Is it true? (Full Version)

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willing2serve -> Is it true? (11/21/2004 7:57:52 PM)

On this submissive journey, i have come across Doms and Masters that are very skilled in instruments and tools, but prefer "trained" or "experienced" submissives instead of doing their own training. IMO, i would think that a Master or Dom would take pride in molding that submissive clay into porcelain. Why or why not would a Dom or Master prefer to do their own training?

Respectfully,
willing2serve1



BeachMystress -> RE: Is it true? (11/21/2004 8:12:00 PM)


The reason I prefer someone already trained is that they understand the lifestyle and what is expected from them. If you get a newbie, the odds are good that it is just someone with a submissive fantasy instead of being someone who wants to serve. The newbie themselves can't tell you which it is because without trying it they do not know. So you put time and effort into them only to have them decide it is the fantasy of submission they like. Less than half of all newbies go on to become subs. That being said, there are people who enjoy teaching people new things and love newbies and their lack of experience, so keep looking. Try visiting http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SC-ChaSM/ to find the list of munches and events around your area. Good luck finding the person you seek.



MasterWithBlades -> RE: Is it true? (11/21/2004 10:02:44 PM)

As a Dominant I prefer a submissive with little or no training. When you find the one true-of-heart, she can be properly trained. Most submissive have been trained in the Americanization form of D&S (leather-clad biker mentality). They have little to no idea how to properly serve a Master/Dominant. You may find on the rare occassion a submissive who is not it for rough sex or driven to the lifestyle because they ended a vanilla relationship which contained abuse. D&S allows them the pain they escaped from but now is controled in most cases.

A sub should be trained in proper ethics, discipline and manners. Most already trained submissives have no idea how to conduct themselves in a social setting and they have no clue how to serve. In 20+ years in this lifestyle I have trained many submissives/slave for myself and others. There is a big difference between a well dressed soft spoken European style Dominant than an American style Dominant. I will step down from my soap-box.

I would be happy to discuse this topic or answer anyones questions.

Master J



Estring -> RE: Is it true? (11/21/2004 11:47:17 PM)

If a sub/slave has a real desire to serve, experience doesn't matter. She will get her experience from me.



Lordandmaster -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 12:31:20 AM)

We were all newbies once.

Anyway, I agree with Estring: it's not the experience that matters; it's the desire to serve--and, of course, the commitment to honesty. I can understand that some doms might prefer subs with experience because they might think that this eliminates posers and tourists, but I wouldn't be so sure about drawing such conclusions. Anyone can call himself or herself "experienced" without even necessarily lying. It doesn't mean the "experience" is the kind of "experience" you're looking for.

Lam



masteroffire -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 5:15:03 AM)

I also agree with EString. The desire to serve must be there, and it may take awhile to ensure the person isn't just trying to live out a fantasy, but is genuine in this desire. Given the number on here who says they want something, but if they are spoken too, one will find they only want an "online only" D/s relationship, whatever that is...




willing2serve -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 8:00:45 AM)

Wonderful answers Sirs, i see this in a different light now. At first, i interpreted this as the Dom did not want to waste the time and energy on training and possibly not being capable of training, which didnt make a lot of sense given the fact they had taken the time and energies to learn tools and instruments. Now, i can see where a Master that is serious in the lifestyle would want "experienced" to rule out the posers, players and fantasyland babes. i will totally agree that desire rules over experience (coming from a rookie sub..smile).



feline -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 11:11:27 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterWithBlades
There is a big difference between a well dressed soft spoken European style Dominant than an American style Dominant. I will step down from my soap-box.

I would be happy to discuse this topic or answer anyones questions.

Master J


I, personally would like to hear more about this. [:)]

Take care,



[image]local://upfiles/17000/5351318325324D34B8324122AF723C3C.gif[/image]



masterdougyes -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 11:46:02 AM)

You've raised a whole series of question with your one. How about turning it around to: Would a submissive want a newbee Dom?

From my experience a new Dom has a really hard road ahead of him. It is one thing to be dominant in your personallity but yet another to know what you want of another and to be able to communicate and teach.

But back to the original question. Since I was given a chance as a new dominant, I believe fully in the training and educating of new submissives. I enjoy that aspect. Yes, I like to have a girl that knows how to serve, but I also know I may have to break her of bad habits that other "Doms" have left behind. I will expect her to work hard to overcome those habits.

In any case, I tend to look at each girl, both experienced and new, as a challenge to define what she is and what we collectively wish her to become. By setting my limits too high, I might find I'd pass up a real gem if I'm willing to put in the work.



willing2serve -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 12:46:18 PM)

Yes, masterdougyes, you are correct...it may seem to be a double standard...i do know as a new submissive i never even considered a new Dom. This may be another interesting thread you should post...




MemphisDsCouple -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 2:01:20 PM)

quote:

On this submissive journey, i have come across Doms and Masters that are very skilled in instruments and tools, but prefer "trained" or "experienced" submissives instead of doing their own training. IMO, i would think that a Master or Dom would take pride in molding that submissive clay into porcelain. Why or why not would a Dom or Master prefer to do their own training?


Your instincts are good. And your reasoning is right on target. D/s is a journey, not a destination. From my pov, the more of her journey the two of us can experience together, the closer and stronger will be our bond and understanding.



willing2serve -> RE: Is it true? (11/22/2004 2:19:06 PM)

Thank you MemphisDscouple, I take your comment as a compliment since i am so new to the journey. i believe i am beginning a strong foundation by learning and patience and i am sure it will be a rewarding trip. i wish you much success in life, however you define it.

Respectfully,
Willing2serve1



SavageControl -> RE: Is it true? (11/27/2004 8:55:50 AM)

I have trained 3 girls for other men, and I was paid very well for the service. There are some circumstances at play here however... first, the training was a puppygirls, and not part time weekend pups, total lifestyle change to 24/7 puppies -- this requires some experience that many Men (even those considered Dom/Masters) may not be comfortable with trying, or even have the time to devote to the transformation.

Also, all the girls were for Men or C/couples outside of the US, I find that European and Asian owners actually prefer to state that they bought the girl, perhaps as some status symbol or even just an extreme show of wealth?

I any case, yes there are people that prefer to have the training done by others, even if just to tell their friends that their slave is professionally trained...curiously, they all wanted the girls branded with My mark and show it as the mark of their *proper* training.



Nvernilla -> RE: Is it true? (11/27/2004 9:41:42 AM)

well I've found advantages to both but think it would be better in terms of a long relationship to have someone who is pretty fresh to it but is certian the desire is there. If you just want a casual thing its better to have someone who knows the ropes a bit better...Mike



happypervert -> RE: Is it true? (11/27/2004 10:33:40 AM)

quote:

There is a big difference between a well dressed soft spoken European style Dominant than an American style Dominant. I will step down from my soap-box.

Oh really? Would the difference be the arrogance and ignorance it takes to get up on a soap box and state that there is an American style of dominance that is characterized by poor dress and loud speaking?



TemptressJenna -> RE: Is it true? (12/1/2004 8:17:11 PM)

yes, its true



Random71203 -> RE: Is it true? (12/1/2004 8:38:47 PM)

6 plus years in the UK. There are differences. Outside the big cities you'll find things more on par with the US. Remeber that most forms of kink started somewhere other than the Americas. They've been living it long enough for the shine to have worn thin.

I personally prefer newbie subbies. Even if it's just a fantasy wannabe taking a test drive. But then I'm all about challenges.

The ultimate challenge would be to dominate a dominatrix. MMmmmm... what a ride that must be. [:D]

Cheers and spankings for all!



cynnacent1 -> RE: Is it true? (12/2/2004 6:51:30 AM)

quote:

Why or why not would a Dom or Master prefer to do their own training?

i'd THINK one would WANT to do their OWN training of their chosen subbie, what would be the point in wanting one who has been custom molded to suit ANOTHER's needs/desires/pleasures?

and ....
quote:

MasterWithBlades: Most submissive have been trained in the Americanization form of D&S (leather-clad biker mentality).

my Master is an American, likes bikes (i've yet to have seen Him in leather), and since i am all too knowing of how ignorant it can be to group people by stereotypes, i'll not even try to differentiate whether He IS or IS NOT of the 'typical' biker mentality.

Saying bikers are not intelligent? Funny conclusion in that the love of motorcycles is shared by a very diverse group of people, IE: doctors, lawyers, judges, white collar, blue collar etc ... (just as a short example, the list goes on & on).
quote:

MasterWithBlades:They have little to no idea how to properly serve a Master/Dominant. ~&~ Most already trained submissives have no idea how to conduct themselves in a social setting and they have no clue how to serve.

Says who? Meaning you have found the opportunity to try them ALL on for size from WAY over there atop your soap box? Speak for yourself, please, as your generalizations and stereotyping are indicative of a 'limited' mind, 'biased' opinion, 'unproven' theory.

Being a submissive does not equal being unintelligent, or clueless, or helpless, or needy. we are NOT all waiting for some prince charming to fly in from Europe to 'educate' us on *his* limited definition of submission.

i was NOT trained prior to being owned by INSIDEYOURMIND, and as all of my clues and my intelligence remain intact and up to par, i have served Him quite well from day one and continue to do so.

This NOT a one size fits all lifestyle.

¸,ø¤º°cynnacent°º¤ø,¸ (proudly owned by, and devoted to INSIDEYOURMIND)



CloudThrasher -> RE: Is it true? (12/3/2004 10:11:06 PM)

Unless you're being trained as an engineer or teacher or something, the idea of training a submissive is silly. It's as ridiculous as "taming" or "breaking" a submissive and remolding her according to her Dom/Master's desires. Both imply viewing the submissive as something less than fully human: with her own thoughts, dreams, desires, needs, goals. So, to answer your question ... I suppose it's like saying I like my doormats already broken in.



Estring -> RE: Is it true? (12/3/2004 11:58:02 PM)

So what do you do, throw them the manual and tell them to read it? Of course you need to train a sub. And that doesn't mean that they don't have their own needs, wants, thoughts, or desires. What it means is that they put you before all those things. That is hardly a doormat.



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