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RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 3:12:02 PM   
UnholyBear


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quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

I mean I also think gender is a spectrum and I resent the implication I should be more feminine and embrace it if I want to be a "cool girl".



Unfortunately the harsh reality is we are all constantly bombarded by other people's concepts of what defines beauty and what defines handsome.

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RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 3:18:35 PM   
GoddessManko


Posts: 2257
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From: Dante's Inferno
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spiritedsub2

I reread Awareness's post. It said women need to be as attractive and feminine as they can be, wih a "cute face and hot body". I think no one, including Awareness, would disagree that different men have different ideas as to what body type is "hot". Some men like super skinny. Some men like ample and curvy. I don't see how Awareness's posts could be construed as mandating a specific look or type, negating or disparaging all others, except for his own partners.


Yes to this. Totally.

_____________________________

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The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

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Profile   Post #: 302
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 3:36:45 PM   
PeonForHer


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Joined: 9/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: UnholyBear


quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

I mean I also think gender is a spectrum and I resent the implication I should be more feminine and embrace it if I want to be a "cool girl".



Unfortunately the harsh reality is we are all constantly bombarded by other people's concepts of what defines beauty and what defines handsome.


True. I was probably not the only one who had to work at not seeing himself as an ugly fucker, right throughout my teens and early twenties.

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Profile   Post #: 303
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 3:39:23 PM   
GoddessManko


Posts: 2257
Joined: 3/6/2013
From: Dante's Inferno
Status: offline 		I think Kaliko is right. I think the forums are interesting as far as human development etc.

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Profile   Post #: 304
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 3:44:43 PM   
Wayward5oul


Posts: 3314
Joined: 11/9/2014
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quote:



Right?

I guess all those long term relationships I was in were just garbage...huh...
And my guy *must* be bisexual because he is attracted to my tomboy ass.

Personally if that's what it takes to find a "good manly man" I think I'd rather not.
Really I would rather be alone than live up to those crazy standards to impress someone else.

I suppose when my current relationship ends because of what a butch girl I am ill come join you kitten. We can braid each other's hair and read Cosmo- you know- learn together.

You'll just have to be sure to not tell any future prospects about all the slutting around Ive done- lest they think me diaseased!
*goes to buy pearls to clutch and smelling salts to revive me* if I'm going to be ultra femme- I think fainting is a huge part of that so I'll be needing those things..


Yeah, I guess we are doing it wrong.

Honestly, I don't know what the men whom I engage with are thinking.


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Profile   Post #: 305
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 4:19:04 PM   
RockaRolla


Posts: 1153
Joined: 1/20/2014
From: South Florida
Status: offline 		I get most of Awareness' post. I can understand the message of "if you want to find someone, you have to make yourself as presentable as possible to your potential mate." I've seen a lot of female profiles on sites that basically boiled down to "I have a pussy, so give me what I want." I'm not even talking about findommes, but this attitude persists on vanilla sites. I never liked that mentality.

I also know that "cute face and hot body" conjure different images to different guys. So I won't make the assumption that I'll have to be model-perfect and skinny in order to get a man.

But feminine? Must I really be as feminine as possible in order to get a masculine man? And must the passion be muted in a relationship where the gender roles aren't clearly defined?

My own experiences say otherwise. Looking at the other commenters, my experience is not unique.

Tomboys can find love too. Bigger girls can find love and passion too. Shifty and I both seem to be doing well in that.
Though my boyfriend is bisexual, and my boy is bi and androgynous, so maybe in Awareness' eyes they aren't "real" men? Regardless, there's no want for passion in either relationship.

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Profile   Post #: 306
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 4:38:22 PM   
GoddessManko


Posts: 2257
Joined: 3/6/2013
From: Dante's Inferno
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RockaRolla

I get most of Awareness' post. I can understand the message of "if you want to find someone, you have to make yourself as presentable as possible to your potential mate." I've seen a lot of female profiles on sites that basically boiled down to "I have a pussy, so give me what I want." I'm not even talking about findommes, but this attitude persists on vanilla sites. I never liked that mentality.

I also know that "cute face and hot body" conjure different images to different guys. So I won't make the assumption that I'll have to be model-perfect and skinny in order to get a man.

But feminine? Must I really be as feminine as possible in order to get a masculine man? And must the passion be muted in a relationship where the gender roles aren't clearly defined?

My own experiences say otherwise. Looking at the other commenters, my experience is not unique.

Tomboys can find love too. Bigger girls can find love and passion too. Shifty and I both seem to be doing well in that.
Though my boyfriend is bisexual, and my boy is bi and androgynous, so maybe in Awareness' eyes they aren't "real" men? Regardless, there's no want for passion in either relationship.


Bingo mamasita. My besties and I are of completely different mindsets in regards to gender but I love them and the sentiment is very much requited. They would love to have me as the Stepford wife but not a business partner. That might be fine and dandy for some women but not for me. I still love them dearly though. People's preferences are all over the place. They still both think we would be well matched but I KNOW we would be ill matched and I value their friendship more than their wealth. Decision was easy for me, still is.

_____________________________

Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

(in reply to RockaRolla)
Profile   Post #: 307
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 5:29:18 PM   
shiftyw


Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline 		Roxie- I agree- you expressed it better than I, but exactly.

I also wonder what would be considered "probably diseased" and why...I don't understand that sentence, or if he is talking about hookers or just girls he thinks are slutty- which we all know I have huge issues with slut shaming also...

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Profile   Post #: 308
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 5:44:28 PM   
RockaRolla


Posts: 1153
Joined: 1/20/2014
From: South Florida
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw
I also wonder what would be considered "probably diseased" and why...I don't understand that sentence, or if he is talking about hookers or just girls he thinks are slutty- which we all know I have huge issues with slut shaming also...

Possibly both? But the way I see it, a guy going specifically for those "lowest tier" women is pretty low tier himself.

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Profile   Post #: 309
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 9:54:49 PM   
Awareness


Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kittenluv954

welp, i guess i dont have to wonder why im single anymore. im not skinny, nor am i ultrafemme. im also one of the 2% that expect a man to be attractive TO ME. i certainly dont want to feel like i need to stay drunk just in case he wants to touch me. guess i'll pack it in and go home now lol, mystery solved.

*not for unholybear but his quote rather*
So you think you're entitled to a guy with a decent set of abs and a cute face, but you think he isn't. What's wrong with this picture?

By reacting in such a way, you're telegraphing your lack of happiness. There's no reason for any woman to regard what I said as a personal condemnation unless she's insecure.

Your insecurity is a lot more unattractive than anything else.


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Profile   Post #: 310
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 10:06:45 PM   
Awareness


Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

This thread is why I don't listen when people tell me I'm pretty despite being fat. Or when they say "confidence is the sexiest thing you can wear!"

It just clearly isn't the truth...
No, it's not.

However how you feel about yourself has a significant effect upon how attractive you'll be to men.

You didn't pay attention. I specifically said the following:

quote:

Thing is, a woman with a sparkling personality can often win men over in spite of her less than perfect body if she's interacting in person. Trouble is, dating sites don't really let women display that personality in ways meaningful to men. Frankly most men are less sharp at perceiving personality online.


Consequently, it's pictures which will draw men in. There's no escaping that.

In person, your personality comes into play. However if you're nursing self-loathing because of your body, you're always going to sabotage any interaction with a guy you feel is too good for you. I've watched a friend do EXACTLY that and guided her toward the realisation that HE stopped finding her attractive when she started to believe he was too good for her. I didn't tell her this - SHE worked it out for herself.

You will improve your options when you improve your self-image.

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Profile   Post #: 311
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 10:10:54 PM   
sexyred1


Posts: 8998
Joined: 8/9/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

Roxie- I agree- you expressed it better than I, but exactly.

I also wonder what would be considered "probably diseased" and why...I don't understand that sentence, or if he is talking about hookers or just girls he thinks are slutty- which we all know I have huge issues with slut shaming also...


You ever read The Stepford Wives?
Fun book, but fiction.

(in reply to shiftyw)
Profile   Post #: 312
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 10:19:10 PM   
Awareness


Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spiritedsub2

I reread Awareness's post. It said women need to be as attractive and feminine as they can be, wih a "cute face and hot body". I think no one, including Awareness, would disagree that different men have different ideas as to what body type is "hot". Some men like super skinny. Some men like ample and curvy. I don't see how Awareness's posts could be construed as mandating a specific look or type, negating or disparaging all others, except for his own partners.


I also specifically spoke about something which yanks our crank.

Some guys are into faces. To them, the face is the most important physical aspect of a woman.

Some are into breasts. The right size and shape really drives them wild.

Some are into ass. The curve in the back and the booty that just makes them want to fuck hard.

Some are specifically into buxom (or voluptuous or whatever euphemism you prefer) women because their curves really scream "feminine and fuckable" in their minds.

There's also the idea of the golden ratio which seems to crop up over and over again. Human beings seem hardwired to find it attractive. For men, it's shoulder to waist ratio (shoulders roughly 1.61 * the waist) and for women it's hip to waist ratio (hips roughly 1.61 * the waist).

Which basically means if you have big hips, your waist can also be bigger and men will find those proportions attractive.

In many ways it's a numbers game. However if you're happy with your results, then why would you care about my post in the first place? All it's doing is proffering ideas to maximise your online success. Why people are apparently taking it personally is beyond me.

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Profile   Post #: 313
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 10:20:33 PM   
Awareness


Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

Roxie- I agree- you expressed it better than I, but exactly.

I also wonder what would be considered "probably diseased" and why...I don't understand that sentence, or if he is talking about hookers or just girls he thinks are slutty- which we all know I have huge issues with slut shaming also...
Men judge women based upon their promiscuity.
Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying.

_____________________________

Ever notice how fucking annoying most signatures are? - Yes, I do appreciate the irony.

(in reply to shiftyw)
Profile   Post #: 314
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 10:47:59 PM   
Spiritedsub2


Posts: 3316
Joined: 7/18/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: Spiritedsub2

I reread Awareness's post. It said women need to be as attractive and feminine as they can be, wih a "cute face and hot body". I think no one, including Awareness, would disagree that different men have different ideas as to what body type is "hot". Some men like super skinny. Some men like ample and curvy. I don't see how Awareness's posts could be construed as mandating a specific look or type, negating or disparaging all others, except for his own partners.


I also specifically spoke about something which yanks our crank.

Some guys are into faces. To them, the face is the most important physical aspect of a woman.

Some are into breasts. The right size and shape really drives them wild.

Some are into ass. The curve in the back and the booty that just makes them want to fuck hard.

Some are specifically into buxom (or voluptuous or whatever euphemism you prefer) women because their curves really scream "feminine and fuckable" in their minds.

There's also the idea of the golden ratio which seems to crop up over and over again. Human beings seem hardwired to find it attractive. For men, it's shoulder to waist ratio (shoulders roughly 1.61 * the waist) and for women it's hip to waist ratio (hips roughly 1.61 * the waist).

Which basically means if you have big hips, your waist can also be bigger and men will find those proportions attractive.

In many ways it's a numbers game. However if you're happy with your results, then why would you care about my post in the first place? All it's doing is proffering ideas to maximise your online success. Why people are apparently taking it personally is beyond me.

Yes, regardless of the specific body part focus, men care very much about women's looks. Women who don't wish to believe that are taking your post personally. I kind of like that truth myself; it's simple and predictable and manageable. Easy to work with. It's good that not everything has to be complicated


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Profile   Post #: 315
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 11:11:18 PM   
shiftyw


Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline 		I don't believe it because it doesn't resemble my experience. And I don't view people that way at all- like this sounds humble brag but it's just true- I could give a shit about money and looks. Maybe it's a fairytale I tell myself- but I've dated people of all sorts- from 4"8' to 6'5", from 100lbs to 350lbs, bi, straight, wealthy, not wealthy- these things arent valuable to me- and I think being told that everyone else ranks them that high is kinda weird to me, it's just not how I view these things. Given that I'm in a successful relationship and have had several- the majority of which started online- makes me wonder a lot of things- I mean- I'm slutty, overweight, and can be really butch. I'm having a hard time accepting that I'm some exception to the rule- but I suppose it's possible.

I struggle hard with my weight- that's no secret. I'm in therapy and working on it and have been pretty successful now that I'm medicated correctly- it's still slow and awful with hypothyroidism and I'll likey struggle with it my whole life. Maybe I just don't want to accept its the most important thing about me and it's been controlled by a pesky little organ that went awry. Or maybe I'm afraid all this means if I ever get cancer or maimed in an accident or what have you and lose what I already cling to with my looks no one will love me because I won't be feminine enough. I can cop to it being insecurity.

< Message edited by shiftyw -- 3/26/2015 11:13:02 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 316
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/26/2015 11:58:53 PM   
JVoV


Posts: 3654
Joined: 3/9/2015
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

Men judge women based upon their perceived promiscuity, out of fear of measuring up.


Fixed that for you.

(in reply to Awareness)
Profile   Post #: 317
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/27/2015 12:06:08 AM   
Awareness


Posts: 3918
Joined: 9/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JVoV


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

Men judge women based upon their perceived promiscuity, out of fear of measuring up.


Fixed that for you.
No. All you did was telegraph your own weakness.

_____________________________

Ever notice how fucking annoying most signatures are? - Yes, I do appreciate the irony.

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Profile   Post #: 318
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/27/2015 12:22:03 AM   
GoddessManko


Posts: 2257
Joined: 3/6/2013
From: Dante's Inferno
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Men judge women based upon their promiscuity.
Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying.


In my experience this has been true with vanilla men when my lack of desire to sleep with them would leave them baffled. So it was the sheer opposite of slut shaming. It was strange how there was an almost automatic expectation of it across the board but then I don't think my outfits back then suggested otherwise. Now I grunge it down a bit for first encounters and friendzone everyone. Simplifies things that way. Last vanilla I dated was hilarious, he said "can't we be friends...plus?" "No, no, not with benefits...but you know...plus." He was really nice but yea, no.
My bestie was the one who told me I weaponize my sexuality. I thought about it intensely and he was right so I have to make conscious efforts not to or it's in autopilot.

_____________________________

Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

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Profile   Post #: 319
RE: Women Have So Much More Opportunity - 3/27/2015 12:29:47 AM   
GoddessManko


Posts: 2257
Joined: 3/6/2013
From: Dante's Inferno
Status: offline 		Also Awareness, I disagree with your assessment of JVov and Kittenluv but you do remind me of my friends and they are not big fans of a lot of people. I suppose why your responses here are not so shocking to me.

_____________________________

Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

(in reply to GoddessManko)
Profile   Post #: 320
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