Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (Full Version)

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smileforme50 -> Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 4:35:21 AM)

Maybe I'm wrong and I just haven't read enough about the Rotherham story, but the impression I got was that the police didn't want to be accused of any kind of "profiling" or paying special attention to the Pakistani men in the area, even though it seemed like the majority of the problems in Rotherham were caused by Pakistani/Eastern men.

Then when you go to the airport....while everyone has to go through "inspection", the TSA seems to pay special attention to anyone of Middle Eastern heritage....and the innocent people from these cultures feel offended for being singled out.

Then in Ferguson...and in many other cities across the U.S. ....police seem to pay special attention to black citizens, and they don't like it either.


What do you think about racial profiling? Is it totally offensive, or is it just a necessary evil where the authorities are playing the odds for the protection of everyone else?



subrob1967 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 6:43:12 AM)

I don't see the TSA profiling Middleeastern appearing people, in fact they seem to go out of their way NOT to profile them.

Where was the so called profiling in Ferguson? Brown was walking down the middle of the street instead of using the pedestrain sidewalks in the area. Wilson told him to get the fuck out of the street, and we all think we know what happened next.

Yeah, I think you're wrong because 90% of the time the truth is if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a fucking duck.



Zonie63 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 7:44:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50

Maybe I'm wrong and I just haven't read enough about the Rotherham story, but the impression I got was that the police didn't want to be accused of any kind of "profiling" or paying special attention to the Pakistani men in the area, even though it seemed like the majority of the problems in Rotherham were caused by Pakistani/Eastern men.

Then when you go to the airport....while everyone has to go through "inspection", the TSA seems to pay special attention to anyone of Middle Eastern heritage....and the innocent people from these cultures feel offended for being singled out.

Then in Ferguson...and in many other cities across the U.S. ....police seem to pay special attention to black citizens, and they don't like it either.

What do you think about racial profiling? Is it totally offensive, or is it just a necessary evil where the authorities are playing the odds for the protection of everyone else?


I would think that it could be considered offensive, although I don't know if "playing the odds" makes anyone feel more protected.

The main problem with racial profiling is that it's gone on for so long that the reaction against it is justified. Cops going around fucking with innocent people at random just because they can (even if they call it "playing the odds") will just make the guilty ones feel all the more safe.






hot4bondage -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 7:44:53 AM)

TSA's reasoning seems to be that if we don't strip-search 90-year-olds, the terrorists will recruit 90-year-olds. I'm not convinced that they have that broad of a demographic to choose from. Maybe we should only include a certain demographic if we have evidence that people from that demographic have been recruited?

Of course that's just TSA's official stance. We all know that a 90-year-old isn't usually going to be treated the same as a man wearing anything that resembles a turban. I'd like to think that TSA employees will eventually learn the difference between Sikhs and Muslims, but that's just the tip of the iceberg, and your question wasn't only about airports.

It's a tough question. I hope you get some thoughtful replies.



MrUnderwood -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 7:54:07 AM)

Why would racial profiling be a "necessary evil"? Why isn't it, "Thank God for giving me the ability to distinguish which nasties are part of me and which are foreign to my body?" I mean, do the good bacteria feel offended when I soak them with Clorox, along with the bad? I kind of wish Clorox would do the profiling for me, then I could just drink it down and it would kill, sorry, disinfect anything I didn't like. I'd like the Clorox to disinfect all the stupid bacteria that never reply to my messages here...


I think somebody more respectable than I wrote profoundly on the subject of those who exchange freedom for security.



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 8:06:36 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50
What do you think about racial profiling? Is it totally offensive, or is it just a necessary evil where the authorities are playing the odds for the protection of everyone else?

It's a bit of a Damocles Sword - damned if you do and damned if you don't.
And I don't think there's an easy answer.


Personally speaking, if 90% of the damage is inflicted by 10% of a certain region/religion/colour etc, then by targeting (profiling) that minority is statistically likely to yield better/more results than any random choice.

Yes, that minority group might feel offended for such profiling.
But hey, the safety of the majority is at stake here!
If they are that concerned about the profiling, they should start teaching members of their own group to stop such activities so they are no longer the predominant cause of such disturbances and thus avert attentions to a different group.

Hell, if 90% of bombers and suicide attackers are middle-eastern and/or Islamic, they should be targeted.
If 90% of burglaries and drug suppliers are committed by blacks, then the stop-and-search tactics should target black people.
If the predominance of drunk drivers are under-30 white males, then random stops of those drivers should be welcomed.

Just my [sm=2cents.gif]



Aylee -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 9:16:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50
What do you think about racial profiling? Is it totally offensive, or is it just a necessary evil where the authorities are playing the odds for the protection of everyone else?

It's a bit of a Damocles Sword - damned if you do and damned if you don't.
And I don't think there's an easy answer.


Personally speaking, if 90% of the damage is inflicted by 10% of a certain region/religion/colour etc, then by targeting (profiling) that minority is statistically likely to yield better/more results than any random choice.

Yes, that minority group might feel offended for such profiling.
But hey, the safety of the majority is at stake here!
If they are that concerned about the profiling, they should start teaching members of their own group to stop such activities so they are no longer the predominant cause of such disturbances and thus avert attentions to a different group.

Hell, if 90% of bombers and suicide attackers are middle-eastern and/or Islamic, they should be targeted.
If 90% of burglaries and drug suppliers are committed by blacks, then the stop-and-search tactics should target black people.
If the predominance of drunk drivers are under-30 white males, then random stops of those drivers should be welcomed.

Just my [sm=2cents.gif]



Quibble: The Sword of Damocles represents the peril that those in positions of great power are always in. I think that you may mean "Catch-22."

There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one's safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions. Orr would be crazy to fly more missions and sane if he didn't, but if he were sane he had to fly them. If he flew them he was crazy and didn't have to; but if he didn't want to he was sane and had to. Yossarian was moved very deeply by the absolute simplicity of this clause of Catch-22 and let out a respectful whistle. (p. 56, ch. 5)



cloudboy -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 9:31:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50


Then when you go to the airport....while everyone has to go through "inspection", the TSA seems to pay special attention to anyone of Middle Eastern heritage....and the innocent people from these cultures feel offended for being singled out.

Then in Ferguson...and in many other cities across the U.S. ....police seem to pay special attention to black citizens, and they don't like it either.



It's best to hear about it from a primary source:

About Stop and Frisk in NYC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdwKyEslK-c

"If you're young and black, no matter how you look, you 'fit the description.'"



Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 12:14:27 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

Yeah, I think you're wrong because 90% of the time the truth is if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a fucking duck.


Well said Donald.



Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 12:19:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zonie63


I would think that it could be considered offensive, although I don't know if "playing the odds" makes anyone feel more protected.

The main problem with racial profiling is that it's gone on for so long that the reaction against it is justified. Cops going around fucking with innocent people at random just because they can (even if they call it "playing the odds") will just make the guilty ones feel all the more safe.



Quality stuff yet again Zonie.

Stop and search in the UK has, in my view, been counter productive, due to the cumulative effects of the policy. The main one being the unwillingness of black people to interact with the police.



Politesub53 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 12:21:55 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: smileforme50


Then when you go to the airport....while everyone has to go through "inspection", the TSA seems to pay special attention to anyone of Middle Eastern heritage....and the innocent people from these cultures feel offended for being singled out.

Then in Ferguson...and in many other cities across the U.S. ....police seem to pay special attention to black citizens, and they don't like it either.



It's best to hear about it from a primary source:

About Stop and Frisk in NYC: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdwKyEslK-c

"If you're young and black, no matter how you look, you 'fit the description.'"


A powerful link.....Thank you.



cloudboy -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 2:07:41 PM)


My brother told me about this when I called and asked him what he thought about Ferguson. The line that stood out to him was: "If you're young and black, it doesn't matter how you look, 'you fit the description.'"

As for my brother's own response, he lead by saying, "The police should not be shooting civilians."

As you've seen here, many Americans approve of disproportionate force seeing the shooting and killing of unarmed blacks, a German exchange student, and a lost man with Alzheimer's as justified.



smileforme50 -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 2:17:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

I don't see the TSA profiling Middleeastern appearing people, in fact they seem to go out of their way NOT to profile them.

Where was the so called profiling in Ferguson? Brown was walking down the middle of the street instead of using the pedestrain sidewalks in the area. Wilson told him to get the fuck out of the street, and we all think we know what happened next.

Yeah, I think you're wrong because 90% of the time the truth is if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it's a fucking duck.


What are you saying I'm wrong about? I wasn't really expressing an opinion on how I feel about any of this one way or the other.

What I was referring to when I said I may be wrong was the information I gave about the Rotherham story because I haven't really read a whole lot about it...just some highlights.

I was simply stating some examples of what I have heard people describe as "racial profiling".



kkaliforniaa -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/29/2014 3:12:22 PM)

I think profiling defeats the purpose of the famous line from the Declaration of Independence, "all men are created equal". It's one thing if you have reason to suspect people of a specific ethnicity, like in Rotherham, but to go after a specific race in ordinary situations, like shopping. That is discriminatory, whether it is against blacks, whites, hispanics, tattooed, pierced, homeless, wealthy, etc.



truckinslave -> RE: Rotherham, Ferguson, airports.....and racial profiling (8/31/2014 3:07:51 PM)

Profiling... not racial profiling- profiling...... saves lives.



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