering I might qualify as one of the new posters I thought I'd add a few thoughts. I obviously speak only for myself.

I posted an introductory message a while back and haven't posted anything since. For me, that fact has little or nothing to do with feeling unwelcome, too snowflakey, or too clueless to understand simple (and fairly standard) forum guidelines. Rather, it has much more to do with the fact that I really haven't had any question on my mind. I also haven't felt that I could contribute with any kind of helpful authority on questions posed by others.

But I've been lurking. Reading.

That brings me to something I suspect is pretty common on all internet forums: only a fraction of the traffic actually posts with any kind of regularity, if at all. There are always vast more numbers that read and - for whatever reason - simply don't post.

I think the suggestion for encouraging new members to start off in some of the off-topic sections was a really good one. I may check those out myself!

At the risk of sounding like needing a coddle, another suggestion might be for some of the more established folks to set up open discussion topics on a fairly regular basis. It can be intimidating to start discussion threads with a zero-post history, but if they are established for that purpose perhaps newish people may feel a little more comfortable to speak up. Just a thought.

FWIW, I enjoy reading here. I am looking forward to what's being planned in the new year.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 8:37:29 PM   
Rawni


Posts: 1175
Status: offline 		Back a number of years ago, there were many, many thousands of people visiting these forums. We had bulls with horns doing war, we had dom on dom ready to knife one another in dark alleys if they could find themselves there, we had some of the funniest threads I have ever read anywhere because of the humor of the masses. We had information sharing like no other time and meaty threads that went on for days and page after page of information. We had disputes, we all laughed. We hated, we loved. Newbies came and went, people were comforted in death, break ups... illness, loss of all sorts and past events.

You stuck your neck out and you might get your head lopped off, but you also knew where you could come for anything you really needed.

I won't say what I think about a lot of things, but this is just what was. We had huge numbers and not everyone was just reading. It was cut throat... it was alive and you could just about pee your pants or freak your neighbors laughing.

We were in an adult world... whether we acted like it or not and it worked.

< Message edited by Rawni -- 12/22/2013 9:17:17 PM >

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 8:54:53 PM   
ResidentSadist


Posts: 12580
Joined: 2/11/2007
From: a mean old Daddy, but I like you - Joni Mitchell
Status: offline 		^ You're talking pre 2010... maybe 2011?

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 8:55:48 PM   
Rawni


Posts: 1175
Status: offline 		Way before then. lol

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 9:32:26 PM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

but it isn't a mature argument to say, "Leave if you don't like it."

Sorry-wasn't trying to imply that I was saying that in any way shape or form. I was simply genuinely curious who someone who sounded as if they had some serious dislike would keep hanging around.
(Notes that he never got answered either)

Personally I don't buy into the special snowflake BS.
I don't care squat for PC-I think it acts as an obstacle to truth.
And I don't really give a flying fuck if I hurt an idiots feelings.

Now this is JMHO, and that's it.Mine.I ain't forcing it on anyone or telling others there way is wrong.
But where I come from, everything is always on the table all the time. The people I run with speak their minds point blank, the other persons feelings be damned. We shoot from the hip and there are no holds barred.My family is the same way.
So am I. Both in real life and here.

Personally I don't get all the whining or need to protect/watch out/cushion the new peeps.
WTF? We were all new once. We managed to make it through.
And for crying out loud, this place ain't that tough.
First, it's the fucking net. I mean fuck,how someone gonna hurt me on here. Second, being here really only means thinking a smidge before ya post,be somewhat polite, don't act like a fucking ass and don't attack posters. It ain't complex.
But it ain't for the thin-skinned...like any other freaking forum (Hey, put yourself out there, you get the rewards and attention that comes with posting to the world...and the drawbacks too.Which means, well, people gonna take shots. That's the nature of life)
This is BDSM we discuss. It ain't for lightweights and it ain't for kids. It's potentially lethal acts and as such, should perhaps be practiced by, shall we say, emotionally stable people. If ya can't handle a stranger saying something negative on the web,maybe, just maybe this isn't the thing for you

So fuck them. Fuck their feelings too. Triple fuck their tender sensibilities And if they're hawt, well,maybe fuck a couple more places too.
Life ain't easy.It ain't fun and games. It ain't all warm and fuzzy.
But life, and me, are in your face real.
Which is how I respond on here.

At this point I might add that this sounds all tough and harsh, and yeah,I may call out an idjit or two when I think its called for,but I've been on here a looooong time and never once been modded and haven't gotten a gold letter in so long I can't recall the last one I got-it's think its been at least three years.

Frankly too, I think a substantial portion of the people here who make OP's are fakes picking our brains to make them better scammers. It's not as bad as it's been in the past (Say three years ago or so,I would bet 100 grand 50% of the posts originated in Ghana). It's not that difficult to see.
Then there's the people who simply post idiocy and babble about ridiculousness.
Likely some LE too.
Each of these parties I'm gonna respond accordingly...which is one of the things I like best about this madhouse-any nimrod can post damn near anything within the bounds of TOS...but that also means that, if I choose, I get to reply.

(Course, I stay away from P&R,don't hang out there very much.Those folk, they be fucking loopy.)

< Message edited by Kana -- 12/22/2013 9:33:31 PM >

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 9:58:31 PM   
igor2003


Posts: 1718
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

So..... when a newbie comes on and makes an ass of him/herself, we are supposed to be all sweetness and light to them? And the golden shower thread is a fairly typical read of this particular genre.

What I see on a regular basis is new people coming in and posting idiotic stuff, then getting butt hurt when people are ...............less than supportive.

What I also see is new people coming in, being intelligently engaged in what is going on and succeeding and ascending to delirious heights - one that springs to mind is AthenaSurrenders (I think is her nick). She is all of 21, articulate, intelligent and well worth reading. She writes more than one sentence and typically has a point. And a point of view.

So.......... who do you think we should encourage?
I know which type I would rather read on a regular basis.


So, a new person goes to a kink related website, goes to a section of that site where "discussions" take place, and asks a question about a kink that he is interested in. Exactly how is that making an ass of himself? The only thing I can see is that you don't share the same kink, so you see it as an opportunity to rag on them. But then you see someone that you can identify with, and of course THAT person is okay.

So who should be encouraged? I think that just because you don't share a person's particular kink they shouldn't be DIScouraged. If you don't like what someone has to say...or ask...just go on to a different thread. Or do people need that frequent opportunity to put other people down in order to inflate their own ego?

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/22/2013 10:49:18 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		Some of these posts on the last page or two, have actually been encouraging.

I know I've said more than My share on this thread. I'm going to say just a bit more. Somebody, just today, said I was a pretty good orator. Now, I don't know about all of that. I just speak the way that I do and, every once in a while, somebody listens.

A long time ago, before I was ever on the net, one of the leather folks who helped to shape who I am today told Me two things that have stuck with Me these fifteen years back. The first one is "you get the community that you deserve". I've never taken that to mean that it was all going to be roses and sunshine because, I personally feel, that I have a good intent. There are lots of folks here who can manage this thing that I can't possibly do. They are always friendly, always warm, and, whatever it is, I know I don't live up to it. If their posts reflect who they are, they never have a bad day.

The same person gave Me another part of wisdom and that was "play the tape to the end". That means, you'd better look at possible, reasonable outcomes. What you do today does have an effect on tomorrow.

I've told this story a number of times around here. Those fifteen years ago, I went to My first munch. I can't tell you the name of every person that I met, but I know the name of the author that was recommended to Me. Better than a book, I got a lesson. It taught Me that I was responsible for My education. It wasn't on everybody else. If I wanted to learn, it was on Me. Nobody was going to spoon feed Me or pat Me on the head. If I wanted it, I would do something about it. I'd have to make an effort.

Yes. It meant that I would walk before I'd run, and I'd fall down, sometimes. I'd get up, dust Myself off, and the decision is Mine. Every. Time.

You ARE going to get what you deserve. Fuck! That shit is all over the country. It's in Denver, and it's in San Fran, and little corners of GA. Aren't you listening? This "all inclusive" bullshit is WHY this place and our clubs and events aren't what they used to be. You CAN'T have it both ways. Retain new posters? Really? During the holiday season, of all times?

No. The good old days weren't always good. We can learn. We can improve. Sorting the wheat from the shaft still applies.

Some of that stuff still works. You can't argue with success.




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Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 3:59:35 AM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003


quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

So..... when a newbie comes on and makes an ass of him/herself, we are supposed to be all sweetness and light to them? And the golden shower thread is a fairly typical read of this particular genre.

What I see on a regular basis is new people coming in and posting idiotic stuff, then getting butt hurt when people are ...............less than supportive.

What I also see is new people coming in, being intelligently engaged in what is going on and succeeding and ascending to delirious heights - one that springs to mind is AthenaSurrenders (I think is her nick). She is all of 21, articulate, intelligent and well worth reading. She writes more than one sentence and typically has a point. And a point of view.

So.......... who do you think we should encourage?
I know which type I would rather read on a regular basis.


So, a new person goes to a kink related website, goes to a section of that site where "discussions" take place, and asks a question about a kink that he is interested in. Exactly how is that making an ass of himself? The only thing I can see is that you don't share the same kink, so you see it as an opportunity to rag on them. But then you see someone that you can identify with, and of course THAT person is okay.

So who should be encouraged? I think that just because you don't share a person's particular kink they shouldn't be DIScouraged. If you don't like what someone has to say...or ask...just go on to a different thread. Or do people need that frequent opportunity to put other people down in order to inflate their own ego?



It did sound a bit as if I called the author of the golden shower post an ass, didn't it. Perhaps I should have said that he came across as looking more for people to pee on him, than interested in how his kink looked or appealed to others. Perhaps if he had worded it a bit differently, he would have received more positive replies. As it was, it came across to me as being a very thinly veiled attempt to find someone that shared his kink. I certainly don't distain that particular kink - my late dom did that particular kink to me once, and it came across as a very dominant act, and completely did it for me. If he had taken a minute to think out what he wanted to say, he might have actually started a thread with some worth - ie - "I love golden showers, but don't understand why. I would be interested in hearing from like minded others, who can explain what it is that they enjoy about it. " . This probably would have gotten a whole different reception than the original thread.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 4:39:10 AM   
Zonie63


Posts: 2826
Joined: 4/25/2011
From: The Old Pueblo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12
It did sound a bit as if I called the author of the golden shower post an ass, didn't it. Perhaps I should have said that he came across as looking more for people to pee on him, than interested in how his kink looked or appealed to others. Perhaps if he had worded it a bit differently, he would have received more positive replies. As it was, it came across to me as being a very thinly veiled attempt to find someone that shared his kink.


This may point up part of the issue here, since it's not all that easy to read between the lines and gauge what someone is thinking or what their motivation for posting might be. Personally, I tend to just take a post literally, at face value, rather than assume any hidden agenda or ulterior motive.

The issue may not be that people are mean or harsh or that new posters are thin-skinned precious snowflakes, but if someone is accused of having an ulterior motive without proper evidence (and someone bases their response on that faulty assumption), then that might be a bit more serious than just a few harsh words.

I think most people can handle a bit of harsh talk, but if someone makes an assumption about someone else that isn't true, then that might bring about an escalation.



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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 4:59:36 AM   
JstAnotherSub


Posts: 6174
Status: offline 		If someone is here to only feed their kink, why should anyone care? It is a kink site. If someone comes on and says "I wonder if any shaved head midgets would poop in my mouth while an amazon woman pees on my dick and squeezes my balls?", why should anyone jump on them and tell them that they cannot post that because this is the discussion side?

Some are here to feed their kink, and I think it is absolute denial to think that the only folks that read these forums are the ones who post regularly. I would bet that no matter what "strange" request posted, someone, somewhere is turned on by it and would like to try it. While the odds of that person being close enough to the one posting are small, it could happen. There are some folks who are perfectly happy being a fetish delivery system and yay for them.

Some here want to discuss the leather ways and what they mean, some want to discuss gorean ways and what they mean, some are looking for play partners, some looking for relationships. some just looking to chat with folks and hope that perhaps, since being kinky is kind of a given to be here, they may find someone they have something in common with. If not, there are discussions about all types of things and it is fun yanno.

It would take people actually being tolerant of people who have different objectives for being here and realizing that a kink site should be a place someone can come and, well, discuss getting their kink on. Someone who arrives with their dick in their hand or a dildo in their pussy looking to get off just might have some great thoughts to share, once they get their rocks off or once they figure out it just aint gonna happen. But if they are chased off from post one, we will never know.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 5:03:21 AM   
ChatteParfaitt


Posts: 6562
Joined: 3/22/2011
From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
Status: offline 		I agree with this sentiment, and think there should be a specific subsection for it.

I also think there should be a separate subsection for those wishing to drive traffic to their profile.

It's why some people come here, so why not give it to them? The subsections as they are now make zero sense.

Why have an Ask a Master section when anyone can respond.



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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 10:03:38 AM   
DsCouple23


Posts: 78
Joined: 11/10/2013
Status: offline 		I would say for me in past 2-2.5 yrs of being on the site in diff capacities. The biggest thing i see as a problem, is the negative way a post is written to a relative Noob.

It seems a large amt of older Master's on here, talk very condescending in tone on their post's to noob's. Instead of adapting a more "fatherly, or motherly" approach, or a "warm and friendly" kind of response.

Now i'm not saying this applies to all post's.

For instance if someone post's about "what is a kink?", i'd say most responses would be "go to google" , because that's just pure laziness.

I guess what i am saying is, when a noob posts a genuine question, be chill about the response, instead of bashing or flaming them. If you think about it (i have alligator skin, so it really doesn't matter as much for me), but a lot of noob's would be turned off if their first experience with BDSM Msg Board is basically a "making you feel stupid for even asking that question" type of response(s).

Why not have a point system for Veteran posters, that Noobs can click +1, for "good advice", then it's a way for og posters to earn more credibility as well, and gives them incentive to give good advice, like a counselor, instead of brash/tough talk advice.

Think about it, not too many people like being talked to like a drill sgt. talks to his squad. More people are receptive to a counselor type attitude.

Just my 2 c.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 10:25:23 AM   
tiggerspoohbear


Posts: 19141
Joined: 6/27/2010
Status: offline 		The problem with rating a post, as I see I it, is that one poster may take offense at the advice given. Then the advice giver, who may just be blunt, will get nothing but negative ratings from others.

That's not fair either. What may be construed as positive feedback by one may not be by someone who needs to be "coddled".

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 10:27:10 AM   
DsCouple23


Posts: 78
Joined: 11/10/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tiggerspoohbear

The problem with rating a post, as I see I it, is that one poster may take offense at the advice given. Then the advice giver, who may just be blunt, will get nothing but negative ratings from others.

That's not fair either. What may be construed as positive feedback by one may not be by someone who needs to be "coddled".


Right but bluntness in the real world to most people is perceived as combative/negative, and usually comes with some aggressive tone.

Most people cannot be spoken to in a blunt tone. It's really not for most people. Whats best of most people is a tactful, informative positive response. IMO

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Profile   Post #: 436
RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 10:42:08 AM   
tiggerspoohbear


Posts: 19141
Joined: 6/27/2010
Status: offline 		I have family and friends who tell it like it is. I do so myself. But I've learned to coach it in more sympathetic terms most of the time. There are however instances where calling someone out on their douchecanouechery is necessary. They just don't & won't get it, a clue by four can help.

I've seen it happen here and chat rooms for about 12 or so years now. It's the Internet, an awful lot of people hide behind their keyboards and play the fearless, rude card. It took me awhile to develop a thick skin, I thought everyone was like me. The same in person as on the webz. Boy o boy, lesson learned right quick there. I'm still me, IRL or here, I've just learned to hold back with certain people until I'm sure of their intentions.

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 10:45:43 AM   
RedMagic1


Posts: 6470
Joined: 5/10/2007
Status: offline 		About post and poster ratings:

I don't think any mechanism that can be abused by a sock puppet army is going to fly here. Nor should it.

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- 15th century Aztec

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 10:49:55 AM   
DsCouple23


Posts: 78
Joined: 11/10/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

About post and poster ratings:

I don't think any mechanism that can be abused by a sock puppet army is going to fly here. Nor should it.


They do it on Yahoo, and it isn't abused... they do it many places and it's pretty straightforward. Just limit the "+1" to one per user, then they would have to make 100 users to get 100 fake votes, but also, you could install a system that picks up on patterns of accounts all liking one user's posts over and over, then have flags in place for specific ranges of +1's.

RE: tigger'spoohbear

I'm very no nonsense either, ex-military. But, honestly it's better to speak the language of the poster... and if you see they are a Noob, welcome them with open arms... no need to be negative, unless of course the community itself doesn't like to grow?

J

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RE: What can we do to retain new posters? - 12/23/2013 11:01:17 AM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DsCouple23

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

About post and poster ratings:

I don't think any mechanism that can be abused by a sock puppet army is going to fly here. Nor should it.


Just limit the "+1" to one per user, then they would have to make 100 users to get 100 fake votes, but also, you could install a system that picks up on patterns of accounts all liking one user's posts over and over, then have flags in place for specific ranges of +1's.



You weren't here for the Canadian Lesbian Invasion where one person created somewhere between 10 and 50 sock accounts (I'm not sure what the final tally was) and took over the boards. The idea of forum ratings gets a resounding Hell No from me and I suspect such a system would get side-eyed by anyone who was around for that fiasco. Also, too much coding would be involved with implementing it and a system to prevent abuse.


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30 Fluffy Points
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