Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Evolution/Creation debate


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: Evolution/Creation debate Page: <<   < prev  19 20 [21] 22 23   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/14/2014 2:04:18 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Substantially, we all need sustenance.  Many words are alike, can you pick out the difference in these pictures?  Hint:  There are at least four.  (extra help, Will Smith is not in picture two). 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 401
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/14/2014 2:11:12 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: epiphiny43

< Message edited by epiphiny43 -- 2/14/2014 5:04:01 PM >

LOL... Nice save!

K.


(in reply to epiphiny43)
Profile   Post #: 402
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:31:53 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Evasion signals a lack of sustentative thought, Kirata.

Oh my goodness, am I going to die?

K.



The weaving and ducking continues. When challenged for an error in logic and asked to defend his statement Kirata replies with questions to the questioner or he chooses one word upon which to focus his deflection. Because he has no rational defense. How often have we seen that transparent tactic? Too often, really. It is shallow and boring.

The Christian looks at the alleged beauty and awesomeness of the Universe and creates a benevolent God. The creationist perceives irreducible complexity and creates an Intelligent Designer. Kirata perceives a rational universe and creates an unseen cosmic mind. All three make the irrational leap from perceived physicality to some existence outside of space/time. They are all cut from the same cloth: the magic of the primitive shaman.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 403
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 1:24:30 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

Kirata perceives a rational universe and creates an unseen cosmic mind.

I don't recall saying anything about a "cosmic mind" or a "being" of any sort. Perhaps you have a quote?

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

the irrational leap from perceived physicality to some existence outside of space/time.

I don't recall saying anything about something "outside" space/time. Perhaps you have a quote?

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

They are all cut from the same cloth: the magic of the primitive shaman.

I don't recall saying anything about either "magic" or anything "magical." Perhaps you have a quote?

K.


(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 404
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 3:16:00 PM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Creation, at its root, rests on the belief that the world we know arises from and depends upon a greater unseen reality. Understood in this sense, it is in no way at odds with modern Physics and does not require a "Being" somewhere blowing out bubble universes from his cosmic pipe, or for that matter even a beginning or an end.

What it does require, however, is an unseen reality that is rational, i.e., lawful and comprehensible, an unseen reality that is mind-like, because rationality is a property of mind.

Asking again, how is your greater, rational unseen reality different from the god of religions? And how is it different from a cosmic mind?

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 405
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 4:04:22 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

Creation, at its root, rests on the belief that the world we know arises from and depends upon a greater unseen reality. Understood in this sense, it is in no way at odds with modern Physics and does not require a "Being" somewhere blowing out bubble universes from his cosmic pipe, or for that matter even a beginning or an end.

What it does require, however, is an unseen reality that is rational, i.e., lawful and comprehensible, an unseen reality that is mind-like, because rationality is a property of mind.

Asking again, how is your greater, rational unseen reality different from the god of religions? And how is it different from a cosmic mind?

What perverse logic leads you to insist that something which is not a "Being" is the Supreme Being of religion?

K.

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 406
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 4:05:39 PM   
Tkman117


Posts: 1353
Joined: 5/21/2012
Status: offline 		Well then what is it?

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 407
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 4:20:03 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

Creation, at its root, rests on the belief that the world we know arises from and depends upon a greater unseen reality. Understood in this sense, it is in no way at odds with modern Physics and does not require a "Being" somewhere blowing out bubble universes from his cosmic pipe, or for that matter even a beginning or an end.

What it does require, however, is an unseen reality that is rational, i.e., lawful and comprehensible, an unseen reality that is mind-like, because rationality is a property of mind.

Asking again, how is your greater, rational unseen reality different from the god of religions? And how is it different from a cosmic mind?

What perverse logic leads you to insist that something which is not a "Being" is the Supreme Being of religion?

K.


And back on the Kirata merry go round we go. I'll predict right now that we'll never get another simple statement of belief from him on this thread.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 408
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:07:25 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

And back on the Kirata merry go round we go. I'll predict right now that we'll never get another simple statement of belief from him on this thread.

The point of my post was that a belief in Creation does not support "Creationism," hence the part of the post that Vincent conveniently trimmed:

And therein lies the fundamental flaw in the argument from design, because a universe that is intrinsically lawful and comprehensible does not require a "designer" to make it so.

So here's a statement of belief: I believe that the accusation of trying to sneak the Christian God in by the back door is both ironic and ignorant.

K.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 409
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:13:59 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

And back on the Kirata merry go round we go. I'll predict right now that we'll never get another simple statement of belief from him on this thread.

The point of my post was that a belief in Creation does not support "Creationism," hence the part of the post that Vincent conveniently trimmed:

And therein lies the fundamental flaw in the argument from design, because a universe that is intrinsically lawful and comprehensible does not require a "designer" to make it so.

So here's a statement of belief: I believe that the accusation of trying to sneak the Christian God in by the back door is both ironic and ignorant.

Weasel words.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 410
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:20:08 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Weasel words.

I'm not the weasel here, but I do appreciate you making that even clearer.

K.


(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 411
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:26:11 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tkman117

Well then what is it?

Who verily knows and who can here declare it,
whence it was born and whence comes this creation?

~Rig Veda, Book 10, Hymn CXXIX

So what the fuck? I'm supposed to know? As I pointed out to Ken, I was simply making a point about a belief in Creation versus the claims of "Creationism" (aka "Intelligent Design"). Can't people read English anymore?

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 2/16/2014 5:47:59 PM >

(in reply to Tkman117)
Profile   Post #: 412
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:28:57 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Weasel words.

I'm not the weasel here, but I do appreciate you making that even clearer.

You make statements then refuse to support them. Then when called on it try to evade and obfuscate. It's boring.

When are you going to return to:
multiple origins
skull deformation causes narrowing

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 413
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:33:12 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

You make statements then refuse to support them.

It only seems that way if you lose track of the difference between what I actually say and your imaginings about it.

K.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 414
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 5:48:08 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

You make statements then refuse to support them.

It only seems that way if you lose track of the difference between what I actually say and your imaginings about it.

No. You made claims and couldn't actually support them. When called on it you tried snark and then you simply ran away.

So which tactic will it be now, I know you won't actually discuss the subject, snark or the merry go round?

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 415
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 6:02:11 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 416
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 6:31:27 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

You made claims and couldn't actually support them.

You're confusing me with yourself, and I have lots of links to support that claim. Here are some for starters:

http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4634449
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4582077
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4579791
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4551142

Now you're welcome to indulge your animosity by continuing this hijack, but I'm going to pour myself a drink and have a pleasant evening instead.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 2/16/2014 6:49:53 PM >

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 417
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 7:17:39 PM   
Milesnmiles


Posts: 1349
Joined: 12/28/2013
Status: offline 		Did you guts miss me while I was gone?
;-)

(in reply to Milesnmiles)
Profile   Post #: 418
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 7:41:45 PM   
Milesnmiles


Posts: 1349
Joined: 12/28/2013
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Milesnmiles
And you might be a bit premature in stating; "Insect colonies operate as 'superorganisms', new research finds", since that article say that the finding only suggests that.
;-)


1. Um, that's not my statement, that's me quoting the title of the article. Which is why it was in quotes.
Seeing as the quote marks are mine and I put them there because I was quoting you, your saying this is a little misleading don't you think?

quote:

2. It's not only what the new research finds it's also what old research finds, I can easily link to research online going back to 1989:
quote:

Original: http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/27856005?uid=3739800&uid=2&uid=4&uid=3739256&sid=21103386955211
Natural selection has made the colony a vehicle for the survival of genes

And the research actually goes back to at least 1789.
If, as you say, scientists have known all about this since 1789, it is interesting the article says;
"The study may also help scientists understand how social systems have arisen through natural selection -- the process by which evolution occurs. The evolution of social systems of insects in particular, where sterile workers live only to help the queen reproduce, has long been a mystery, Gillooly said."

quote:

3. Using words like "suggests" is how scientists tend to talk, you get that right? We're talking about a model ddescribing the facts, no matter how many hundreds of years of evidence there is words like "suggests" may crop up when scientists start talking about the model. However, that in no way negates the underlying evidence.
I know what it means to say suggests, do you?

And yes we are talking about "a model describing the facts". Whereas facts are generally always true, the model used to make sense of those facts can be completely erroneous.

"That in no way negates the underlying evidence." I don't negate the "underlying evidence", in fact I embrace it. I just don't accept the erroneous conclusions that are sometimes drawn from it.

(in reply to GotSteel)
Profile   Post #: 419
RE: Evolution/Creation debate - 2/16/2014 8:10:30 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

You made claims and couldn't actually support them.

You're confusing me with yourself, and I have lots of links to support that claim. Here are some for starters:

So the merry go round. How utterly unoriginal and predictable. Get back to me when you learn some actual science.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 420
Page:   <<   < prev  19 20 [21] 22 23   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: Evolution/Creation debate Page: <<   < prev  19 20 [21] 22 23   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.109