RE: Attacks on Americans (Full Version)

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eulero83 -> RE: Attacks on Americans (3/8/2014 3:13:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

quote:

Our electricity providers using Smart Meters are doubling our bills and blasting us with up to 20,000 bursts of radioactivity per hour and are actually setting homes on fire.


I really want to know how this works. If you don't want to clutter up the thread, please cmail me.


it says it was in reply to me, but I haven't wrote that...




MrRodgers -> RE: Attacks on Americans (3/8/2014 7:58:06 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
Once money became protected free speech [sic] and the corporation a person with constitutional rights beyond property...society at large is fucked.

Please expand on this point, MrRodgers. ^^^ It went over my head and I want to understand.

Americans need to take to the streets but are lazy and distracted by all manor of propaganda and media 'entertainment.'

I thought the same thing when the Bush coup went down here in Florida. I asked my kids who were in their college and military service years, "Why aren't you all storming the campuses?" They said, "We are. We do it online, now." Which is how President Obama says he managed his presidential campaign. So, that's harder to see, but effective, at least for the election.





Well I believe our bill of rights are to protect individual people (persons) from the govt. i.e., the right to assembly, free press, gun possession, no unreasonable searches, never forced to testify against yourself etc. So the person is protected and it mentions persons and citizens in them.

But the courts have now said that 'property' i.e., money...is a form of speech when of course, it is not. Money allows merely the purchase of speech and is the equivalent of the purchase of a vote in my mind. In any case if my money IS speech, I will be able to 'speak' louder than those without money. Who will govt. hear if I can purchase more speech than you ? Plus did our founding fathers ever even the
federalist papers consider, that speech could be quantified i.e., one could have more free speech in the bank than another ? NO !!

The corporation exists only in the abstract...only on paper and is most assuredly NOT a person. In fact, the corporation is mere clever paper device to allow private gain without private liability beyond ones' voluntary investment. The courts now say that the corporation 'is' a person and has bestowed upon it rights reserved for actual people.

Th corporation is owed nothing more from the protection of law for its property. The corporation thus has no political rights and has only a fiduciary responsibility for its investors...NOT society at large and for the courts to constitutionally protect it wealth as speech and empower [it] to purchase of billion$ in speech and otherwise purchase such influence to votes, this further silences the people or real individual persons and is clearly not the function of the bill of rights.

Now civil society must suffer the pure political influence of money in both cases with these constitutional aberrations and is or will very soon be...totally fucked. We can see the results and not just in the influence of the Koch brothers. There was a time when the corporation paid $1.50 for every $1.00 that labor (income tax) paid in income taxes. Now the corp. pays .25 (cents) for that $1.00 paid by labor.

Thus corp. taxes now are at a 60 year low, and an estimated 1/3 of the fortune 500 pays no federal taxes at all. They influence every law in every congress across the country and only in the interest of investors...not society at large.







MercTech -> RE: Attacks on Americans (3/8/2014 9:41:31 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83


quote:

ORIGINAL: MercTech

quote:

Our electricity providers using Smart Meters are doubling our bills and blasting us with up to 20,000 bursts of radioactivity per hour and are actually setting homes on fire.


I really want to know how this works. If you don't want to clutter up the thread, please cmail me.


it says it was in reply to me, but I haven't wrote that...


I was quoting from the author of this thread. I guess their java script that runs the boards picked up your name as your post was done just before mine.

As I've worked in radiation protection for over thirty years I really am curious as to how and what energy this 20,000 bursts of radiation per hour refers to.




BecomingV -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 12:58:48 PM)

This is a good intro into the issue of Smart Meters:

http://www.takebackyourpower.net/

Just google "stream Take Back Your Power online free", to watch instantly.




DomKen -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 1:02:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

This is a good intro into the issue of Smart Meters:

http://www.takebackyourpower.net/

Just google "stream Take Back Your Power online free", to watch instantly.

You need to stop believing every crazy thing you come across.




BecomingV -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 9:48:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV
This is a good intro into the issue of Smart Meters:

http://www.takebackyourpower.net/

Just google "stream Take Back Your Power online free", to watch instantly.

You need to stop believing every crazy thing you come across.


LOL, for example, I might not give credence to a comment that avoids facts and only serves the ego of the poster?




Musicmystery -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 9:55:54 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

Hmmm, no response. Is this a topic too harsh to look at and discuss? Or, are readers unaware of these facts?

LOL!

Kid, we lived through the 60s. You don't know the half of it.




BecomingV -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 10:25:44 PM)

Musicmystery - And now, we take time to post how old "we" are - to a poster of the same age! LOL Doting much? And, is that the royal "we" or does someone else also live in the same head?

Calling me, "kid" is a bit desperate. It's used to diminish the power of the poster. This is only used when factual arguments of substance are out of the reach of the debater, or when the debate is already lost... because you know, pesky facts assert themselves.

If you have something of import to share on the topic at hand, I invite you to go ahead and give the issues themselves a bit of thought. Who knows... something interesting might arise!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

Hmmm, no response. Is this a topic too harsh to look at and discuss? Or, are readers unaware of these facts?

LOL!

Kid, we lived through the 60s. You don't know the half of it.





BecomingV -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 10:39:33 PM)

http://www.takebackyourpower.net/news/2014/04/16/industrys-own-words-6-admissions-of-in-home-surveillance-using-smart-meters/
So as far as privacy and surveillance go, according to utilities’ own documentation and writings, ‘smart’ meters are effectively a trojan horse.

1) US Congressional Research Service report,
“Smart Meter Data: Privacy and Cybersecurity” (February 2012) –
With smart meters, police will have access to data that might be used to track residents’ daily lives and routines while in their homes, including their eating, sleeping, and showering habits, what appliances they use and when, and whether they prefer the television to the treadmill, among a host of other details.”
Source: https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42338.pdf – see page 7 (page 10 of the PDF)

2) Colorado Power Utility Commission report,
“Smart Metering & Privacy: Existing Law and Competing Policies” (Spring 2009) –
“First, the privacy concerns are real, and should be addressed proactively in order to protect consumers. Second and related, a salient privacy invasion—were it to happen and get press—could create significant opposition to smart grid deployment efforts.”
Source:
http://www.dora.state.co.us/puc/DocketsDecisions/DocketFilings/09I-593EG/09I-593EG_Spring2009Report-SmartGridPrivacy.pdf – see page 6

3) California Public Utility Commission press release,
“California Commission Adopts Rules to Protect the Privacy and Security of Customer
Electricity Usage Data” (July 2011) –
“Our action today will protect the privacy and security of customer usage data while enabling utilities and authorized third-parties to use the information to provide useful energy management and conservation services to customers.”
“I support today’s decision because it adopts reasonable privacy and security rules and expands consumer and third-party access to electricity usage and pricing information. I hope this decision stimulates market interest”
Source:
http://smartenergyportal.net/article/california-commission-adopts-rules-protect-privacy-and-security-customer-electricity-usage-d

4) SF Chronicle article, “California Utilities Yield Energy Use Data” (July 2013) –
California’s electric utilities last year disclosed the energy-use records and other personal information of thousands of customers, according to reports the companies filed with state regulators.
The vast majority of those disclosures – 4,062 – were made by one utility, San Diego Gas and Electric Co. In 4,000 of those cases, the information was subpoenaed by government agencies.
New digital smart meters being installed throughout the state can measure a home’s energy use hour by hour, showing when residents leave for work, go to sleep or travel on vacation. Older analog meters, which measured cumulative energy use over the course of a month, couldn’t do that.
“Before smart meters, what happened inside houses couldn’t be revealed unless there was a police officer inside with a warrant,” Ozer said.
Source: http://www.sfchronicle.com/business/article/Calif-utilities-yield-energy-use-data-4611159.php


5) Raab & Associates, Steering Committee report (February 2013) –
Under the heading “Strategic (3-10 years)”:
“New tools for mining data for intel”
Under the heading “Transformational (10+ years)”:
“Centralized intel combined with widespread local/distributed intel”
and
“Data mining and analytics becomes core competency”
Source: http://magrid.raabassociates.org/articles/raab%20subcommittee%20update%20draft.ppt
View slide 17 only (PDF): http://www.takebackyourpower.net/documents/RaabDraft-17.pdf

6) Wired.com, “CIA Chief: We’ll Spy on You Through Your Dishwasher” (15 Mar 2012) –
“‘Items of interest will be located, identified, monitored, and remotely controlled through technologies such as radio-frequency identification, sensor networks, tiny embedded servers, and energy harvesters — all connected to the next-generation internet using abundant, low-cost, and high-power computing,’ Petraeus said, ‘the latter now going to cloud computing, in many areas greater and greater supercomputing, and, ultimately, heading to quantum computing.
“Petraeus allowed that these household spy devices “change our notions of secrecy” and prompt a rethink of “our notions of identity and secrecy.” All of which is true — if convenient for a CIA director.”
Source: http://www.wired.com/2012/03/petraeus-tv-remote/
* * *
Did we really think that the technocratic oligarchy would stop at collecting information about how we use our phones, who we call, and where we’re located? If we did, we were naive. Plainly, there is a corporate intention to effectively colonize your home.
However, there is also a rising awareness, and resistance, as new solutions are uncovered. The first step is to remove your consent, in writing.
The following is actually written into the California Civil Code. Not only do these provide a strong clue at how the corporatocracy functions (and gets away with what it does), but they also outline a basis for remedy: (notes in red italics)
California Civil Code (2009)
1619. A contract is either express or implied. (If you didn’t say no, you said yes.)
3515. He who consents to an act is not wronged by it. (The way they do business is in writing. If you didn’t send them a letter or notice to remove your consent, you have agreed to their terms, and thus have agreed to a reduction in rights.)
3521. He who takes the benefit must bear the burden. (Utilities and their executives – and many public servants – are taking the benefit. They must, according to their law, accept the liability for all harm if the liability is enforced.)
3523. For every wrong there is a remedy. (We are not bound into something which would have us be as slaves, if we do not want to be.)
3527. The law helps the vigilant, before those who sleep on their rights.

What statutes are YOUR utilities and governments bound by?




Musicmystery -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 11:02:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

Musicmystery - And now, we take time to post how old "we" are - to a poster of the same age! LOL Doting much? And, is that the royal "we" or does someone else also live in the same head?

Calling me, "kid" is a bit desperate. It's used to diminish the power of the poster. This is only used when factual arguments of substance are out of the reach of the debater, or when the debate is already lost... because you know, pesky facts assert themselves.

If you have something of import to share on the topic at hand, I invite you to go ahead and give the issues themselves a bit of thought. Who knows... something interesting might arise!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

Hmmm, no response. Is this a topic too harsh to look at and discuss? Or, are readers unaware of these facts?

LOL!

Kid, we lived through the 60s. You don't know the half of it.



And you've just ignored the point entirely.

Yup. Kid.




Greta75 -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 11:18:02 PM)

quote:

(Horatio is a fictional character who represents the myth that if you just work hard enough and behave as a decent citizen, then you can make your dreams come true - it's America!)

I got a story to share about this, I've never been to the US except on holiday, and on holiday, it's a damn fun and fine place.

But one of my brother, was in the US since he was 18, when he started first year of Uni there. My dad only had to fund him for his first year, somehow by the second year, there are apparently local scholarships, and he also worked part time to earn enough that my dad does not need to help him financially with anything anymore from second year onwards. Fast forward to today, his now in his early 30's. His never left the US, since he step foot onto it when he was 18. He didn't like our country because he felt we lack freedom of speech, which is true. But fast forward today, his gotten his PHD, his working for a major Fortune 500 company and he has purchased 2 American properties, to be fair, housing is so much cheaper there over here. You could buy 4 big houses for 1 tiny 80 square meters apartment here.

I don't know how one foreigner into US, could manage all these things, but my brother did, I think the most impressive part was how he managed to be completely independent of my dad's finances from year 2 onwards.

It gives me the impression that USA still possess all the necessary to help anybody succeed and live a comfortable life, as long as you are willing to work hard. You just need to know how to utilize all the resources present. To be fair also, this bro of mine has always been very street smart and resourceful since a kid.




DomKen -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 11:18:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV
This is a good intro into the issue of Smart Meters:

http://www.takebackyourpower.net/

Just google "stream Take Back Your Power online free", to watch instantly.

You need to stop believing every crazy thing you come across.


LOL, for example, I might not give credence to a comment that avoids facts and only serves the ego of the poster?


Look this is really simple. If they want to monitor you they will. Smart electric meter or not. Do you really think getting rid of something well known like that would stop them? If they really want to monitor you there are a dozen bugs and monitoring devices planted inside your home and you'd have to have been the guy at the NSA or CIA who built them to ever hope to identify them.

Your paranoia and conspiracy ravings are just annoying. Don't believe anything Alex Jones tells you.




Kirata -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/9/2014 11:48:07 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Kid, we lived through the 60s. You don't know the half of it.

And we can't remember it. [:D]

K.





chatterbox24 -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 4:20:06 AM)

I was born in the late 60s and always was annoyed about that. I wanted to wear the bellbottoms with a flower patch at the bottom and on the back. LOL. I can't remember the late 80s. But anyway back to the conspiracy theory.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Kid, we lived through the 60s. You don't know the half of it.

And we can't remember it. [:D]

K.







thishereboi -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 5:10:45 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers


quote:

ORIGINAL: eulero83


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

Gas prices so high that a nation changed its travel habits due to poverty.


you actually have very low gas price in europe the average gasoline price is $8 per us gallon

Actually gas 'costs' more in the US. Most of that $8 is taxes to discourage its use. Thus Europe expanded its mass transportation while the rent-seeking capitalists bought and tore ours down. Can't sell tires, oil and cars if we had all of those trolleys back.


If by rent seeking capitalists you mean the auto union then I would have to agree. They spent years doing everything in their power to keep mass transit out of Detroit.




thishereboi -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 5:18:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: joether


Raising the minimum wage is attractive to people, since there is a general feel of 'lost ground' due to events in America. That a family of four with two wage earners making minimum wage at 40 hours/week are STILL needing many government programs (that we, the taxpayers are paying for) just to make ends meet. The majority of these Americans are not junkies, screwballs, or those 'gaming the system'. They are good natured, hard working, individuals that want their community and nation to prosper.



I don't have a problem with them raising minimum wage. However I am going to call bullshit on all those hard working americans still earning minimum wage. If they were that hard working they wouldn't still be making min wage by the time they have 2 kids. And if something happened that they lost their job and had to start over, they wouldn't stay making min wage for long because they are hard working.




thishereboi -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 5:22:24 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

Okay, and $8 U.S. equals 4.75 Sterling pounds.

But again, taken in context, that price in Sterling, for gas, comes with free healthcare, protection from actual homelessness, freedom from hunger and a free, competitive education. Heck, I'd gladly pay $8 a gallon for gas if it came with all of the perks that come with "yours."

With all the perks, I could easily afford more expensive gas.

This is interesting, though. I suspect that other countries don't really see how Americans struggle. The idea that we have it cheaper over here is a laugh and a half. No blame... Americans don't know what's going on, either, as far as I can tell.





I could be wrong but I don't think tax on gas is the only tax they pay to get those perks.




Musicmystery -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 8:06:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Kid, we lived through the 60s. You don't know the half of it.

And we can't remember it. [:D]

K.



[sm=applause.gif]





jlf1961 -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 12:34:50 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

I haven't understood the disconnect between the America I was taught to love as a child and the America I find myself living in now.

The Bush coup. The wars. The subsidizing of Wall Street.

If you are taking about the Florida recount, before it was stopped by the supreme court, it was a dead heat, niether Gore or Bush had a significant lead.
Afghanistan was justified, although could have been handled with surgical strikes of spec ops unites, black ops units and cruise missiles.


Medical problems can cause joblessness, homelessness and death.
Most medical insurance carries a disability rider, other wise there is SSDI. Other than that, this fact is true in every country on the planet.

The food supply is tainted (genetically modified) in such a way as to addict consumers, cause disease and death. It changes our DNA.
I really hate to tell you this, every food crop on the planet is GMO, thru selective breeding of the plants, as for those that have spliced genes, most of the other genes come from similar plants with desirable traits and they dont want to go through generations of selective breeding.
And it isnt the GMO food you that is addictive, Americans are addicted to unhealthy food as in Fast food, junk food, processed foods (meals in a box.)

Our electricity providers using Smart Meters are doubling our bills and blasting us with up to 20,000 bursts of radioactivity per hour and are actually setting homes on fire.
Source and proof please?

Gas prices so high that a nation changed its travel habits due to poverty.
Gas in the US is cheaper than most industrial countries.

The government shuts down and "they" still get paid, but our soldiers don't.

The marketing of madness has changed the brains of children and adults alike through prescribing drugs as if "side effects" means anything different than "effects."
Aspirin has side effects, and it was first made from willow bark.

It is not the side effects that are the problem, drugs with serious side effects are pulled by the U.S. Department of Health & Human Services.



The U.S. is inferior to 40 other countries in the rate of maternal mortality (women dying of childbirth or of avoidable, post-childbirth complications).
The US averages 27 maternal deaths per 100000 people, that means we are 48th, The UK is 36th. Estonia has the least number of maternal deaths per capita.
Nice shot at fear mongering.


Dare I mention the education of our future leaders?
We are 24th in education, the US has never had the best education system and it does need improvement, might help to pay teachers a living wage, but that means more taxes, and no body wants more taxes.

Churches abuse congregations and spew fear and hate.

Child abuse and molestation in churches, regardless of what the media wants us to believe is the exception to the rule. Cult like groups are more prone to this, or radicalized offshoots of main stream denominations.
And this has been true since the first cave man stacked one rock on top of another and told his clan that it was god. .


And, where are the voters? The ones who can get past the police blocks at polling station feeder roads. Oh, and active soldiers... trash those votes, right Bush?

I have lived all over this country, and even in a couple overseas, I have never seen the police blocking roads to polling ares in the US, I have seen this in some middle eastern countries and central American countries.

As far as the military voters having votes "trashed" never happened, in point of fact, votes by deployed service personnel are still being counted after the general election.

If you have different information please provide a link and source.

What the F happened to the Bill of Rights? (Yes, I know... Patriot Act.)

Blame both parties for this bullshit.

Torture? Really? Are we "that" guy/girl?
Dude, I hate to break this news to you, but the US and every other country has used torture to get information. It has been going on since before JC showed up telling us to love our neighbor. Long distance phone calls (leads from crank telephone attached to prisoners scrotum) tossing enemy troops from helicopters, binding limbs to the point of breaking. All used by US troops at one time or another.

Oh, and the commercialization of privacy. Say, "cheese" for the cameras and audio recorders. Type carefully for ALL of the readers.
How many Americans need to be imprisoned?
Man there are fewer CCTV cameras in the US watching citizens than in other countries.

Sadly, I could keep going with this list. The thing is, I remember becoming politically aware at age 12. I watched Nixon and the Vietnam War news and Phil Donahue (the voice of tv daytime talk). So, between Watergate, the Pentagon Papers and the rise of Scarface culture, I had no illusions about our perfection or altruistic nature. This was soon followed by AIDS and the attempt on Reagan. It's never been simple or easy.

But, if I had to sum up America in very recent years, I'd say that the Horatio Alger myths have been smashed to smithereens. There is no more "American Dream." (Horatio is a fictional character who represents the myth that if you just work hard enough and behave as a decent citizen, then you can make your dreams come true - it's America!) It's more like Nathaniel West's novella, "The Dismantling of Lemuel Pitkin" has come to fruition. (The good American son takes advice from a bank, sets out to find his fortune and ends up in physical and mental pieces, and dies. Even in death, his memory is used in service of the mythology of the American Dream.)

I wonder, in perhaps inflammatory terms, if this is a takeover, an annihilation of sorts, that we don't see because we are in it. Maybe historians would know this, but it seems to me that what is going on with the middle and lower classes of American is much like what went on pre-Holocaust. We question how the "regular folk" in Germany did not sense the malice; the pending destruction. Americans are sick and dying, struggling and suffering - because of the things I listed here. Are we focused elsewhere and not noticing the massive numbers of slow deaths?

A populous dying of a caustic and toxic environment is one way to weed out those pesky future social security and medicare bills. Seriously, I know I risk coming off like a conspiracy freak but does anyone else see what I mean? It's as if we are worker ants whose only value is derived from our ability to make the rich richer.

Your thoughts?

ETA - description of Horatio Alger reference


Look, I am not saying there are no problems in the US, but compared to other countries we still have it better than most.

But misstating facts to force them in the worst possible light is no better. In fact the DNC and RNC do this constantly.

This is just more propaganda as put out by politicians and pundits.





thompsonx -> RE: Attacks on Americans (5/10/2014 4:39:29 PM)

I don't have a problem with them raising minimum wage. However I am going to call bullshit on all those hard working americans still earning minimum wage. If they were that hard working they wouldn't still be making min wage by the time they have 2 kids. And if something happened that they lost their job and had to start over, they wouldn't stay making min wage for long because they are hard working.

So your point is that if one is not successful it is because they are not working hard enough?
And you wonder why no one takes your post serious???





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