soldier explains war- 21 min video

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

soldier explains war- 21 min video

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> soldier explains war- 21 min video

Page: [1]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/4/2006 3:54:00 PM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6232757351172260101

An American Sodier, expplains the massacre gong on in Iraq. "I didn't sign up to kill womasn and childdren."

Profile

Post #: 1

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 2:14:01 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

It has been mentioned a lot of European TV that the American forces approach is misguided and is having the effect of turning the Iraqi population hostile. This soldier is saying as much.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Profile

Post #: 2

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 2:35:33 AM

irishbynature

Posts: 551
Joined: 5/11/2006
Status: offline

I think we will hear more stories like this one has this war continues. I worry about our troops and their safety. I say, "Bring um Home" not "Bring it On".
Warmly,
Irish

_____________________________

What seems nasty, painful, or evil, can become a source of beauty, joy, and strength, for those who have the vision to recognize it as such. Henry Miller

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Profile

Post #: 3

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 7:04:26 AM

JohnWarren

Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

It has been mentioned a lot of European TV that the American forces approach is misguided and is having the effect of turning the Iraqi population hostile. This soldier is saying as much.

That's been my objection too. I don't care how noble someone's motives are, when they lock up my brother, blow up my mother's house and shoot my son, I'm gonna get pissed.

It's like the guys at Gitmo. I agree they all hate America and might well be a danger to us, but I'm not sure at all that they hated us when they were first dumped there. Locking someone up for three years does not make them your buddy.

_____________________________

www.lovingdominant.org

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Profile

Post #: 4

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 10:00:59 AM

NastyDaddy

Posts: 957
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline

Funny how this soldier has a glaring speech impediment (severe stuttering) which would have precluded his eligibility to serve in the US military... his camo shirt could have been bought at the Salvation Army store for $1.

I'm not impressed and consider the posted video a total rouge, stacked for political/propaganda impact... severely starved of basic potential fact.

As an equal time measure, scroll up and down the list of videos at Google and watch some other vids, with real soldiers in them.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Profile

Post #: 5

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 10:07:20 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

There has been several American soldiers (even serving soldiers) on respected news programmes on this side of the Atlantic giving similar stories with nothing to doubt their authenticity. The unease some American soldiers have with their orders has been sporadically hitting the news here.

(in reply to NastyDaddy)

Profile

Post #: 6

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 10:49:32 AM

GMRTGS

Posts: 47
Joined: 8/29/2005
Status: offline

The film is bogus, the person named as a US Army Ranger does not exist on active duty ,nor has been on active duty in any Ranger battalion ,nor has attended Ranger School at Ft.Benning.

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Profile

Post #: 7

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/5/2006 1:06:19 PM

Kedikat

Posts: 680
Joined: 4/20/2006
Status: offline

I saw this video quite a while ago.
I had my doubts.
The really sad thing is it seems impossible to find information from a solid source either way. The net is filled with blog and forum rants. All sorts of details about what he is wearing, if it is correct. But that means little. He could be wearing anything. One link has a quote from a military official stating there is no record of that name in that unit. But even that site was not very solid.

There is a very intentional and organized/disorganized war of disinformation being fought by pros and amatuers on both sides, that is burying real facts.

But, there are very real investigations going on, into likely horrors in Iraq by military personnel. This other sort of stuff helps to create a haze of doubt about everything.

(in reply to pahunkboy)

Profile

Post #: 8

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/6/2006 5:07:52 AM

pahunkboy

Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline

i dont know if it is real...but i do know 2 guys- 1 just back from iraq- 1 still there.

things are "messed up". that is their position. read into that anything you like.

if you get a chance check out the series "off to war" filmed by a small town dude in arkansas.... it is interesting.

(in reply to Kedikat)

Profile

Post #: 9

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 5:10:22 AM

pantera

Posts: 210
Joined: 1/7/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: NastyDaddy

Funny how this soldier has a glaring speech impediment (severe stuttering) which would have precluded his eligibility to serve in the US military... his camo shirt could have been bought at the Salvation Army store for $1.

I'm not impressed and consider the posted video a total rouge, stacked for political/propaganda impact... severely starved of basic potential fact.

As an equal time measure, scroll up and down the list of videos at Google and watch some other vids, with real soldiers in them.

exactly... those who want to think the video is legit. because it serves their I-hate-bush, blame-america purposes are going to believe it .... even if the other 99.9 percent of troops say something different-

The are the same people that give credibility to Cindy Shee... (however her name is spelled) - it is disgusting how she is using her dead son! let's give her the "mother of the year" award :(

(in reply to NastyDaddy)

Profile

Post #: 10

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 5:50:17 AM

MstrDouglas

Posts: 75
Joined: 11/15/2005
Status: offline

Not only is the BDU blouse a giveaway, the photograph they show in the first minute is another. Only the Marines roll up their sleeves that way, not Army Rangers, and a tan beret (?), another miss-match. Along with the statement that he was discharged after being wounded in combat, with no visable disability...usually the only reason for a discharge after being wounded. People are going to believe what they want to, I for one have too many friends that have served, or are serving, over there to believe that snivel-drivel. I am not saying that things have not happened over there, but the ones responsable will be found and dealt with.

(in reply to NastyDaddy)

Profile

Post #: 11

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 6:53:09 AM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

I always wonder why people think it is a good thing to spread these obviously false and inflammatory rumors...
Don't they realize that they are directly contributing to a chain of reactions that will predictably lead to more violence and killing? Is that what they want? Or do they just not give a damn?

(in reply to MstrDouglas)

Profile

Post #: 12

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 7:36:01 AM

Noah

Posts: 1660
Joined: 7/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrDouglas

Not only is the BDU blouse a giveaway, the photograph they show in the first minute is another. Only the Marines roll up their sleeves that way, not Army Rangers, and a tan beret (?), another miss-match. Along with the statement that he was discharged after being wounded in combat, with no visable disability...usually the only reason for a discharge after being wounded. People are going to believe what they want to, I for one have too many friends that have served, or are serving, over there to believe that snivel-drivel. I am not saying that things have not happened over there, but the ones responsable will be found and dealt with.

What interests me is the argumentation here.

People will indeed believe what they want, even based on self-contradictory evidence so clearly faulty that a thoughtful twelve-year-old would reject it.

NastyDaddy writes to say the video isn't credible because the guy in it has no obvious disability, and MstrDouglas writes to agree with him that the video isn't credible because the guy in it has an obvious disability.

The "fact" that this guy both has and doesn't have a disability proves the video unreliable.

Wow.

I'll take Douglas at his word that stuttering is a service disqualification. If anyone doesn't think a stutter can be the result of a wounding, they are simply misinformed.

I don't know if the video is credible or not, but that is about as incredible as argumentation can get.

Elsewhere:
Anyone who believes that every American--never mind all the other participants--who commits a grave error or crime in this war will be "found and dealt with" (in any non-ironic sense of the words) is being silly.

(in reply to MstrDouglas)

Profile

Post #: 13

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 8:40:43 AM

Saratov

Posts: 1716
Joined: 10/22/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrDouglas

Not only is the BDU blouse a giveaway, the photograph they show in the first minute is another. Only the Marines roll up their sleeves that way, not Army Rangers, and a tan beret (?), another miss-match. Along with the statement that he was discharged after being wounded in combat, with no visable disability...usually the only reason for a discharge after being wounded. People are going to believe what they want to, I for one have too many friends that have served, or are serving, over there to believe that snivel-drivel. I am not saying that things have not happened over there, but the ones responsable will be found and dealt with.

Actually the marines don't roll their sleeves that way, they do what is called an NBC roll. Rangers don't wear tan berets, true and did ya notice he several times refered to being debreifed before the mission? That would be the equivalent of doing the after action report... then going out to the action.

(in reply to MstrDouglas)

Profile

Post #: 14

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 9:22:10 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

BBC Newsnight had a report not long ago about American troops that had fled to Canada rather than go back to Iraq telling the same tale as the man in the video. Of course it was in their interests to blame their orders for the motivation of their actions but also on the programme was interviews of American soldiers stationed in Iraq with their faces blanked out telling a simlar story about their unease about their orders. Not hard evidence but if there is a conspiracy it is not a small one.

(in reply to Saratov)

Profile

Post #: 15

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 12:08:52 PM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

When dealing with media reports I find it useful to start from a baseline position of skepticism, and make up my mind as more evidence surfaces.

So far in the 'massacre in Jenin', 'Bush outs covert CIA agent', 'assassination plot on Italian journalist', 'British squaddies photographed torturing prisoners', '300,000 dead in New Orleans from Katrina winds', 'Qurans' flushed down toilets', 'US Navy Seal/Army Ranger claims policy of killing women and children for fun', '8 year old heroin addict story wins Pulitzer Prize', 'captured US soldier John Adam', 'TNG memos on Bush', 'exploding GMC gas tanks', 'US ships attacked in Gulf of Tonkin', 'Robert Schiller orphanage fraud', 'French owned Target stores ban Toys for Tots', 'P&G is a Satanist company', 'John Kerry only man alive to have won Silver Star with 'V' device for added valor', and countless other such stories, my skeptical/cynical instincts have served me well.

Note that I don't even like Robert Schiller or what he does, nor do I trust or respect any of Bush's political maneuvers, I suspect GMC of worse doings than covering up defective gas tanks, I don't doubt that there are 8 year olds out there with addictions, I believe that there are atrocities covered up in the smoke of warfare, and the machinations of politicans.... in other words, my skepticsm cuts both ways.

In the same sense that con artists can supposedly only find victims among those looking for 'something for nothing', I figure that the media can only dupe those who want something too good to be true.

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Profile

Post #: 16

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 12:47:35 PM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

While I agree scepticism is in order. I seriously doubt the BBC planted actors to play American troops in Iraq or American troops going AWOL in Canada. As for American orders, British, Dutch and Italian officiers have all stated concern over American tactics, while squadies quite openly talk about an American gun happy policy.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 7/10/2006 12:50:17 PM >

(in reply to Alumbrado)

Profile

Post #: 17

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 1:18:41 PM

NastyDaddy

Posts: 957
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Noah

... NastyDaddy writes to say the video isn't credible because the guy in it has no obvious disability, and ....

...The "fact" that this guy both has and doesn't have a disability proves the video unreliable....

Wow.

Yeah, like really WOW... Nasty Daddy didn't mention "no obvious disability" at all in my post, lol

I definitely expressed my sentiment over the $1 BDU blouse and a speech impediment of a guy who would not qualify to enlist... he most certainly couldn't receive a commission.

He apparently was an earnest adamant fellow... he got his picture taken in uniform, and appeared on video as a casually dressed GI... wow, so cool... and the $1,000 bucks will come in handy from those way nice middle easterner filmaker guys.... wow!

(in reply to Noah)

Profile

Post #: 18

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/10/2006 6:36:24 PM

Alumbrado

Posts: 5560
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

While I agree scepticism is in order. I seriously doubt the BBC planted actors to play American troops in Iraq or American troops going AWOL in Canada. As for American orders, British, Dutch and Italian officiers have all stated concern over American tactics, while squadies quite openly talk about an American gun happy policy.

As I recall it was one of the tabloid papers...are you saying those photos were not fakes, after all of the debunking that has come out?

(in reply to meatcleaver)

Profile

Post #: 19

RE: soldier explains war- 21 min video - 7/11/2006 12:07:48 AM

meatcleaver

Posts: 9030
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline

I never mentioned the fake photos. I said I doubt the BBC has filmed fake American soldiers in Iraq giving interviews. The concern leveled by senior British officers is definitely not fake and that concern was not aimed at individual soldiers but the orders the ordinary soldiers were apparently being given.

Though there has been differences between the British command and the US command right from the beginning. The US command being angry at the British for taking their time in taking Basra. The British position being that since there was no army of worth to outflank them, it was pointless going into Basra all guns blazing and killing innocent civilians and alienating the local population just to so they have a body count of bandits.

It is that body count the US brass demands that leads people to suspect all the dead aren't terrorrists. If I remember similar orders had a similar effect in Vietnam.

(in reply to Alumbrado)

Profile

Post #: 20