RE: What good is morality anyway? (Full Version)

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BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:11:57 PM)

Don't give up on Saint Augustine too quickly. He has much to say in just his opening paragraphs. It does seem clear from these opening paragraphs that there maybe foundation for the accusation that Catholics are cold. It is hard bread as Padre Pio put it.

The scientific principle known as Occam's razor has its origins in the Church.

quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_of_Ockham

William of Ockham (...; also Occam; c. 1287 – 1347) was an English Franciscan friar and scholastic philosopher and theologian, who is believed to have been born in Ockham, a small village in Surrey. He is considered to be one of the major figures of medieval thought and was at the centre of the major intellectual and political controversies of the fourteenth century. He is commonly known for Occam's razor, the methodological principle that bears his name, and also produced significant works on logic, physics, and theology. In the Church of England, his day of commemoration is 10 April.

William of Ockham joined the Franciscan order at an early age. It is believed that he studied theology at the University of Oxford from 1309 to 1321, but while he completed all the requirements for a master's degree in theology (the 14th century equivalent of a doctorate) he was never made regent master. Because of this, he acquired the honorific title Venerabilis Inceptor, or "Venerable Beginner" (an inceptor was a student formally admitted to the ranks of teachers by the university authorities). He was also known as the Doctor Invincibilis or "Unconquerable Teacher."

His work in this period became the subject of controversy, and Ockham was summoned before the Papal court of Avignon in 1324 under charges of heresy. ...




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:23:04 PM)

Here are some interesting statements.

quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_of_Ockham

However, though Ockham was excommunicated for apostasy, his philosophy was never officially condemned.


quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_of_Ockham#Faith_and_reason

William of Ockham believed "only faith gives us access to theological truths. The ways of God are not open to reason, for God has freely chosen to create a world and establish a way of salvation within it apart from any necessary laws that human logic or rationality can uncover." Ockham's theism was based solely on private revelation and faith (fideism). He believed that only science was a matter of discovery and saw God as the only ontological necessity.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:31:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invisible_church

(St Augustine of Hippo) was strongly influenced by the Platonist belief that true reality is invisible and that, if the visible reflects the invisible, it does so only partially and imperfectly ...



I stated in an earlier post, that the wisest scientists of the world use knowledge along with God. I stand by that statement. Why? because as you said, its like dangling a carrot in front of a mule. Its a code quite mysterious and invisible. What about string theory? That is an interesting one. Life is energy, and the things around us bring energy. Just because you cant see something does not mean its not there. Is it really true we lose weight at the moment of death? And how does one know, when you are in a room alone or with company, that something isn't going on that you can not detect with the human eye? Why do people have so much trouble understanding the bible? Besides its even stated its beyond human comprehension. Could that be that God lives where a human can not exist?


Speaking of the invisible Church, God has seen fit to put me in both camps. I belong to both the visible and invisible Church with enough latitude to render me incomprehensible to the Devil.


Man can inhabit the incomprehensible realms of God.




chatterbox24 -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:36:51 PM)

No argument with that.
I think this Ockham guy knew a little something something.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:43:27 PM)

In other words, my work contradicts the work of William of Ockham.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:45:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

No argument with that.
I think this Ockham guy knew a little something something.


Please think me not cruel for laughing Protestant.




chatterbox24 -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 5:55:00 PM)

Catholics are cruel big meanies.
im furious I tell ya. Totally livid.
Pissed off protestant here.
your TOO smart.
I think I better keep my title.[:D]
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

No argument with that.
I think this Ockham guy knew a little something something.


Please think me not cruel for laughing Protestant.





BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 6:24:39 PM)

Yet, you have shown respect.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 6:27:36 PM)

It seems evident that Our Lady has a message to the Protestants. It is going to be important for you to be submissive to the Catholic Church and regard the Church as neither an inferior nor equal, but as an moral superior.




chatterbox24 -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 6:43:57 PM)

Now, now, are you getting slick again, and calling me inferior in a nice way?




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 6:56:37 PM)

The outward face of God, the face of God most easily discernible through the senses, is cruel, but if you are good, you will see a different face.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 7:04:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Now, now, are you getting slick again, and calling me inferior in a nice way?


In the lines that are automatically appended to your posts it says, "My crazy smells like jasmine, cloves and cat nip." In response an intellectual would say: Surely, she is my inferior to be taken under my wing in need of protection.




chatterbox24 -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 7:10:45 PM)

Agreed then.i will be a good protestant, as good as a protestant can be anyway.[:D]
I respect the Church.




chatterbox24 -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 7:18:46 PM)

Oh haha..........THAT. ..........I was a tiny bit wild then........I should change that.[sm=rofl.gif] good night.
quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Now, now, are you getting slick again, and calling me inferior in a nice way?


In the lines that are automatically appended to your posts it says, "My crazy smells like jasmine, cloves and cat nip." In response an intellectual would say: Surely, she is my inferior to be taken under my wing in need of protection.





BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 8:20:24 PM)

Though Our Lady has honored me to be in her presence in much the same way as the children of Fatima. I confess I feel mild jealousy for them because they had more time with her. It is unclear to me how to put it. It humbles me. It reminds me of how important it is to get into Heaven. Just to get in the doors and live in the most humble abode in all of Heaven.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 9:07:12 PM)

You may call me Ben. Ben is just fine. Short for Benjamin. It sounds like a nice name.

quote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin

The etymology of the name interpreted as son of the right side.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 9:14:07 PM)

You have been calling me Ben. It is better than BM for reasons that was once made explicit in the forum more than once. Yes, Ben is just fine.




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 10:29:36 PM)

By magic I mean human agency or intention. So suppose you were to hypothetically go to a witch for a love spell. Naturally you would consider this being the witch that you are. We are talking about a human intention that falls in the realm of human understanding. It just makes a little too much sense. Now if I were to approach a Wiccan Priestess and asked for a love spell, what might I get?

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

... Basically he said, no proper and decent Wiccan would indulge in tarot because it belongs in the Black Arts, not Wiccan.


Is the reason why they hope to distance themselves from the Black Arts fully within the realm of human understanding?




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 10:47:58 PM)

Contrast this with the position the Catholic Church takes. As paradoxical as it may seem it is the Church that is Holy. It is the Church that one must cling to. I realize that it is foolish of me to say such things, but it is wrong to be its accuser. I may alienate my protestant friend. She did want to know what my views on the matter were. There you have it, as untrendy as it may be.

Now it is time to listen to the Devo song, Through Being Cool
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_HH_jher3c




BenevolentM -> RE: What good is morality anyway? (3/31/2014 10:52:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

Now it is time to listen to the Devo song, Through Being Cool
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_HH_jher3c


I suppose that was a wee bit semantically noisy, but the devil made me do it!




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