A questions concerning written or typed message formation (Full Version)

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jlf1961 -> A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/3/2014 5:19:39 PM)

Remember, I am a ancient, prehistoric geezer who went to school in the dark ages (pre home computer) and spent hours in English classes learning to write properly.

So can someone answer the following:

1) Has the use of paragraphs been discontinued?
2) Has proper punctuation become optional?
3) As for commas, are they still in fashion?
4) Do they even teach English in American schools anymore? How about writing? Spelling? Anything?



smileforme50 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/3/2014 5:48:28 PM)

As far as the use of paragraphs, I know that can be a problem caused by computer devices. I know whenever I try to post something or send some one a message using my cell phone, it doesn't let me create separate paragraphs. It might look like it has separate paragraphs when I key it all in on my phone, but once I hit "Send" and it gets posted, it comes up all in one paragraph.



LadyMondenschein -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/3/2014 5:53:40 PM)

Jlf, you're not "a" ancient prehistoric geezer. You're "an" ancient prehistoric geezer.
I'm a grammar police officer from the Grammar Rock Academy.



DesFIP -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/3/2014 7:56:20 PM)

Are you referring to forum posts written on phones or to academic papers printed in respectable journals.
Because the answer varies with the venue.



jlf1961 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/3/2014 8:04:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Are you referring to forum posts written on phones or to academic papers printed in respectable journals.
Because the answer varies with the venue.


Actually, I am referring to a number of profiles that are so long you have to actually view the profile and there are no commas, no paragraph breaks, phrases worded as questions ending with periods, etc.



sloguy02246 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 7:00:27 AM)

I believe a major part of the problem is that writing (i.e., the ability to put thoughts on paper in an orderly fashion that can be understood by a reader) is fast becoming a lost art, thanks to things like text speak (e.g., r u ok?, and the ubiquitous LOL, OMG, TTYL, and all the other shortcuts used by texters).

As for text which is written in a long unbroken block (one paragraph), it is usually the result if lineal thinking.
The author views writing the piece as a task to be completed, rather than as a way to convey thoughts and ideas is a manner that can be easily grasped by the reader.

I don't really know what is being taught in today's English/writing classes, but I suspect that as the instructor explains the mechanics of basic sentence and paragraph formation, most of the students are bent over their phones, texting each other about how boring the class is.



angelikaJ -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 7:13:05 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Are you referring to forum posts written on phones or to academic papers printed in respectable journals.
Because the answer varies with the venue.


Actually, I am referring to a number of profiles that are so long you have to actually view the profile and there are no commas, no paragraph breaks, phrases worded as questions ending with periods, etc.


You are just really behind the times and apparently never received your new handbook.

Commas have been outlawed.
I still use them freely, but I am a bit of an anarchist that way.

Paragraph breaks are just not in fashion anymore.
The wall of text is the new standard of haute.
No one is expected to actually read or understand it; it just has to be wordy.

And punctuation is all determined by context, unless one is being ironic... or is perhaps a like minded anarchist.




smileforme50 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 7:15:55 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Are you referring to forum posts written on phones or to academic papers printed in respectable journals.
Because the answer varies with the venue.


Actually, I am referring to a number of profiles that are so long you have to actually view the profile and there are no commas, no paragraph breaks, phrases worded as questions ending with periods, etc.


A lot of the never-ending paragraphs and lack of punctuation is the result of doing these things on the phone. Like I said, I know when I write something here from my phone, even if I break it into paragraphs on my phone, it still comes out in one long unbroken paragraph. It drives me crazy.



smileforme50 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 7:19:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sloguy02246

I believe a major part of the problem is that writing (i.e., the ability to put thoughts on paper in an orderly fashion that can be understood by a reader) is fast becoming a lost art, thanks to things like text speak (e.g., r u ok?, and the ubiquitous LOL, OMG, TTYL, and all the other shortcuts used by texters).

As for text which is written in a long unbroken block (one paragraph), it is usually the result if lineal thinking.
The author views writing the piece as a task to be completed, rather than as a way to convey thoughts and ideas is a manner that can be easily grasped by the reader.

I don't really know what is being taught in today's English/writing classes, but I suspect that as the instructor explains the mechanics of basic sentence and paragraph formation, most of the students are bent over their phones, texting each other about how boring the class is.


I HATE "textspeak".....I can't do it at all. I just can't think that way. Even if I was in a serious rush, if I wanted to say "are you ok?", I just can't picture it in my head as "r u ok?" I just automatically start typing "a-r-e".



Rule -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 8:50:59 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50
As far as the use of paragraphs, I know that can be a problem caused by computer devices. I know whenever I try to post something or send some one a message using my cell phone, it doesn't let me create separate paragraphs. It might look like it has separate paragraphs when I key it all in on my phone, but once I hit "Send" and it gets posted, it comes up all in one paragraph.

Maybe it is possible to use a style that distinguishes between paragraphs?



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 9:11:03 AM)

For most phones and tablets, you have to physically enter the 'return' symbol in your text.
If you leave the phone to do the formatting on its own you'll end up with a wall of text.
The natural line-breaks you see on the screen is just the phone breaking it up for the display - the new line breaks aren't actually in the text being typed.
That's why you have to do it manually.



theshytype -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 10:21:28 AM)

Teachers, are, teaching these things. Kids, are, sometimes, listening. Unfortunately, if you don't use it, you lose it.

^My attempt at bringing commas back in style.

Kids are writing, it's just not in the most desirable medium. They're texting and face booking and cutting corners to save time. They've become so reliant on quick text that all of the stuff they're being taught is an "unnecessary" tool in their lives. Math was questioned as being useless unless you wanted to go into certain fields and it seems, now, so is writing.
And it shows.
I'm starting to feel old, and embarrassed for them, when someone young starts working in the office and cannot construct a proper letter or formal email correspondence. I feel like a teacher with a red pen.

I don't blame teachers at all. I blame technology and the parents that allow it to take over.



FelineRanger -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 10:35:13 AM)

Sadly, the roots of this deterioration of the written word actually predate the proliferation of smartphones and tablets. Basically, the art of teaching written English began decaying with the advent of the No Child Left A Mind ... excuse me ... No Child Left Behind act. Once regurgitating answers on a multiple guess test became the priority, communication skills became secondary or even tertiary.



smileforme50 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 11:08:30 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

For most phones and tablets, you have to physically enter the 'return' symbol in your text.
If you leave the phone to do the formatting on its own you'll end up with a wall of text.
The natural line-breaks you see on the screen is just the phone breaking it up for the display - the new line breaks aren't actually in the text being typed.
That's why you have to do it manually.



What do you mean? Are you saying you have to put in HTML code to create a paragraph break that can be seen? I know I type in info on my phone and I hit "return" and put an extra space in between it so that the message in the typed display window looks like separate paragraphs, but once it gets posted....it's just one long paragraph.



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 11:37:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

For most phones and tablets, you have to physically enter the 'return' symbol in your text.
If you leave the phone to do the formatting on its own you'll end up with a wall of text.
The natural line-breaks you see on the screen is just the phone breaking it up for the display - the new line breaks aren't actually in the text being typed.
That's why you have to do it manually.



What do you mean? Are you saying you have to put in HTML code to create a paragraph break that can be seen? I know I type in info on my phone and I hit "return" and put an extra space in between it so that the message in the typed display window looks like separate paragraphs, but once it gets posted....it's just one long paragraph.


No, not HTML.
But I know that when my daughter uses her smart phone or her BF uses his tablet, they have to physically pick up the "return" symbol (from extra characters, looks like an 'L' laying down) otherwise they end up with a wall of text.
I think some posters on here use a series of dots to help break things up because they aren't doing that.
I'm not talking about paragraph breaks, just a normal line break.
It's easy if you used the proper tool for the job - a computer instead of a toy.

I don't care what people think, these portable devices are causing more trouble than they're worth.
Use the right tool for the job - it works.




ShaharThorne -> RE: A questions concerning written or typed message formation (3/4/2014 11:36:05 PM)

I stick to what I have been taught...had to repeat Freshman English in high school (the school fucked up putting me in a college prep course with a elderly man diagramming sentences and I was reading Shakespeare instead).

And then there is the they're, their, there that drives me nuts...



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