RE: NO Safeword...?? (Full Version)

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LadyConstanze -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 4:54:28 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ChatteParfaitt

'Everyone's a no limits slave until the blow torch comes out.' ~ Me

Yeah, I loath those subs who offer themselves up as a no limits slave as if it has some special value. If a person can't value him or her self, than why the hell should I?



In commercial dungeons, you get tons of guys ringing up asking to be a dungeon slave (thinking that hanging around there would get them free sessions because in between sessions the dommes are so bored and so eager to just grab anybody and do all those kinky things with them, right) and most of the ones who call are "no limit slaves". Imagine it like this

<phone rings>

Domme: Hello?
Caller: I'm wondering if any of the Mistresses is looking for a private slave? (because obviously not enough of the clients offer)
Domme: No, we're all set, thank you, have a nice day
Caller: Wait, don't you need a cleaning slave for the dungeon?
Domme: We do have a cleaning lady and we are particular about hygiene, we're set...
Caller: Wait! I have no limits, you can do anything to me!
Domme: Oh that's special. Because our last dungeon slave died when the castration went wrong. You know we require all of them to be "done" and we have this wonderful vet in South America who does it for us, a bit risky.... Let me dig out the address and you call again after you had the procedure done...

At this point usually the phone made "CLICK"



ExiledTyrant -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 6:02:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze


Or in case it's a female: "I'm only here to fulfil your fantasy, so I talk like they do in bad BDSM porn, in exchange, have your wallet and credit card ready"


It's more convenient than ever...

[img]http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g272/ExiledTyrant/FinDomBB_zpseccd8e50.jpg[/img]

Jus sayin

Exiled



MasterCaneman -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 7:20:10 AM)

FR

I've lurked this thread a bit, because my very first scene I ever was part of had no safeword. I won't get into details other than I wasn't in charge, and leave it at that. It wasn't until my third 'scene' partner informed me of the practice that I started using one. I'll offer a caveat in that I had no Internet or other deep resource of information other than the people in the local scene to go by, which played a large part of it. I'll end by saying that there are times that 'topping from the bottom' pays off.



Musicmystery -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 8:10:45 AM)

No words are safe. Words have power. Use them wisely.



Arturas -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 8:59:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubSlutSlave11

I am just wondering... When I read, "...no limits or safeword will be honored..." Are You (D/M) speaking of after ownership? Or during sessions or training?? I ask bc I am curious how it goes down. Do Your hards (or lack of limits) become theirs, automatically? Thanks in advance. :)


He is being up front. You have to assume that and to do otherwise invites trouble should you contact him/her.

In addition to the submissive's hard limits a Dom's hard limits are somewhat negotiable depending on what it is. There are soft hard limits and their are concrete wall hard limits. A girl might first have a hard limit on being the target of a golden shower but after being sent into sub space for several hours and knowing the Dom might like this she will follow him on his potty break and kneel in the bath tub with an obvious invitation. On the other hand, scat would be a concrete wall limit no matter who, or not, the world is so big and the kink and people so varied it is hard to make that statement stick unless you limit the folks you consider to those you have experience with yourself.

And safe words, so far I have not been able to depend on a submissive to use them and that included dozens. In my experience, they are loath to use a safe word even though you agree on that word to begin and so a Dom must watch her for the signs he has exceeded her limits because each and every time she has simply submitted fully, who knows why a woman does that but they do, and has decided to trust him and be his for that amazing time in her life and so he must rise to that task, that faith she has in him and in truth, that is the interconnnection between not top and bottom but in Dom and the amazingly wonderful submissive woman (or man as the case might be).




Arturas -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 9:13:58 AM)

Speaking of safewords, fellow Doms. (on a "side but related conversation")

What do you do when a safeword is known between the two of you and instead she keeps saying "stop, please dear God stop, no, not like this!", with tears welling up in her pretty and obviously frightened eyes as you force her short skirted legs open in the front seat of your whatever or you bend her over a tree trunk on a hiking trail at a most unexpected time?

I find it gives Doms the ability to know she really means "yes" behind all that crying and pleading because she knows the safeword and will not use it because she really means "yes" and now you know that always which completely removes her normal power to make you uncertain about your actions and in turn stop you or make you hesitate in this common vanilla situation. This game women can play with guys minds has been completely removed in any situation like this.

So, the safe word actually gives you more freedom and power over the submissive and that's okay because that is why she is there to begin with.



Arturas -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 9:20:02 AM)

...so, when do female submissives use safe words with their trusted Dom? I don't know, but I'm sure in this big ole world it does happen. Maybe.



Musicmystery -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 9:20:42 AM)

Why would she say something like that? I've only heard, "OMG, yes Master!"

Those are hardly "edge" experiences.



Arturas -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 9:25:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Why would she say something like that? I've only heard, "OMG, yes Master!"

Those are hardly "edge" experiences.


...and that is a great question. Because they test you and not just once at first, in the first weeks of your relationship...and they don't need "edge" situtations to do that. Likely not, really.



EligibleOwner -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 3:10:06 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

In a good, solid TPE relationship, some folks will get past the point of using safewords ... These can be wonderful situations, but it's not what most people have out of the gate. It can be a goal and if people reach that, I find that to be fantastic.

Not being much of a gambler, Myself, I'd probably think somebody with that particular phrase in a profile is probably more likely to be a fantasist, rather than someone who has obtained that kind of level of TPE prior and wants to find it again.



I agree with this. It's absolutely fair enough to aim to get a relationship to the point of not needing safewords. That happens when you know each other so well, and fit each other so well, that it's just not needed. I want that again. Mind you, even then you probably are both aware of a safeword that you did use, or at least agreed on, some time way back.

Actually, that makes me realise that perhaps my ideal is to get to the point of forgetting what the safeword was. Or perhaps dredging it up out of memory one evening and sharing a laugh about it, which is what happened in my last relationship. I do think it's important in the early part of a relationship to agree a safeword so that the submissive partner knows s/he can stop things if need be. It seems to me an essential step in getting to the deeper trust that may come later.

But aiming to get to that point, and saying so, is not the same as just announcing that you're like that from the off. That just seems unreal to me.

In response to a question from the OP, nothing's automatic as far as limits are concerned. You have to talk and make sure you're on the same page, or at least enough on the same page to make it worth beginning something.



FightingChains -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 3:18:54 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

In a good, solid TPE relationship, some folks will get past the point of using safewords ... These can be wonderful situations, but it's not what most people have out of the gate. It can be a goal and if people reach that, I find that to be fantastic.

Not being much of a gambler, Myself, I'd probably think somebody with that particular phrase in a profile is probably more likely to be a fantasist, rather than someone who has obtained that kind of level of TPE prior and wants to find it again.


quote:

ORIGINAL: EligibleOwner
I agree with this. It's absolutely fair enough to aim to get a relationship to the point of not needing safewords. That happens when you know each other so well, and fit each other so well, that it's just not needed. I want that again. Mind you, even then you probably are both aware of a safeword that you did use, or at least agreed on, some time way back.

Actually, that makes me realise that perhaps my ideal is to get to the point of forgetting what the safeword was. Or perhaps dredging it up out of memory one evening and sharing a laugh about it, which is what happened in my last relationship. I do think it's important in the early part of a relationship to agree a safeword so that the submissive partner knows s/he can stop things if need be. It seems to me an essential step in getting to the deeper trust that may come later.

But aiming to get to that point, and saying so, is not the same as just announcing that you're like that from the off. That just seems unreal to me.

In response to a question from the OP, nothing's automatic as far as limits are concerned. You have to talk and make sure you're on the same page, or at least enough on the same page to make it worth beginning something.


I'm going to agree with you both. Nothing wrong with this once you are extremely comfortable and trusting between each other. In fact, it's great, and I'd love to never require a safeword when I bottom. I have very rarely used mine, and we've learned and moved on.

However, putting out there as "requirements in a relationship" or "requirements for play" seems... a little reckless at the start. That should probably come a lot later



LadyConstanze -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 3:20:30 PM)

quote:

But aiming to get to that point, and saying so, is not the same as just announcing that you're like that from the off. That just seems unreal to me.

In response to a question from the OP, nothing's automatic as far as limits are concerned. You have to talk and make sure you're on the same page, or at least enough on the same page to make it worth beginning something.


Pretty much so, but that's for those of us who live in the real world and do real stuff instead of fantasy



sunshinemiss -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 5:02:34 PM)

Sunny Quote of the Day
goes to

Musicmystery
for
No words are safe.
Words have power.
Use them wisely.

http://www.collarchat.com/m_4664369/mpage_3/tm.htm



littlewonder -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 8:40:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

For me this wouldn't be some hot kinky statement. It would equate to, "Hey, as long as you trust and respect me you should obey. If you stop trusting and respecting me then we probably ought to terminate the relationship too." It's not really rocket science nor is it all that extreme a statement IMO. Nothing in my world equates to either "training" or "sessions". I'd be talking about that as the structure of the relationship beginning the moment we "become an item".


This is exactly how it happened for Master and I and exactly what he stated to me when we decided to continue dating. Nothing kinky or steamy...just matter of factly that if I wanted to continue, this is how it would be. If I didn't like it then I was free to move on.


ETA: I admit I've always played as a "no limits" person when I was single and just casually played. It had nothing to do with me being new or crazy or suicidal and everything to do with me being extremely good at reading people and knowing who they basically are even after just a few minutes of noticing them.

I would say if you are the type of person who is not good at this then yeah, you may wanna be a lot more careful. Some people though are just good at reading people.



frunandsins -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 9:01:02 PM)

quote:

Some people though are just good at reading people.


I am glad it worked out for you. And you're right, _IF_ one can be nearly 99% accurate in reading people, one may want to assume that 1% risk. That still seems a pretty high risk to take, to me, but we are different people. When I talk to initiate subs whom I will not be taking on, I _always_ advice them to ask about safe words in negotiating with their first Doms.

It's like safer sex - can you (generic you, not littlewonder you) trust people to be honest about their HIV status? A lot of times, yes. But there is no way to know for sure, and so if you trust them, you are taking on the risk at a level that you wouldn't have to if you were to insist on condoms. As long as people are going into it with their eyes opened and with a realistic assessment of the risks, then it's their decision to make.



JeffBC -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 10:31:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: frunandsins
I am glad it worked out for you. And you're right, _IF_ one can be nearly 99% accurate in reading people, one may want to assume that 1% risk.

Your risk assessments are certainly different than mine. Going way back into my vanilla days I said "Relationships are no place for the timid. Go large or go home." Leaping in with both feet is the only way I'm interested in doing a relationship and the only way to achieve my goals. Relationships, to me, are a full contact sport and I want it all on every level. In real life I can heal from a broken heart. I'll pay the price tag in order to get the success condition I want.

When I say that I don't mean solely along a D/s dynamic nor am I implying that if there is a dynamic I'll be in charge. I mean on EVERY level of the relationship. If I'm not willing to go all-in on a particular relationship then I already know it's not the relationship for me.



GoddessManko -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 10:40:09 PM)

I agree Jeff but in all my years of doing this I've never used a safe word, and I've never needed to. However I would never state beforehand "no safe word will be honored". It's just silly to assume a sub you have yet to meet has "no limits". Or even if there is no safe word and they say "fuck this, stop"., you can use: "well I said no safe word will be honored" as the cop out. Seems like Russian Roulette.



JeffBC -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 10:48:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessManko
However I would never state beforehand "no safe word will be honored".

Well yeah, I agree that the specific wording is klutzy and indicative of either fantasy based crap or someone who is serious but articulates him/her self in terms of BDSM memes.

In the real world failing to honor "no" tends to put a sad face on the local cops.



frunandsins -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 11:02:31 PM)

quote:

Your risk assessments are certainly different than mine.


Amongst the infinite variations rests the impossible beauty.



FightingChains -> RE: NO Safeword...?? (3/21/2014 11:30:59 PM)

The thing that bothers me is not the concept of "no limits" but the implied ignorance of communication. The "I don't care what you say, I'm going to do it."

You want a partner who will do whatever you want? As Chatte said, that is all well and good until you bring out the blowtorch. But even if that was the case, say that there was implicit trust, safewording is just as important as a form of communication that "something has gone wrong". A safeword for "my ankle just broke" is just as important for someone who may not be able to communicate in the depths of pain that something has gone seriously wrong.

I suppose I don't have an issue with "no limits" as much as I have an issue with the implied "this dom will not listen to what I have to say if something goes pear-shaped". These issues of how to communicate in those circumstances would have to be worked out on a person-by-person basis, but the assumption of no communication from the start rather disturbs me.

But to each their own. Playing with fire is some people's idea of fun.



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