RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom

RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

cloudboy -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 6:07:25 AM)
I don't get the queer responses. I thought you appreciated facts and good information and wouldn't act so odd when it was offered to you.

DesideriScuri -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 6:13:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Did you read the part where you simply made the point I had just made? No. You didn't really do that. And if you had, you'd get why the comparison country to country would have to be adjusted for those costs first. So yes, it really is. My claim was that Dr.'s won't make enough money if they are paid a fixed amount, by patient. That was to DK's question as to why it won't work here. You claimed Dr.'s in other countries make enough under this payment scheme. I countered by asking if Dr.'s there make the same amount of money. The don't, even after the costs are adjusted. But, thanks for playing.

eulero83 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 6:41:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Did you read the part where you simply made the point I had just made? No. You didn't really do that. And if you had, you'd get why the comparison country to country would have to be adjusted for those costs first. So yes, it really is. My claim was that Dr.'s won't make enough money if they are paid a fixed amount, by patient. That was to DK's question as to why it won't work here. You claimed Dr.'s in other countries make enough under this payment scheme. I countered by asking if Dr.'s there make the same amount of money. The don't, even after the costs are adjusted. But, thanks for playing. don't you think it depends on how every patient vs visit is worth and not the method? if a generla practitioner gives 10 visits a day and charges 50$ a visit will make more or less 120 grands a year, if he has 2000 registerd patients an is paid 60$ a patient will make 120 grands a year. And what is enough is subjective... of course if a med school graduate has 300 grands of student loan debt is in a different situation than someone living in a country where college costs 1200$ a year.

Tkman117 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 6:44:04 AM)
try 12000, I can't think of a country where tuition is less than 10 grand a year [:D]

mnottertail -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 7:18:11 AM)
http://www.practicelink.com/magazine/vital-stats/physician-compensation-worldwide/ http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2013/02/charts-day-doctor-pay-america-and-other-countries http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/15/how-much-do-doctors-in-other-countries-make/ http://theincidentaleconomist.com/wordpress/physician-fees-and-salaries-in-the-us-and-other-countries/ Four different articles widely differing amounts. Safe to say the overall is that doctors make more in the US. (course they have to pay for their health insurance here in the US.........LOL)

Musicmystery -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 7:24:28 AM)
quote: They don't, even after the costs are adjusted. Got proof of that? Because they seem to be doing fine. Unlike the US, where doctors are fleeing the profession (apparently, cloudboy didn't explain it to them yet).

DesideriScuri -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 7:34:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: eulero83 quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Did you read the part where you simply made the point I had just made? No. You didn't really do that. And if you had, you'd get why the comparison country to country would have to be adjusted for those costs first. So yes, it really is. My claim was that Dr.'s won't make enough money if they are paid a fixed amount, by patient. That was to DK's question as to why it won't work here. You claimed Dr.'s in other countries make enough under this payment scheme. I countered by asking if Dr.'s there make the same amount of money. The don't, even after the costs are adjusted. But, thanks for playing. don't you think it depends on how every patient vs visit is worth and not the method? if a generla practitioner gives 10 visits a day and charges 50$ a visit will make more or less 120 grands a year, if he has 2000 registerd patients an is paid 60$ a patient will make 120 grands a year. And what is enough is subjective... of course if a med school graduate has 300 grands of student loan debt is in a different situation than someone living in a country where college costs 1200$ a year. Any basis in reality for those numbers? quote: Doctors in the specialty doctor grade earn a basic salary of between £37,176 and £69,325. (my add: roughly $63.6k -$119k Median physician salaries in the US A General Practitioner's median salary is $136k. That's more than a Scale Value 10 (looks to be a tenure step scale) Specialty Dr. in the UK. Specialists in the US get even higher pay (Median salaries for: Internal Medicine: $171k; Radiologist: $285k). Median Indebtedness after 4-year Medical School (US) in 2012: Private School -> $190k; Public School -> $160k The limit on public universities for tuition is £9000 (roughly $15390) a year, or £54k ($92k) for the 6-year medical course. You can make an awful lot more money here, all things considered.

DesideriScuri -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 7:36:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery quote: They don't, even after the costs are adjusted. Got proof of that? Because they seem to be doing fine. Unlike the US, where doctors are fleeing the profession (apparently, cloudboy didn't explain it to them yet). And, why are they fleeing the profession?

Musicmystery -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 7:49:18 AM)
See those posty things with people's names other than yours? And the links they post? Read those things.

eulero83 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 9:37:00 AM)
It was just an example, your numbers just say in the uk medical doctors work for less, not that one method can raise different amounts, but I'm sure you understood it's just you want to be annoying to not discuss the topic. By the way 1200$ I just converted the 1000€ of taxes due here in italy, in germany is probably even cheaper, the uk is very expensive for european standards, the 300000$ was a number I estimated with 200k + a 50% of intersts. Other numbers where just to make an example but I didn't missed it so much. so medical doctor study just 4 years before specialization in the US?

Musicmystery -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 9:49:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cloudboy I don't get the queer responses. I thought you appreciated facts and good information and wouldn't act so odd when it was offered to you. I thought you wouldn't simply dismiss data, evidence, and long social experience. So there's no problem. The doctors will be glad to hear it. I hope their insurance companies understand too. Adding you to the block list. This is a ridiculous waste of time.

eulero83 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 10:16:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tkman117 try 12000, I can't think of a country where tuition is less than 10 grand a year [:D] mine was 700€/year for undergraduate school and 850€/year grad school, my friends in a different city were paying around 1000€ could be more or less depending on the family income. In germany at the time university was free I think it's still cheaper than that today.

Tkman117 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 10:34:09 AM)
I stand corrected then :P For us it's about 6000 a semester if you exclude first year student residence and the student meal plans. Not terribly expensive but it can be pretty costly, especially when our current conservative government isn't helping much in the way of lowering our costs.

BamaD -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 10:52:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Tkman117 I stand corrected then :P For us it's about 6000 a semester if you exclude first year student residence and the student meal plans. Not terribly expensive but it can be pretty costly, especially when our current conservative government isn't helping much in the way of lowering our costs. And if they did the money would come from taxes which come from? Just because you pay for something via taxes doesn't mean you don't pay. "the problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other peoples money"

mnottertail -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 11:04:52 AM)
The problem with capitalism is sooner or later the corporations fuck you out of all your money.

DesideriScuri -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 11:24:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery See those posty things with people's names other than yours? And the links they post? Read those things. Yeah, I do read those. Well, there are a few that I have hidden, but, for the most part, I read all the posts. Soooo, anything on why Dr.'s are fleeing?

mnottertail -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 11:25:37 AM)
as he said, take a fuckin read cuz it is in there, or look it up yourself.

eulero83 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 11:42:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: Tkman117 I stand corrected then :P For us it's about 6000 a semester if you exclude first year student residence and the student meal plans. Not terribly expensive but it can be pretty costly, especially when our current conservative government isn't helping much in the way of lowering our costs. And if they did the money would come from taxes which come from? Just because you pay for something via taxes doesn't mean you don't pay. "the problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other peoples money" you really like that quote, don't you? Anyway what kind of services a governament provides or not has nothing to do with socialism, it has with the concepts of public interest and public expenditure (it is actually untrue that taxes pay those services). Public interest is what a governament is supposed to pursue, in some countries having an educated and healty people is considered a primary need (like defence, law enforcement, infrastructures etc.), for the whole society so it is a duty of the governament to organize an education or a health care system affordable for the population. This services are paid by public expenditure that comes before tax collection since we don't use anymore currencies directly linked to silver or gold. So the country prints the money, (in us or eurozone the country issue bonds) with those paper pays the services, those money circulates producing added value and the governament collect taxes to control inflation and debt. The reason you cover the most expensive services with income and corporative taxes' collection and not for example applying fees is that you don't want lower income people to run out of money and so destroy the internal market, that's another way to say what mnottertail just wrote. Considering capital and private initiative the solution to all the problems is as moronic as considering it to be state ownership and production for use.

Tkman117 -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 12:25:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: Tkman117 I stand corrected then :P For us it's about 6000 a semester if you exclude first year student residence and the student meal plans. Not terribly expensive but it can be pretty costly, especially when our current conservative government isn't helping much in the way of lowering our costs. And if they did the money would come from taxes which come from? Just because you pay for something via taxes doesn't mean you don't pay. "the problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other peoples money" And the problem with capitalism is that eventually all the capital is allocated to the highest earners, and without redistributing that capital, it simply remains at the top which causes stagnation and major disparity between rich and poor. (hint, hint, you can see it all around you right now in your twisted "free" country). I'd take a democracy with social programs that invest in people and push people forward in life than a broken system like the one in the US where it's like the wild west 21st century style.

cloudboy -> RE: SCOTUS on HOBBY LOBBY and religious freedom (7/8/2014 1:21:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Unlike the US, where doctors are fleeing the profession (apparently, cloudboy didn't explain it to them yet). Your claims and information get worse and worse: Doctors are not "fleeing the profession." I never figured you to respond to absolute impeachment in this manner, but I was wrong. GotSteele is one of the best posters on this forum, and it was eye opening to see you try and treat him like an ignorant child.

Page: << < prev 10 11 [12] 13 14 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

4.711914E-02