Wanting to be wanted and D/s (Full Version)

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MiniRoboX8 -> Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/18/2014 7:47:47 PM)

While exploring my submission in the past, I have had a lot of thoughts on what it means to be a submissive and what it might say about my perception of who I am. I always felt rather proud of the person I was and the kind of man that I am. However I do seem to notice that my submission does have a good deal of that "desire to be desired" in it. It's fairly common for people to seek acknowledgement and I think it's an basic need.

From a submissive perspective, there's that constant desire to be wanted by a dominant, to be considered "worth owning". Does it mean that on some level I'm not completely comfortable with myself? I'm not sure I have an answer. I feel I'm quite a catch :) ~~

How do you dominant types out there see a submissive's "desire to be desired" and how do you see your own from a dominant perspective. (maybe I'm a bit unclear??)



MissAelle -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/19/2014 12:03:19 AM)

Well, I'm not sure I really grasp what you mean, but my first thought is... doesn't pretty much everyone want to be wanted?

It's a pretty fundamental emotional need, at least to me. As a dominant female, I wouldn't own anyone I didn't want to own; I wouldn't take a sub I didn't want. As such, I wouldn't think any less of a sub who wanted me to actually want him... if that makes sense? But then again, I'm kind of a 'softer breed', if we put it that way; I want to actually love and care for my sub, it's not really about owning property (or however I should put it), more like having a beloved pet. :) Maybe people who are more into hardcore slavery and stuff would feel differently.

Or I might have misunderstood your question, of course. I'm barely awake right now, I'll blame that... :P



FieryOpal -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/19/2014 5:43:17 AM)

Submissive or not, I would be wary of anybody seeking a relationship with me who didn't want to be wanted, need to be needed, and if applicable, desire to be desired.
Further, I would question whether a person really was a submissive or a Dominant if they didn't.
This is the beauty of D/s that I discovered a long time ago. The level of intensity, the level of intimacy and devotion that I require of my intimate relationships, were not to be found anywhere else than in a D/s dynamic.

That's just my personal experience, but I believe that the very nature of D/s lends itself to certain personality types. Other personality types who can only get into the kinky aspects of BDSM don't understand what this D/s business is all about. They get hung up on so-called egalitarianism, quid pro quo, tit for tat. (Nothing wrong with quid pro quo, other than for insecure types who have to make sure they always get theirs first and want a freaking guarantee or warranty with every interaction.) It perplexes them because they aren't soft-wired to merge with another with the utter abandon that is required. Not reckless abandon, but to be willing to expose oneself by stripping away layer upon layer of ego resistance. Fusion, not fission. Submissives tend to be more vulnerable in this regard on the surface. However, the Dominant half becomes equally as vulnerable. We need our sub as much as our sub needs us, to varying degrees.

Irrespective of D/s, this has always been my trifecta of intimacy, which I had reconciled to myself a long time ago. It's an intrinsic part of who I am, of my individuality:
I have to be wanted.
I have to be needed. (I need to be needed.)
I have to be desired.

It really is that simple. Any man who doesn't understand this about me will never be able to hold onto me, because I don't stay where I'm not needed.
If he's too chickenshit to admit that he needs me, doesn't make me feel wanted as sought-after company, and doesn't make a continuous effort to show me how much he desires me, then he becomes history. Ancient history.



MiniRoboX8 -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/19/2014 8:30:52 PM)

Thank you both for your answers.

To clarify for MissAelle, I think I'm trying to hear perspectives on how the desire to be desired manifests within the intimacy of the D/s dynamic, and what perspectives the dominants might have.

I'd like to hear submissive perspectives too :)

I just found that as a submissive I feel a certain extra amount of hmmm vulnerability compared to a more vanilla dynamic. It could be because I'm more comfortable in that social dynamic or just the nature of the beast.



DesFIP -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/19/2014 8:45:05 PM)

Interestingly enough, in a O/p group on fet, it was the dominants who were much more open about needing to be needed. The subs all had sufficient bad past experiences that they were more guarded. It was the dominants need for this that made them seek m/s or o/p dynamics. So they could tailor the relationship to insure this need to be needed was met.

The difference wasn't really who needed whom, but that the dominants didn't view this as something they ought to stamp out in themselves. Subs saw it more as a weak spot which others would tear into. Like coyotes taking down a wounded deer. The dominants didn't feel this was something that would hurt them, whereas the subs did.



DerangedUnit -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/19/2014 9:19:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Interestingly enough, in a O/p group on fet, it was the dominants who were much more open about needing to be needed. The subs all had sufficient bad past experiences that they were more guarded. It was the dominants need for this that made them seek m/s or o/p dynamics. So they could tailor the relationship to insure this need to be needed was met.

The difference wasn't really who needed whom, but that the dominants didn't view this as something they ought to stamp out in themselves. Subs saw it more as a weak spot which others would tear into. Like coyotes taking down a wounded deer. The dominants didn't feel this was something that would hurt them, whereas the subs did.



Agreed



Gradschoolgirl -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/20/2014 6:16:07 AM)

I think this is a very interesting post and I've enjoyed the responses.

To me, I think it's very natural and human to desire feeling wanted, no matter what that person's "role" is. It can be tough for some people to see beyond the stereotypical presumed attitudes and realize that, at least on some level, everyone feels that way. I think sometimes sub guys, maybe in part because of the gender ratio imbalance online, feel that they have to "outdo" every other potential sub by showing how little they need out of any interaction and how they "live only to serve" etc etc etc. To be honest, those profiles just kind of make me sad. I know some people really do get fulfillment solely from serving others, but I tend to think that there are a lot more out there who use that as a bit of a front to hide the fact that they're caught up in an arms race because they think that's the only way to get someone's attention and it still springs from that desire to be wanted and to feel like you're worth pursuing/having/owning/whatever.




RedMagic1 -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/20/2014 9:49:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gradschoolgirl
feel that they have to "outdo" every other potential sub by showing how little they need out of any interaction and how they "live only to serve" etc etc etc. To be honest, those profiles just kind of make me sad. I know some people really do get fulfillment solely from serving others, but I tend to think that there are a lot more out there who use that as a bit of a front to hide the fact that they're caught up in an arms race because they think that's the only way to get someone's attention and it still springs from that desire to be wanted and to feel like you're worth pursuing/having/owning/whatever.

I attribute it more to a response to a defensive move a lot of dom women do with their profiles. After receiving twenty billion do-me messages, they change their profiles to say something like, "Don't you dare ask me if I can do X thing for you. Tell me in your first sentence how you'll improve my life, or be gone." If you look at female profiles, this comes up a lot.

A few years ago, when I was still using this site to date, I decided, "The most attractive group of women on this site is the findommes, so I'm going to hit on findommes. They are kinky and cute." And I did. Virtually every woman, when I approached her like a normal guy, said, "No I'm not serious about you're all a bunch of losers pay me. Sure I like that stuff, but I'm more interested in having a real conversation with a real person," or said, "Sorry I already have a boyfriend, but thanks for the nice note." I did eventually end up dating one, by the way. The first phone call I got after my brother died was a Collarme findomme crying at 4 am. She had worked in a hospice herself, so the situation was even more real for her. Kinky women are people too, and sometimes have very interesting life stories.

So what men don't understand is that women often write profiles as marketing, or as a defense mechanism. Then they respond to the profile as though that's really what's going on, instead of asking questions and finding out what is happening behind the scenes.



Gradschoolgirl -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/21/2014 6:08:05 AM)

Interesting, I can't say I really know much about Findommes (I don't have anything against Findommes, just never been my interest but to each their own) or paid much attention to their website but I can understand how taking on that persona could reduce the email flood a bit.

I also could see how that would fuel a response from male subs as well, almost like a perpetual motion machine where the two parts keeping feeding off each other.




seekingOwnertoo -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (11/21/2014 12:51:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MiniRoboX8

While exploring my submission in the past, I have had a lot of thoughts on what it means to be a submissive and what it might say about my perception of who I am. I always felt rather proud of the person I was and the kind of man that I am. However I do seem to notice that my submission does have a good deal of that "desire to be desired" in it. It's fairly common for people to seek acknowledgement and I think it's an basic need.

From a submissive perspective, there's that constant desire to be wanted by a dominant, to be considered "worth owning". Does it mean that on some level I'm not completely comfortable with myself? I'm not sure I have an answer. I feel I'm quite a catch :) ~~

How do you dominant types out there see a submissive's "desire to be desired" and how do you see your own from a dominant perspective. (maybe I'm a bit unclear??)




Hi, and welcome to the boards! [:)]


You need to know, all of us submissive types want to be wanted! It is a basic human instinct, regardless of the side of the kneel!

We do seek Dommes (or depending on your preference, Doms) who appreciate us for adding value to their lives. And of course, they add value to ours, too!

So it is a two way street. Same as vanilla, the only difference between this and vanilla is in the love making. [;)]

To be considered "worth owning" .. it is because you work hard to improve yourself every day. Both professionally and personally. Keep you sense of humor intact and you then will find yourself desired .. by Dominant Ladies! [:)])

Yet always make sure you appreciate and value Her, too!





Regina1955 -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/6/2014 1:21:46 PM)

William Blake wrote this in the 18th century, and it's as true today as it was then:

The Question Answered

What is it men in women do require?
The lineaments of Gratified Desire.
What is it women do in men require?
The lineaments of Gratified Desire.

Regina



FieryOpal -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/6/2014 5:14:53 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Regina1955

William Blake wrote this in the 18th century, and it's as true today as it was then:

The Question Answered

What is it men in women do require?
The lineaments of Gratified Desire.
What is it women do in men require?
The lineaments of Gratified Desire.

[sm=welcome.gif] Regina, it's always nice to have another (lifestyle) Domme join us on the fora.

Blake is one of my favorites. IMO, there should be a quadfecta of Shelley, Byron, Blake and Keats. [:)]



SMgirl66 -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/6/2014 5:31:38 PM)

hi there for me if i feel that i am not wanted or needed i will just walk away, it is a part of me that i have to have this.

i walked away from my last relationship because the Dom was indifferent now i can't speak for him and maybe he did want me but through not talking to me most days and the inability to calm my fears when i would ask it left me with a sense of it didn't matter if i was there or not. i on the other hand would always tell him how much i valued him in my life and how lucky i felt to be his because i think every human being needs to know they matter.



DaddySatyr -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/6/2014 5:41:18 PM)

I think that to some degree, this might be a gender thing.

It has been said that men are constant; they always want sex. I'm not sure that's true but it certainly seems that men, on the whole, are a bit more sexually driven than ladies.

Being a male, my experience has been that sometimes ladies forget that all human beings do, indeed, have a desire to feel wanted.

I remember one lady who thought that she wasn't "allowed" to touch me or in some way or to initiate intimacy. I never gave her that impression (as we found out in our discussions); it was how she had been "trained".

I think all human beings want to be considered desirable but I think with male submissives and female dominants, there may be less of a sexual overtone, coming from the dominant (depending upon the individual).

My advice: Don't settle. Find that dominant that gives you what you want/need and then, offer yourself.



Michael



FieryOpal -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/7/2014 11:46:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

I think that to some degree, this might be a gender thing.

It has been said that men are constant; they always want sex. I'm not sure that's true but it certainly seems that men, on the whole, are a bit more sexually driven than ladies.

Being a male, my experience has been that sometimes ladies forget that all human beings do, indeed, have a desire to feel wanted.

I remember one lady who thought that she wasn't "allowed" to touch me or in some way or to initiate intimacy. I never gave her that impression (as we found out in our discussions); it was how she had been "trained".

I think all human beings want to be considered desirable but I think with male submissives and female dominants, there may be less of a sexual overtone, coming from the dominant (depending upon the individual).

My advice: Don't settle. Find that dominant that gives you what you want/need and then, offer yourself.

Michael

It's astute of you (because there are some who are in denial about this fact) to recognize there are basic gender differences (where there are always exceptions, it should go without saying), in expressing our emotions. To wit,

When it comes to intimacy, males are more likely to express affection in a physically sexual fashion, rather than make a (non-sexual) demonstrative show of their more tender feelings.
Varying by cultural upbringing, since some cultures are more lenient about personal space and which emotions are allowed to be expressed, rather than suppressed.
This is not proof positive, but I can attest to there being men who will get hard-ons during an emotionally charged or profoundly emotional moment, including when getting hugged.

There are just some people who are comfortable with giving and receiving affection, and others who aren't, of both genders. The same with giving and receiving compliments and praise.
Others are selective about whom they will allow into that touchy-feely circle of theirs, including bristling when somebody not within that circle calls them by a pet name or term of endearment without having "earned" that degree of familiarity with them yet.
(This can also be culturally influenced. I once read a thread where every single poster jumped all over a foreigner who welcomed a new CM user with the word "dear," telling him that such verbiage was inappropriate and offensive. To them--the new user didn't have an issue with it.)

Michael, I honestly can't say what the level of intimacy is with most Dommes and their male subs, other than it varies significantly. It really does depend on whether the sub is her primary partner or not and their commitment levels.

Let me give you an example, though. With my last sub (at age 40-41), I used what I'll call frou-frou language. After about a month or so of what I perceived to be his tolerating this, I informed him that I would tone it down if it made him feel uncomfortable. He immediately protested and told me that he liked it whenever I used terms of endearment or came up with pet names for him. I wouldn't have known this if I hadn't brought it up because his level of responsiveness was not apparent at first. He did say that he wasn't used to it, which is why he hadn't quite known how to react.



cloudboy -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/11/2014 7:33:46 PM)


Validation goes a long way to making one's life better. It's even more important when you don't fit typical molds.



Regina1955 -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/13/2014 9:19:16 PM)

FieryOpal and DaddySatyr, along the gender divide, would you agree that men often desire sex, but women often desire a specific person? Or am I going out on a limb here?



DaddySatyr -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/13/2014 11:09:11 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Regina1955

FieryOpal and DaddySatyr, along the gender divide, would you agree that men often desire sex, but women often desire a specific person? Or am I going out on a limb here?



I think that's simplified and, I refer you to the old saw: "All generalizations are bound to be wrong ... except this one."

That said; yes, I think men, on the whole are more driven sexually than ladies. However, understand that this is coming from someone that doesn't believe human beings were made for monogamy.

As for the ladies, that gets into a really multi-layered explanation.

I believe that ladies have learned that men require sex as a re-affirmation of love. I also believe that some ladies have learned that controlling sex as they do, they can use that to their advantage. Women have always had the market cornered on procreation. Men have always had a drive to make sure that their genes continue on.

It's a precarious situation and a custom-made petrie dish of disaster for people who have no moral compass.



Michael



sexyred1 -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/13/2014 11:27:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Regina1955

FieryOpal and DaddySatyr, along the gender divide, would you agree that men often desire sex, but women often desire a specific person? Or am I going out on a limb here?


I love sex as much as any man, but I am really picky about who I am with.

I would rather do without than be with someone just to get an itch scratched.

I like to think that sex with a specific person is desired by everyone, but know for some men and some women, the need overrides the who.

As for the OP, of course we all want to be desired. I don't believe submission has to do with that.



FieryOpal -> RE: Wanting to be wanted and D/s (12/14/2014 12:12:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
quote:

ORIGINAL: Regina1955

FieryOpal and DaddySatyr, along the gender divide, would you agree that men often desire sex, but women often desire a specific person? Or am I going out on a limb here?

I think that's simplified and, I refer you to the old saw: "All generalizations are bound to be wrong ... except this one."

That said; yes, I think men, on the whole are more driven sexually than ladies. However, understand that this is coming from someone that doesn't believe human beings were made for monogamy.

As for the ladies, that gets into a really multi-layered explanation.

I believe that ladies have learned that men require sex as a re-affirmation of love. I also believe that some ladies have learned that controlling sex as they do, they can use that to their advantage. Women have always had the market cornered on procreation. Men have always had a drive to make sure that their genes continue on.

It's a precarious situation and a custom-made petrie dish of disaster for people who have no moral compass.

This topic can be discussed and debated until the cows come home, and then start back up again at sunrise. In giving it some more thought, I do want to point out that it has often been theorized that men who have difficulty expressing their feelings, often channel their emotions into their libido.
(An integral part of sex addiction therapy addresses this issue in both men and women.) It's a form of sublimation. From a hormonal standpoint, there's no doubt that increased levels of testosterone also factor in to a man's sex drive.

Regina, I do believe that women are more focused upon a specific partner in terms of pair-bonding.
However, not for the reason that is usually assumed, which is that men are shallower than women.
Other than a woman feeling internally pressured by her biological clock ticking, women are ready to nest when they feel they have found the right man to settle down with.
You could be any number of couples we hear about (such as with celebrities), but if the timing isn't just so for the male, it won't happen.
Until a man is ready to settle down, it can't be forced. The woman he chooses appeared at the right time in his life. It won't matter than he was engaged for 5 years to a better match a short time earlier.
A super-simplified way of putting it would be that women seek the ideal mate. Men think they've found their ideal mate when the time is right for them to make such a commitment.

Btw DS, women aren't the only ones who have cornered the market on "controlling sex." Men can be equally as controlling and withholding. Males may feel that this is grossly unfair, but don't stop to question how hurtful it is when they withhold intimacy. A woman will trade sex for intimacy. A man will trade intimacy for sex, but those who are lacking in intimacy skills will never "get it" (pun intended).

Be the type of man who withholds what he knows deep down in his heart his woman needs from him, out of spite or because he himself doesn't value that particular currency, and you'll slowly extinguish your woman's passion until there isn't even a smoldering ember or spark left. When both partners feel cheated out of what they feel is due to them, then you have a Mexican stand-off no-win situation, and this has nothing to do with how refined one's moral compass is.



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