Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty

Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (Full Version)

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cloudboy -> Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 9:50:03 AM)
From the Washington Post: • In one case, an internal CIA memo relays instructions from the White House to keep the program secret from then-Secretary of State Colin Powell out of concern that he would “blow his stack if he were to be briefed on what’s going on.” • A declassified summary of the committee’s work discloses for the first time a complete roster of all 119 prisoners held in CIA custody and indicates that at least 26 were held because of mistaken identities or bad intelligence. • The report’s central conclusion is that harsh interrogation measures, deemed torture by program critics including President Obama, didn’t work. The panel desconstructs prominent claims about the value of the “enhanced” measures, including that they produced breakthrough intelligence in the hunt for Osama bin Laden, and dismisses them all as exaggerated if not utterly false — assertions that the CIA and former officers involved in the program vehemently dispute. For 20 Key Findings in the Report, Click HERE

DomKen -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 10:26:49 AM)
So, it didn't work. It never got any actionable intelligence. It didn't actually lead to OBL. And it did lead to more terrorists hating us. Why aren't the people behind this locked?

joether -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 12:28:43 PM)
Republican and conservatives view on torture: "Its only torture if the Torturer (the one doing the torture) feels the torturee (the one being tortured) is actually being tortured" How everyone else views torture: "Its violation of the 8th amendment!" The US Constitution is pretty clear on the concept of....why....it was created. To serve as a constant reminder of not just the government's limits, but also what it 'can' and 'cant' do to all those people under its control. This includes citizens, illegal aliens, visitors, criminals, and yes, even terrorists. The 8th amendment, like the 2nd amendment, can not have half of it ignored and the other half reinterpreted for petty political reasons. The Bush administration...VIOLATED....the US Constitution, if this report is true. And it looks pretty true.... Next question... Where are all the emergency House and Senate 'investigation' committees being formed? The numerous Republicans clawing over each other to be on...THEE...committee....that finds a US President and his administration not only at fault, but doing something....REALLY BAD? You know, like Benghazi? That's right, absolute silence. Not even a hint of motion out of them. If the Republican/Tea Party were holding itself to the same level of accountability and responsibility (if not tiwce, since they think there so correct on everything), there would be massive press conferences by that party to 'get together and get the truth out to the American people!". And there isnt. Because that party holds itself to no rules, no honor, no laws. It doesn't feel it should have to. Its not like their voters, almost all whom are in the 'Low Information Voter' category, will hold them to any real and honest level of accountability and responsibility with power. Third question: Where are all the conservative and more importantly libertarian voters speaking out in outrage over all of this towards the Republican/Tea Party? Of the Bush administration? Dead silence there as well. Yet, when the concept of Benghazi came up, this forum and other places was chalked full of those same people spewing crap towards the current administration. Now that the metaphorical shoe is on the other foot, its absolute silence. There is a word for that in the English language: HYPOCRITES

cloudboy -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 12:46:10 PM)
>My organization (ALCU) and others have spent 13 years arguing for accountability for these crimes. We have called for the appointment of a special prosecutor or the establishment of a truth and reconciliation commission, or both. But those calls have gone unheeded. And now, many of those responsible for torture can’t be prosecuted because the statute of limitations has run out.< >To his credit, Mr. Obama disavowed torture immediately after he took office, But neither he nor the Justice Department has shown any appetite for holding anyone accountable. When the department did conduct an investigation, it appeared not to have interviewed any of the prisoners who were tortured. And it repeatedly abused the “state secrets” privilege to derail cases brought by prisoners — including Americans who were tortured as “enemy combatants.”< --- My short answer to your question is that Americans, the vast majority of them, don't care. This apathy then combines with a lack of political will. There is also the fear that addressing our war-crimes is akin to aiding and abetting the enemy. From what I have read, Dick Cheney can no longer travel outside the USA because he might be arrested for war crimes and the commission of torture in violation of the Geneva Convention.

DaNewAgeViking -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 1:52:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cloudboy And now, many of those responsible for torture can’t be prosecuted because the statute of limitations has run out. There is no statute of limitations on war crimes. We're still chasing down and prosecuting Nazi prison guards; the same can easily apply to Gitmo. Of course nothing will be done in the present political environment, but we can take some small comfort knowing that the Gitmo criminals will be looking over their shoulders for the rest of their lives. [sm=bury.gif]

DomKen -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 3:06:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cloudboy >My organization (ALCU) and others have spent 13 years arguing for accountability for these crimes. We have called for the appointment of a special prosecutor or the establishment of a truth and reconciliation commission, or both. But those calls have gone unheeded. And now, many of those responsible for torture can’t be prosecuted because the statute of limitations has run out.< I would argue that this is untrue. As part of an ongoing criminal conspiracy to cover up what they did the statute of limitations does not run out.

dcnovice -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/9/2014 4:31:51 PM)
FR Words fail me. Having spent much of the day trying to cope with rectal pain, I'm particularly horrified by "rectal feeding"; "rectal rehydration"; and "rectal exams conducted with excessive force." Andrew Sullivan quotes a heart-rending question from national-security reporter Eli Clifton: "Can we just call 'rectal exams conducted with excessive force' rape?" http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2014/12/09/live-blogging-the-torture-report/

cloudboy -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/10/2014 9:42:42 AM)
Is it any wonder that the only place Americans were safe in Baghdad was in the fortified, bunkered GREEN ZONE. We never won the hearts minds and created a substantial backlash from SUNNIs that is still raging today.

joether -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/10/2014 11:04:10 AM)
While the rest of the world was focus on this event (read: journalists), FOX 'news' was covering something of 'equally' great importance: Horse Shit. Or more specifically, the 'shoveling of horse shit'. That's right, FOX 'news', mouth piece of the Republican/Tea Party's 24/7/365 propaganda machine, led their top story with Shoveling Horse Shit. So while the rest of the world was reading and understanding the real things that happened during the Bush era; FOX 'news', whom was a HUGE SUPPORTER of the Bush era, was redirecting its viewers to something silly, stupid, and most of all....petty... So if your wondering why your conservative friends, family, and associates, whom only watch FOX 'news' for their information on the world, was so clueless....

cloudboy -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/10/2014 5:54:59 PM)
I would like the firing squad for these two: >>On the other side (pro torture) were James E. Mitchell and Bruce Jessen, two former military psychologists who had advised the agency to use waterboarding and other coercive methods. With the support of C.I.A. headquarters, they insisted that Mr. Nashiri and other prisoners were still withholding crucial information, and that the application of sufficient pain and disorientation would eventually force them to disclose it. They thought the other faction (anti-torture) was “running a ‘sissified’ interrogation program,” the report says. If those questioning Mr. Nashiri just had “the latitude to use the full range of enhanced exploitation and interrogation measures,” including waterboarding, Dr. Jessen wrote, they would be able to get more information. Such treatment, he wrote, after the two previous months of extremely harsh handling of Mr. Nashiri, would produce “the desired level of helplessness.” And Dr. Mitchell and Dr. Jessen, identified by the pseudonyms Grayson Swigert and Hammond Dunbar in the report, had not conducted a single real interrogation. They had helped run a Cold War-era training program for the Air Force in which personnel were given a taste of the harsh treatment they might face if captured by Communist enemies. The program — called SERE, for Survival, Evasion, Resistance and Escape — had never been intended for use in American interrogations, and involved methods that had produced false confessions when used on American airmen held by the Chinese in the Korean War. The program allowed the psychologists to assess their own work — they gave it excellent grades — and to charge a daily rate of $1,800 each, four times the pay of other interrogators, to waterboard detainees. Dr. Mitchell and Dr. Jessen later started a company that took over the C.I.A. program from 2005 until it was closed in 2009. The C.I.A. paid it $81 million, plus $1 million to protect the company from legal liability.<< http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/10/world/senate-torture-report-shows-cia-infighting-over-interrogation-program.html?ref=us

MrRodgers -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/10/2014 7:02:30 PM)
Some (including some in the ACLU) are calling for Obama to pardon many within the Bush admin. for all of this. Even though the idea is extremely repugnant, the function is that without Obama going after these people...it's an implied pass on what were clearly crimes. However, with a presidential pardon and a pardon only has standing for what was a crime, then it would chill future corrupt, warmongering admin. from conducting such 'enhanced rendering.' [sic] Otherwise known as torture. I think there is some substance to this idea as long as like so many past govt. crimes...there will be no grand jury. Again, I am sure Obama will do what he is told to do.

thishereboi -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/11/2014 6:30:37 AM)
What a nice example of blatant partisan bullshit. You have no fucking clue how the average republican or conservative feels about torture. But don't let that stop you from another rant. After all it must make you feel better or you wouldn't keep at it. So tell me joether, when you go to bed at night, do you have someone check underneath for right wingers and do you dream about them or does this obsessive hatred only fill your waking hours?

thishereboi -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/11/2014 6:39:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: joether While the rest of the world was focus on this event (read: journalists), FOX 'news' was covering something of 'equally' great importance: Horse Shit. Or more specifically, the 'shoveling of horse shit'. That's right, FOX 'news', mouth piece of the Republican/Tea Party's 24/7/365 propaganda machine, led their top story with Shoveling Horse Shit. So while the rest of the world was reading and understanding the real things that happened during the Bush era; FOX 'news', whom was a HUGE SUPPORTER of the Bush era, was redirecting its viewers to something silly, stupid, and most of all....petty... So if your wondering why your conservative friends, family, and associates, whom only watch FOX 'news' for their information on the world, was so clueless.... I don't know anyone who only watches fox, in fact most of the conservative folks I know don't watch fox at all. I guess whichever talking point told you that they all do was lying. Now my dad watches it from time to time and when I walked by the tv a few minutes ago they were discussing the subject of torture, nothing to do with shovels or shit. But I can understand why you want to suggest that that is all they have covered. Anything to make your side look superior even if it's total bullshit, right?

DomKen -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/11/2014 7:06:44 AM)
Ignoring the troll, I spent a good part of yesterday slogging through the first half of the report. I had to stop. It was just too depressing and heart breaking to think that the nation I swore an oath to had done these things. http://www.scribd.com/doc/249655870/Senate-Torture-Report And remember this is only the summary there is a 6000+ full report backing up this summary that is classified.

cloudboy -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/11/2014 8:42:47 AM)
When invading and occupying Afghanistan and IRAQ we forgot the lessons of Vietnam. • The report said the agency had evidently forgotten its own conclusion, sent to Congress in 1989, that “inhumane physical or psychological techniques are counterproductive because they do not produce intelligence and will probably result in false answers. • We forgot the lesson learned from the Church Committee.

kdsub -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/11/2014 10:58:49 AM)
I find it hard to believe that with all the leaks President Bush was not aware of the magnitude and type of torture. This goes double for Vice President Cheney. The UN has rightfully demanded that those guilty be charged and prosecuted either in the US or World Court. THIS WILL NOT HAPPEN... but it damn well should. The only way for the US to get its trust and honor back is to punish those that broke our laws as well as the U.N. Convention Against Torture which we ratified. It is a disgrace that the only person punished for the torture by the US is the one person who brought the torture to light. At the very least...President Bush and Cheney should be prosecuted and held accountable. Butch

pgashlie -> RE: Senate report on CIA program details brutality, dishonesty (12/11/2014 11:11:33 AM)
The CIA, in common with most other Sneaky Pete bodies, are fully aware the politicians are only temporary, so they take care not to let them know anything which might upset them... Or appear in their memoirs. Politicians, on the other hand, are careful not to notice anything which they might later be blamed for...

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