RE: GMO's For or Against? (Full Version)

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DomKen -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/1/2014 3:06:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AQRMZ


THIS IS NOT IN REPLY TO ANYONE, IT IS JUST A COMMENT ON LABELING.

It might be helpful to view this and then read a few of the books. http://www.wheatbellyblog.com/

This might serve to lift the conversation to a higher level.

Labels certainly would help a consumer know what is in the product.

Of course if you want to feed your children "mystery" foods, then that is your prerogative.

Or you could simply slam you head in a door a few times. That is some of the worst pseudo science I've ever seen.

Dwarf wheat has saved at least 2 billion lives. Yes you read that right billion. Norman Borlaug got the Nobel Peace Prize for developing it. Before it came along people used to seriously discuss whether India and China could ever feed themselves.

So "Dr." Davis is actually advocating against one of the greatest public health advances of all time.

in case you actually believe the guy's book
http://www.aaccnet.org/publications/plexus/cfw/pastissues/2012/OpenDocuments/CFW-57-4-0177.pdf
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0733521013000969 

In short never believe some quack who appears on Dr. Oz.




tj444 -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/1/2014 8:21:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: AQRMZ


THIS IS NOT IN REPLY TO ANYONE, IT IS JUST A COMMENT ON LABELING.

It might be helpful to view this and then read a few of the books. http://www.wheatbellyblog.com/

This might serve to lift the conversation to a higher level.

Labels certainly would help a consumer know what is in the product.

Of course if you want to feed your children "mystery" foods, then that is your prerogative.

Or you could simply slam you head in a door a few times. That is some of the worst pseudo science I've ever seen.

Dwarf wheat has saved at least 2 billion lives. Yes you read that right billion. Norman Borlaug got the Nobel Peace Prize for developing it. Before it came along people used to seriously discuss whether India and China could ever feed themselves.

So "Dr." Davis is actually advocating against one of the greatest public health advances of all time.

in case you actually believe the guy's book
http://www.aaccnet.org/publications/plexus/cfw/pastissues/2012/OpenDocuments/CFW-57-4-0177.pdf
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0733521013000969 

In short never believe some quack who appears on Dr. Oz.

However, not everyone can eat wheat & tolerate it. My ex-SIL & her kids have Celiac Disease & they cant eat any gluten.. And I think too much of anything is a bad thing.. so much of what people eat today isn't all that good for them and too much processed food does make some people sick (that happened to me).. its amazing to me how many people claim to "eat healthy" and they don't even know what the ingredients in the food they buy are or how much sugar & crap it has in it.. Their definition of "eating healthy" & mine are two very different things..

Monsanto & the other gmo corps want a monopoly and once they get that (which Monsanto basically has now in certain countries) then watch the price of their seed go up.. Farmers now in some of these countries are paying 4 times as much for seed as they did before, and they cant use the seed from their own harvest like they used to be able to do either.. and according to some farmers, non-gmo crops are actually more productive..

http://www.non-gmoreport.com/articles/february2013/the-gmo-seed-cartel.php

“We get the same or better yields, and we save money up front,” crop consultant and farmer Aaron Bloom said of non-GMO seeds.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/american-farmers-abandoning-genetically-modified-seeds-non-gmo-crops-are-more-productive-and-profitable/5366365




DomKen -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/1/2014 9:34:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: tj444


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: AQRMZ


THIS IS NOT IN REPLY TO ANYONE, IT IS JUST A COMMENT ON LABELING.

It might be helpful to view this and then read a few of the books. http://www.wheatbellyblog.com/

This might serve to lift the conversation to a higher level.

Labels certainly would help a consumer know what is in the product.

Of course if you want to feed your children "mystery" foods, then that is your prerogative.

Or you could simply slam you head in a door a few times. That is some of the worst pseudo science I've ever seen.

Dwarf wheat has saved at least 2 billion lives. Yes you read that right billion. Norman Borlaug got the Nobel Peace Prize for developing it. Before it came along people used to seriously discuss whether India and China could ever feed themselves.

So "Dr." Davis is actually advocating against one of the greatest public health advances of all time.

in case you actually believe the guy's book
http://www.aaccnet.org/publications/plexus/cfw/pastissues/2012/OpenDocuments/CFW-57-4-0177.pdf
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0733521013000969 

In short never believe some quack who appears on Dr. Oz.

However, not everyone can eat wheat & tolerate it. My ex-SIL & her kids have Celiac Disease & they cant eat any gluten.. And I think too much of anything is a bad thing.. so much of what people eat today isn't all that good for them and too much processed food does make some people sick (that happened to me).. its amazing to me how many people claim to "eat healthy" and they don't even know what the ingredients in the food they buy are or how much sugar & crap it has in it.. Their definition of "eating healthy" & mine are two very different things..

However this quack is not talking about people with celiac. He's specifically opposed to just dwarf wheat.




BecomingV -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 1:47:43 PM)

DomKen Despite the area of the forum we are on, I can't respond in any kind of serious manner to those who employ debate tactics such as these. It's beneath me to try and a waste of my intelligence.

A tip - trust that other posters are equal in intelligence to yourself, or in my view, superior in intelligence. Disagreement is not a sign of being incorrect. LOL Those with "big-people pants" can handle opposition, IMO. You know, some of us hear a new point of view and go do some research.

To everyone... did my post strike fear in your heart? Or, is that limited to DomKen?

ETA - typo




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 1:56:27 PM)

I suspect it's just DK - and he don't give a shit. [:D]

He and a few others are like this - it's their tactics.
If they don't agree, the other person is a liar, an idiot, or whatever phrase comes to mind at the time.
They are often not capable of debate.
They are right and everyone else is just plain wrong.




BecomingV -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 2:16:56 PM)

freedomdwarf1 I suspect you are right.

On GMOs, I've read maybe 25 articles and watched a few documentaries. I would hardly call myself an expert on the topic, but I have put some effort into becoming informed.

If I wanted to limit myself to my own view, I wouldn't "talk" with others here, on the subject. If I'm wrong... why would I want to stay that way? LOL I care about the topic, so those who have posted references which they found to be credible and valuable have my thanks, so I may add to my existing knowledge - whether it changes my view, or not.

My earlier point is that you don't have to be a chemist, or even have a handle on chemistry terminology, to contribute a valid concern or assertion. Ask any chemist... they are frequently wrong! Sometimes, discoveries are made in the errors. So, using a lack of familiarity with "the lingo" to intimidate another poster, seemed... disingenuous and desperate.




freedomdwarf1 -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 2:30:13 PM)

Personally, although there have been some huge strides in GM procedures and technology, I don't think we (as humans) know enough about genetics to severely modify anything that we grow for ourselves or feed to our livestock.
Yes, there have been some great discoveries.
By all means, try cross-pollinating species and create something resistant to mold/mildew or insect attack or greater yields per acre etc etc. But to tamper with the actual genetic make-up of our foodstuffs?? I don't think it's right - not yet at least.
We need to know more about genetics before we start tampering. Trial and error is just a horror accident waiting to happen. The Thalidomide experiment comes to mind (yeah, I know it's not quite the same thing). But still, I think we need to have a lot more knowledge before we start tinkering with nature.

It's also interesting that most of the GM products (some of which are known to be very harmful to humans) are actually in general use - but only allowed in the US?? A lot of Europe (including the UK) have banned most GM products and crops over here.




BecomingV -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 2:57:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

Personally, although there have been some huge strides in GM procedures and technology, I don't think we (as humans) know enough about genetics to severely modify anything that we grow for ourselves or feed to our livestock.
Yes, there have been some great discoveries.
By all means, try cross-pollinating species and create something resistant to mold/mildew or insect attack or greater yields per acre etc etc. But to tamper with the actual genetic make-up of our foodstuffs?? I don't think it's right - not yet at least.
We need to know more about genetics before we start tampering. Trial and error is just a horror accident waiting to happen. The Thalidomide experiment comes to mind (yeah, I know it's not quite the same thing). But still, I think we need to have a lot more knowledge before we start tinkering with nature.

It's also interesting that most of the GM products (some of which are known to be very harmful to humans) are actually in general use - but only allowed in the US?? A lot of Europe (including the UK) have banned most GM products and crops over here.



In one generation, in America, we've seen the rise of ADHD, Autism and Obesity. What changed? The food supply.

I, too, have to wonder if Americans are simply being used as human guinea pigs. I pay attention to discoveries and news, and I am not satisfied that GMOs are either safe, or enhancing. The lack of labeling does pander to suspicions that profits are valued over human life, especially considering American medicine is a "for-profit" business.

Until I'm satisfied that there is relatively no danger in GMOs, I don't support their consumption by any living being. We ARE what we eat.




DomKen -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 4:24:57 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

DomKen Despite the area of the forum we are on, I can't respond in any kind of serious manner to those who employ debate tactics such as these. It's beneath me to try and a waste of my intelligence.

A tip - trust that other posters are equal in intelligence to yourself, or in my view, superior in intelligence. Disagreement is not a sign of being incorrect. LOL Those with "big-people pants" can handle opposition, IMO. You know, some of us hear a new point of view and go do some research.

To everyone... did my post strike fear in your heart? Or, is that limited to DomKen?

ETA - typo

Look, I gave your posting that quack the full debunking it deserved.

Do you understand the guy attacked a breakthrough responsible for the lives of about one quarter of the people alive on the planet today? If it is so bad for everyone how come 2 billion people are alive solely because of it?

I even bothered to post both a point by point debunking of the quack's book and an actual peer reviewed scientific paper disproving his stupid claim. What more could you possibly want? The correct response is to either leave the thread or to acknowledge that you had been taken in by a quack.




BecomingV -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 4:32:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

DomKen Despite the area of the forum we are on, I can't respond in any kind of serious manner to those who employ debate tactics such as these. It's beneath me to try and a waste of my intelligence.

A tip - trust that other posters are equal in intelligence to yourself, or in my view, superior in intelligence. Disagreement is not a sign of being incorrect. LOL Those with "big-people pants" can handle opposition, IMO. You know, some of us hear a new point of view and go do some research.

To everyone... did my post strike fear in your heart? Or, is that limited to DomKen?

ETA - typo

Look, I gave your posting that quack the full debunking it deserved.

Do you understand the guy attacked a breakthrough responsible for the lives of about one quarter of the people alive on the planet today? If it is so bad for everyone how come 2 billion people are alive solely because of it?

I even bothered to post both a point by point debunking of the quack's book and an actual peer reviewed scientific paper disproving his stupid claim. What more could you possibly want? The correct response is to either leave the thread or to acknowledge that you had been taken in by a quack.


DomKen

In this instance, it is your posts which appear to be "quack-ful." Staying open to other points of view works great for me, so I'll be continuing that.

And, just to clarify... I don't grant you permission to determine what MY correct responses are/ should be / will be. Got it?




Marini -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 4:45:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

freedomdwarf1 I suspect you are right.

On GMOs, I've read maybe 25 articles and watched a few documentaries. I would hardly call myself an expert on the topic, but I have put some effort into becoming informed.

If I wanted to limit myself to my own view, I wouldn't "talk" with others here, on the subject. If I'm wrong... why would I want to stay that way? LOL I care about the topic, so those who have posted references which they found to be credible and valuable have my thanks, so I may add to my existing knowledge - whether it changes my view, or not.

My earlier point is that you don't have to be a chemist, or even have a handle on chemistry terminology, to contribute a valid concern or assertion. Ask any chemist... they are frequently wrong! Sometimes, discoveries are made in the errors. So, using a lack of familiarity with "the lingo" to intimidate another poster, seemed... disingenuous and desperate.


A voice of reason, among many voices that are unreasonable.
Great point.




DomKen -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 4:46:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

DomKen Despite the area of the forum we are on, I can't respond in any kind of serious manner to those who employ debate tactics such as these. It's beneath me to try and a waste of my intelligence.

A tip - trust that other posters are equal in intelligence to yourself, or in my view, superior in intelligence. Disagreement is not a sign of being incorrect. LOL Those with "big-people pants" can handle opposition, IMO. You know, some of us hear a new point of view and go do some research.

To everyone... did my post strike fear in your heart? Or, is that limited to DomKen?

ETA - typo

Look, I gave your posting that quack the full debunking it deserved.

Do you understand the guy attacked a breakthrough responsible for the lives of about one quarter of the people alive on the planet today? If it is so bad for everyone how come 2 billion people are alive solely because of it?

I even bothered to post both a point by point debunking of the quack's book and an actual peer reviewed scientific paper disproving his stupid claim. What more could you possibly want? The correct response is to either leave the thread or to acknowledge that you had been taken in by a quack.


DomKen

In this instance, it is your posts which appear to be "quack-ful." Staying open to other points of view works great for me, so I'll be continuing that.

And, just to clarify... I don't grant you permission to determine what MY correct responses are/ should be / will be. Got it?

Again, 2 billion people alive. Nobel Peace Prize winner vs. some guy you saw on Dr. Oz.

Come on who do you think comes out on top?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug




BecomingV -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 5:16:28 PM)

DomKen I genuinely care about being informed and checking the veracity of claims and the factors which influence information presented.

And, here's what's sad. Because you pulled "Dr. Oz" out of you ass, you discredit yourself! I've never read, nor heard, Dr. Oz's point of view on the subject of GMOs. Apparently, YOU have. LOL

Instead of advancing my knowledge base on GMOs, you've advanced my knowledge of your inadequacy in staying on topic, in your close-mindedness and lack of curiosity towards others' points of view and in your erroneous assumptions that being open, means being duped.

IF you do have something to add which is worthy of learning, I would be less open to your point of view because of all of the above. The "attack" and "diminish" angle you use here, informs me that even when you are presented with facts, ego and histrionics cloud your ability to perceive. You got in your own way in terms of your ability to persuade.

In short, other posters' contributions have my attention on this one.

I am unsatisfied that GMOs are healthy and safe. Somehow, and trust me on this... life will go on even though that's my stance. Calm down. Since I am learning more about GMOs, if the information which informs you is valid, I'll find it. But, you've discredited yourself to the point of not being a respectable source of information, for me.

And, to be fair, thanks for the references you did offer.
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV

DomKen Despite the area of the forum we are on, I can't respond in any kind of serious manner to those who employ debate tactics such as these. It's beneath me to try and a waste of my intelligence.

A tip - trust that other posters are equal in intelligence to yourself, or in my view, superior in intelligence. Disagreement is not a sign of being incorrect. LOL Those with "big-people pants" can handle opposition, IMO. You know, some of us hear a new point of view and go do some research.

To everyone... did my post strike fear in your heart? Or, is that limited to DomKen?

ETA - typo

Look, I gave your posting that quack the full debunking it deserved.

Do you understand the guy attacked a breakthrough responsible for the lives of about one quarter of the people alive on the planet today? If it is so bad for everyone how come 2 billion people are alive solely because of it?

I even bothered to post both a point by point debunking of the quack's book and an actual peer reviewed scientific paper disproving his stupid claim. What more could you possibly want? The correct response is to either leave the thread or to acknowledge that you had been taken in by a quack.


DomKen

In this instance, it is your posts which appear to be "quack-ful." Staying open to other points of view works great for me, so I'll be continuing that.

And, just to clarify... I don't grant you permission to determine what MY correct responses are/ should be / will be. Got it?

Again, 2 billion people alive. Nobel Peace Prize winner vs. some guy you saw on Dr. Oz.

Come on who do you think comes out on top?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norman_Borlaug




Gauge -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 5:21:39 PM)

First of all, I want to thank everyone so far on their input. Keep it coming. I still am on the fence on the subject and this debate is helping me form an opinion based on fact rather than myth or rhetoric.

Second, all the debate has spurned me to find some objective narratives on the subject of highly debated GMO's. One such narrative is by Dr. Steven Novella, who has a blog dedicated to skepticism. As such, I have found his writing to be relatively fair and balanced. He addresses the subject of GMO's and sets out to debunk myths, and to point out very real concerns which he feels are legitimate. He stays relatively far away from speculation and delves into facts, scientific data and the benefits and risks of genetically modifying food.

Here is a link to Dr. Novella's blog: http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/the-gmo-controversy/

Edited to fix the link.




GoddessManko -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 6:09:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2014/07/neil-degrasse-tyson-on-gmo

Not certain how I feel about this video. Personally, I am on the side of labels. I also do not like the idea that he claims that because we cultivated things, genetic mutations took place and now we are getting freaked out because it is done in a lab. I would submit that while we have cultivated our foods, they mutated slowly, naturally even though we helped it by our actions. Going into a lab and radically making those mutations does not allow for nature to adjust things they way it should. I also disagree that these things could not be found in the wild, they didn't come from fucking magic, so how did the original food items we see today get here?

I also have a huge problem with a corporation having such vast control over our food supply. Perhaps it is paranoia on my part or simply history that shows us that corporations do not normally have the best interests of the human race in mind when they do things. I do not like how the companies that do this fight so hard against labeling. If it is true that we have genetically modified food all over the place and that it is just fine, then what is the harm in labeling it? The answer is money... and that is why I am suspicious.


This is a tough subject to have a definitive stance on but I'm going to present the facts as I know it and my personal view in the most unbiased way I possibly can.
Monsanto and genetically modified foods have wiped out small farming by 67%. Our food on average travels over 1000 miles which means our very survival depends on the logistical system. Those who grow their own, are very smart. Food is the new gold as one aticle stated. Due to overpopulation, there is an inherent need for subsidized farming. Now here are the pros and cons as I see it:
Cons
Firstly, it isn't a catalyzed mutation. They are changing the genetic makeup of the food itself so that it looks, tastes and has the nutritional value of an apple but TECHNICALLY it's not an apple. Why do they do it? To allow food t last longer. Why? Because it travels over 1000 miles on average. The side effects? Unknown. The nutritional value, should be similar though the live bacteria found in an organic apple are absent. Now we get them mostly in yogurt.
Secondly, this food is responsible for early puberty in children as young as three which leads to adolescent obesity. Allegedly the hormones given to cows can possibly cause ovarian cancer and causes painful cysts in the cows allegedly. Allegedly also, our milk has trace amounts of white blood cells or pus in its supply. How much is allowed by the FDA? Unknown.
With mechanically separated meat, such as spam, the meat s ground up by products of chicken, including eyeballs, genitals, organs etc. The meat is doused in ammonia and then given chicken flavoring. It is also loaded with sodium, I avoid it, as well as hotdogs that aren't kosher.
Thirdly, there have been failed experiments in the GMO process, some cases the subject (plant/food etc) no longer looks like it should. The aesthetic is completed distorted and the goal is to get an aesthetic similar. This if nothing else proves the subject can no longer be classified as "apple" per say.
Fourthly, Monsanto has been responsible for the suicides of many farmers, especially in India. There are allegations that farmers who refused to use their seeds, got their crops contaminated. Crops hat once grew from water and sunlight now required their weed killers and fertilizers to grow the Monsanto by product. The Monsanto seeds wold kill the original plants much like a weed themselves allegedly.
Over 80% of Africans are farmers and the main reason they and their farmers have been dwindling out is because Monsanto is under cutting them in prices so they cannot compete in cost or production. They are fighting a losing battle essentially.
These are the strongest arguments against GMO I can think of at the moment.
Now for the pros which are very essential to why we cannot live without them:
Firstly, overpopulation. Food production on a massive scale is helping to feed our ever growing population and even then food prices are going up and there is scarcity even in some first world nations.
Secondly, there is no feasible way to completely overhaul the entire system without doing some form of irreversible damage.
Thirdly, the organic seeds can no longer grow in the soil where Monsanto sees have been. The monsanto seed, fertilizer, and weed killer are necessary evils at this point.
Fourthly, our population will continue to grow, and despite obstacles individuals can always choose to have small gardens, at least for a start.
Fifthly, people are living longer than ever before thanks to our doctors and medical science. So these foods aren't necessarily shortening our lifespans.
These are the best arguments on either side I can think of. xox Gauge,
Manko







TeaseAndSpankMe -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 6:28:43 PM)

*Fast reply* I am against GMO's...it does more harm than good. Furthermore, if those that think it is so fantastic and the greatest thing since sliced bread (pun intended) then WHY have millions of $$$ been spent to PREVENT the labeling of food that is GMO??? If it's all that & a bag of chips you'd think they would be smacking labels on it left & right, "Hey get your healthy nutritious GMO's here!" At the end of the day, we ought to have a right to know what is in our food that we are buying so we can make an educated decision.

The grotesque rise in food related allergies and illnesses didn't just happen out of thin air. On a very personal note: I have been altering my diet due to reactions from foods now. It just plain sucks. It is no fun and it is labor-some to figure out what is in the food I'm eating so I don't get a negative reaction. I miss indulging in a rueben sandwich or pizza, etc....I had a cuban sandwhich this past Wednesday evening and am still waiting for the effects to go away. I believe that wheat and many grains are inflammatory to our body. Look at the rise of of folks on prescriptions, too. Much of that can be reversed by changing out these inflammatory foods---GMO's. Our soils are depleted of nutrients...not so easy to get magnesium anymore unless you take Epson salt baths or find a high quality supplement.

I could go on & on...but, look at who gains to make the money...Big Pharma & the Monsanto laden companies who somehow get subsidies.

I have links I can share as well... a good one I like is www.GeneticRouletteMovie.com (available through Netflix, Amazon, etc)

By the way, many of these companies that produce boxed food have ingredients that our Government allows while it is banned in other countries. I have several examples of those if anyone is interested.




Gauge -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 6:50:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: BecomingV


In one generation, in America, we've seen the rise of ADHD, Autism and Obesity. What changed? The food supply.

I, too, have to wonder if Americans are simply being used as human guinea pigs. I pay attention to discoveries and news, and I am not satisfied that GMOs are either safe, or enhancing. The lack of labeling does pander to suspicions that profits are valued over human life, especially considering American medicine is a "for-profit" business.

Until I'm satisfied that there is relatively no danger in GMOs, I don't support their consumption by any living being. We ARE what we eat.


One must ask if the rise in "ADHD" is diagnostic procedures and too many false diagnoses in order to push medicine, or simply not knowing what other label to put it under. The same could be said of Autism, not the false diagnoses but better detection and new treatments being responsible for the rise. The rise in obesity has not just taken place over the last generation but has been a problem in this country for awhile. Has the rise been because of better documentation and more focused interest in the subject? I am not arguing against you, just simply asking questions.

I am not convinced that GMO foods are responsible for the rise in ADHD, cancers, Autism, or obesity, but could be better attributed to the additives placed in our foods. Many food colorings and other chemicals have been proven to cause or contribute to ADHD, cancers and other health problems and yet, there they are in our food. The rise of obesity is a fucked up cycle mainly because people are too fucking lazy to cook from scratch and know what goes into their food. When you can get a fucking cheeseburger from your local fast food joint for a dollar, why the hell would people bother to make a cheeseburger at home? Just a walk into the supermarket is enough to show you that the American consumer is disgustingly lazy. I mean, precooked foods is huge business, just look around. Our intake of processed foods is horrifying and what is allowed to go into our food in general is shocking. Sadly, we do not have an informed consumer in America nor do we have sufficient education in our schools and beyond that provides a foundation of good nutrition. Just as a quick reference for that is Jamie Oliver's Food Revolution series both from the UK and the two seasons he did here in America. One of the most shocking things he did in that series was walk into a classroom with fresh vegetables and asked American kids what they were. Not one of them got any of them right which is very telling, however, they got all the fast foods right.

With that in mind, I cannot blame GMO's for the rise in obesity because it has been proved that those foods are nutritionally sound and perhaps better in essential nutrients in some cases. I will go out on a limb here and suggest that if people would start caring what they shove in their faces and make better choices overall, the level of obesity would decline proportionately. I would almost guarantee that if one had a diet of fresh fruits and vegetables that were all GMO's and non-organic meats, and their diets were controlled as far as portion sizes go, and there were no processed foods or junk foods, that those people would lose weight.




TeaseAndSpankMe -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 7:00:25 PM)

Could you at least check out the movie www.GenticRouletteMovie.com and then let me know your thoughts? GMO's are attributed to many food intolerances...corn allergies are very high now, for example. Also, I'm not just talking about folks weight, but actual health issues and food related allergies. You can also look up "leaky gut" it's where your body starts attacking it...just a couple of decades ago, we didn't have numerous people allergic to corn, soy, etc...

Obviously, when it comes down to eating processed fast food (which is GMO) VS. conventional GMO produce...then of course THAT is the lesser of two evils. But, take it a step further where the food is not so heavily sprayed with chemicals & is non GMO...bet their health is far better for it...and the environment, bees, butterflies... our pollinators aren't fans of the GMO crops




Gauge -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 7:05:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessManko

This is a tough subject to have a definitive stance on but I'm going to present the facts as I know it and my personal view in the most unbiased way I possibly can.

<snip>

Manko


I encourage you to read the blog that I posted. Dr. Novella actually debunks some of the claims you made and provides documentation to back it up. I heard the same things too and believed a few of them before I actually began investigating on my own.

I think the decline in the small farmer is not so much attributed to Monsanto as it is due to the fact that they are selling their land for development. I used to work for an energy company that was directly involved with farming and farmers. I know several of our farmers got out of the business and sold their acreage for millions to developers that turned the farm land into houses. Their thought process was easy, work from 4:30 AM to 9:00 PM and barely scrape by, or take a cool few million for my land and retire. A serious no-brainer.




ThatDaveGuy69 -> RE: GMO's For or Against? (8/2/2014 7:10:48 PM)

I just LOVE the fact that CS has so many molecular biologists as members!

Guess what folks: EVERYTHING we eat is a GMO!
Here's an example: You like bananas? They've been genetically modified over 100's of years to make the sweet, tasty fruit we know today.
You wouldn't recognize must of what we eat today even 100 years ago. Farmers have been cross-breeding crops for as long as there have been farmers.
The difference is that today we can do in a lab in a week what took decades in the field.

Oh, and since your post is right above this: TeaseAndSpankMe (great name, BTW) insects don't know the difference because from their perspective there isn't any.





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