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Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/16/2014 8:54:13 PM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		Bill Clinton is the most admired president over the last 25 years, according to a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal/Annenberg Survey.

Forty-two percent of respondents picked Clinton as the president they admired the most.

He was followed by President Barack Obama at 18 percent, George W. Bush at 17 percent and his father, George H.W. Bush, at 16 percent.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/poll-bill-clinton-most-admired-president-over-past-25-years-n130756

I did not see that coming. Interesting.



< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 6/16/2014 8:55:10 PM >
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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/16/2014 9:57:09 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		25 years? That only covers Bush I, II, Clinton and Obama. Shocking that Clinton comes out on top of those three, not.

When did America become so innumerate that this sort of thing could even get past a news editor?

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/16/2014 9:58:23 PM   
dcnovice


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Status: offline 		I'm not surprised.

For all his foibles and fumbles, Clinton has an incredible charisma that amazed even my (moderate) Republican brother when he heard the former President speak at a recent healthcare conference. Bro says he spoke for 40 minutes without notes, and the results--smart, witty, informed--totally engaged the audience. Clinton also benefits from being the last President before both 9/11 and the economic collapse.

In contrast, Obama could only be a letdown after all the hype, and Bush 43 saddled us with two wars. Bush 41, a decent man so far as I know, has faded from memory.

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it's never enough to keep up.

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/16/2014 10:59:00 PM   
TheHeretic


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From: California, USA
Status: offline 		I knocked on doors for Wild Bill in '92. It took some serious effort on my part to get past him taking Al Gore as Veep, but I managed. I still like the guy. He sure turned out to be a lying-ass horndog though, didn't he?

Why 25 years? Because Clinton coming in 2nd to Reagan just wouldn't fit the template, now would it? And how bad would it look if Obama came out worse than Carter?

Why the story? Duh. Bill's wife is going to have another run at the job, and she sure as hell won't get there on the coattails of the current President. Maybe nostalgia will do the trick?

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That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 4:56:44 AM   
DarkSteven


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Status: offline 		Because the economy roared under Clinton, and sucked under W and Obama. And it wasn't that good under HW, because "it's the economy, stupid" got Bill int the WH.

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:17:43 AM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:21:46 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Please do not confuse the voices in your head with reality.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2013/02/13/growth_under_george_w_bush_was_pretty_lousy.html
1.1 percent GDP growth is terrible.

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:31:08 AM   
MrRodgers


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Absolute unmitigated bullshit. The economy was already headed into recession by 2001 at the collapse of the dot com bubble.

The regulation called for in your link was presented to a fully repub govt. that could have done so at anytime. It voted in two tax cuts, it vote for war and and a brand new very expensive drug benefit yet I am to believe that it couldn't regulate Fannie & Freddie ? Suuurre

All those GSEs (govt. supported enterprises) did, was join the game of greed, the management of which got clean away with million$ in bonuses. Plus before anyone wants to get started, those loans and specifically CRA loans were a very small (2-3%) portion of the new loans that were shit paper.

Then Bush and his SEC and Justice allowed the mortgage industry to write billion$ in bullshit loans. Then his SEC allowed a AAA rating to be given to a new so-called innovative product (a piece of shit paper) called a MBS (mortgage backed security) to be sold to unsuspecting investors.

When they failed and just about everybody with knowledge...knew they would...we get more socialism for the rich...TARP. In fact when the repubs deregulated the over all mortgage security market, it was Barney Frank who predicted it would necessitate a bailout. So the repubs in congress knew exactly what they were doing...and not doing.

Give it up, the dems had nothing whatsoever to do with the ensuing meltdown. It was all greed and specifically allowed by W who even took the states attys general to court and use an obscure 1863 law empowering the OCC to stop all 50 from going after these lenders.

< Message edited by MrRodgers -- 6/17/2014 5:43:16 AM >

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:35:20 AM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
Absolute unmitigated bullshit. The economy was already headed into recession by 2001 at the collapse of the dot com bubble.

All those GSEs (govt. supported enterprises) did, was join the game of greed, the management of which got clean away with million$ in bonuses.

Then Bush and his SEC and Justice allowed the mortgage industry to write bullshit loans, then his SEC allowed a AAA rating to be given to a new so-called innovative product (a piece of shit paper) called a MBS (mortgage backed security) to be sold to unsuspecting investors.

When they failed and just about everybody with knowledge...knew they would...we get more socialism for the rich...TARP. Give it up, the dems had nothing whatsoever to do with the ensuing meltdown. It was all greed and specifically allowed by W who even took the states Attys general to court and use an obscure 1863 law empowering the OCC to stop all 50 from going after these lenders.


Thats right, Bush inherited Bubba Clinton's dot com bubble collapse... Thanks for reminding us. And contrary to your bluster and your bullshit the link I posted above shows how the 2007 collapse is best laid at the feet of the Dems

Dems buying votes with our tax dollars

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:44:08 AM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

I knocked on doors for Wild Bill in '92. It took some serious effort on my part to get past him taking Al Gore as Veep, but I managed. I still like the guy. He sure turned out to be a lying-ass horndog though, didn't he?

Why 25 years? Because Clinton coming in 2nd to Reagan just wouldn't fit the template, now would it? And how bad would it look if Obama came out worse than Carter?

Why the story? Duh. Bill's wife is going to have another run at the job, and she sure as hell won't get there on the coattails of the current President. Maybe nostalgia will do the trick?


The rapist president

_____________________________

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:45:30 AM   
MrRodgers


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Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Please do not confuse the voices in your head with reality.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2013/02/13/growth_under_george_w_bush_was_pretty_lousy.html
1.1 percent GDP growth is terrible.

The worse fiscal, employment and over all economic record for any two term president in history.

(in reply to DomKen)
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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 5:59:45 AM   
MrRodgers


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Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
Absolute unmitigated bullshit. The economy was already headed into recession by 2001 at the collapse of the dot com bubble.

All those GSEs (govt. supported enterprises) did, was join the game of greed, the management of which got clean away with million$ in bonuses.

Then Bush and his SEC and Justice allowed the mortgage industry to write bullshit loans, then his SEC allowed a AAA rating to be given to a new so-called innovative product (a piece of shit paper) called a MBS (mortgage backed security) to be sold to unsuspecting investors.

When they failed and just about everybody with knowledge...knew they would...we get more socialism for the rich...TARP. Give it up, the dems had nothing whatsoever to do with the ensuing meltdown. It was all greed and specifically allowed by W who even took the states Attys general to court and use an obscure 1863 law empowering the OCC to stop all 50 from going after these lenders.


Thats right, Bush inherited Bubba Clinton's dot com bubble collapse... Thanks for reminding us. And contrary to your bluster and your bullshit the link I posted above shows how the 2007 collapse is best laid at the feet of the Dems

Dems buying votes with our tax dollars

Your link is partisan shrill and proves nothing of the kind. Anyone can go after Fannie & Freddy Mac all they want. All of their involvement was a tiny fraction of what the private frauds were doing.

The CEO of Washington Mutual was making $100 million a year off mortgages sold to wall street NONE of which were sold to Fannie or Freddie. Get over it, real truth has come out. Here

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 6:44:59 AM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Alas, if W had listened to Greenspan, the "reckless and irresponsible tax cuts" would have saved our butt instead of ballooning the deficit again as under Reagan.

I hope we see the day when silly spin gives way to true fiscal responsibility the conservatives used to hold.

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 6:49:33 AM   
MrRodgers


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Alas, if W had listened to Greenspan, the "reckless and irresponsible tax cuts" would have saved our butt instead of ballooning the deficit again as under Reagan.

I hope we see the day when silly spin gives way to true fiscal responsibility the conservatives used to hold.

You've got it. That's why I have been saying, there are no real conservatives in Wash. Real conservatives were all over Reagan for his deficit spending but they were about the smallest minority you could find in Wash.

Greenspan actually told congress that surpluses and paying off some of the federal debt...were bad. I wonder of he thought the same for his household ?

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 6:50:18 AM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Alas, if W had listened to Greenspan, the "reckless and irresponsible tax cuts" would have saved our butt instead of ballooning the deficit again as under Reagan.
I hope we see the day when silly spin gives way to true fiscal responsibility the conservatives used to hold.


What does the tax revenue data suggest, though? The real deficit problem W created, was in his allowance of ridiculous spending increases. Had the Feds not ramped up spending as much as they did, W's addition to the National Debt would have been much, much smaller.


_____________________________

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  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 6:59:03 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Alas, if W had listened to Greenspan, the "reckless and irresponsible tax cuts" would have saved our butt instead of ballooning the deficit again as under Reagan.
I hope we see the day when silly spin gives way to true fiscal responsibility the conservatives used to hold.


What does the tax revenue data suggest, though? The real deficit problem W created, was in his allowance of ridiculous spending increases. Had the Feds not ramped up spending as much as they did, W's addition to the National Debt would have been much, much smaller.


And if the nutjob had not ramped up spending and not cut taxes?

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 7:07:03 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline 		"The most important achievement in political economy in the Clinton yeas was reducing the federal deficit. Just before his inauguration Clinton held an economic summit in Little Rock, at which academic, business executives, and financiers one after another moaned about how huge federal borrowing to cover debt was making capital too expensive to allow industry to grow. One year later Clinton had rammed through a tax-and -budget bill that turned a chronic deficit into a surplus.

The anti-deficit drive was controversial within the Democratic Party, because Clinton seemed to be truckling to financial markets rather than spending more for education and health. It was bitterly resisted by the Republicans; every single Republican member of Congress voted against the new taxes in the plan. It was an enormous gamble on Clinton's part: he had Al Gore cast the tie-breaking vote in the Senate. The historical judgment has to be that it paid off, for Clinton, and, of vastly more importance, for the country."

--James Fallows

But two things stick out so far from the normal that they will probably be remembered no matter what happens. One of them is the sheer insensate virulence of his critics. If size can be measured by the lip-frothing frustration of one's enemies, Clinton is right up there with Moby-Dick. The other is the five-minute standing ovation Clinton received at the UN at the height of the Monica madness. The applause couldn't all have been for adultery--not even the applause from the French Ambassador.

And even if, as his critics maintain, its was all a trick both at home and abroad, the trick had worked wonderfully well. But he couldn't have gotten all five minutes without Kenneth Starr.


< Message edited by cloudboy -- 6/17/2014 7:10:44 AM >

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 7:11:33 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
The economy roared along fairly well under W until the Democrats' Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debacle screwed it up for everyone

Alas, if W had listened to Greenspan, the "reckless and irresponsible tax cuts" would have saved our butt instead of ballooning the deficit again as under Reagan.
I hope we see the day when silly spin gives way to true fiscal responsibility the conservatives used to hold.


What does the tax revenue data suggest, though? The real deficit problem W created, was in his allowance of ridiculous spending increases. Had the Feds not ramped up spending as much as they did, W's addition to the National Debt would have been much, much smaller.


It's not either or -- it's the structural deficit he straddled us with.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)
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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 7:25:21 AM   
tj444


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Bill Clinton is the most admired president over the last 25 years, according to a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal/Annenberg Survey.

Forty-two percent of respondents picked Clinton as the president they admired the most.

He was followed by President Barack Obama at 18 percent, George W. Bush at 17 percent and his father, George H.W. Bush, at 16 percent.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/poll-bill-clinton-most-admired-president-over-past-25-years-n130756

I did not see that coming. Interesting.


so "none of the above" was not given as an option, huh? cuz that's the answer I would have given..

< Message edited by tj444 -- 6/17/2014 7:26:59 AM >

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RE: Clinton most admired President last 25 years - 6/17/2014 7:45:08 AM   
MrRodgers


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Joined: 7/30/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Bill Clinton is the most admired president over the last 25 years, according to a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal/Annenberg Survey.

Forty-two percent of respondents picked Clinton as the president they admired the most.

He was followed by President Barack Obama at 18 percent, George W. Bush at 17 percent and his father, George H.W. Bush, at 16 percent.

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/first-read/poll-bill-clinton-most-admired-president-over-past-25-years-n130756

I did not see that coming. Interesting.


so "none of the above" was not given as an option, huh? cuz that's the answer I would have given..

Thing is, if you didn't have a mistress, many voters in Europe would look at a candidate with suspicion....particularly France. They laughed at the whole US right wing obsession with a blow job in the oval office. And that was after $60 million spent for nothing on Whitewater.

Clinton just had the right economic and fiscal policies and got them through an intransigent repub senate of 50 votes with a tie-breaker by Gore. That single vote may have saved his economic legacy.

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