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RE: Shyness - 3/30/2015 11:15:38 AM

Gauge

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NookieNotes

If this is the case, then asking a group of strangers online what to do about it seems like a silly thing, yes? Shouldn't they be asking their mental health professional, possibly getting a prescription? Or specifically asking about what do do for a diagnosed disorder when they don't want to or cant go to a professional for whatever reason?

Well, asking strangers about virtually anything has its risks. I agree that they should talk with a professional if that has not already taken place, I was tired and forgot to add that in my post.

quote:

I think it's fair to say that you are right. Some shyness is a direct result of mental disorders.

Some shyness, yes. What they described is not some shyness, I would say in my completely armchair non-professional opinion, that what they describe is acute social anxiety... but me and all my medical degrees (that I just printed out and the ink is still drying) could definitely be wrong... but from my experience with people such as the OP... I'll stand by it.

quote:

Most of it, in varying degrees is not, so then other options would come into play, and the varied replies here reflect that.

Fair enough. Perhaps I am a bit more sensitive (touchy is the wrong word) to these subjects because of my own illness and the amount of advice from well meaning people who were only trying to help by telling me to "get over it" or to simply "cheer up" or dismissing it entirely calling it "nonsense" and that I just need proper motivation. I'm not saying that happened here, it is just the way I read it.

Certainly for someone who is shy, self-esteem and assertiveness can be a problem and could also be a strategy in helping someone with social anxiety to cope with the illness. However, saying that it is the sole, root cause of the shyness is dismissive of other possible factors.

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RE: Shyness - 3/30/2015 11:17:31 AM

NookieNotes

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~FR~

The OP does not want to be shy in the degree that they are. So, they are not just perfectly happy in that case. That's why the question was posted, so it doesn't make any sense to tell the op that they should not let anyone tell them that they are not OK. They feel not ok.

No one is saying extroversion equals mentally sound. In fact, no one should even be using introversion or extroversion in relationship to shyness. Why they sometimes correlate, they are not the same thing, and are not causal.

Introvert: A term introduced by the psychologist Carl Jung to describe a person whose motives and actions are directed inward. Introverts tend to be preoccupied with their own thoughts and feelings and minimize their contact with other people.

Shyness: Shyness (also called diffidence) is the feeling of apprehension, lack of comfort, or awkwardness especially when a person is in proximity to other people. This commonly occurs in new situations or with unfamiliar people. Shyness can be a characteristic of people who have low self-esteem.

(from the google, for simple reference)

See? Not the same thing, although they CAN pair up.

< Message edited by NookieNotes -- 3/30/2015 11:18:40 AM >

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RE: Shyness - 3/30/2015 11:41:04 AM

GoddessManko

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

Well, asking strangers about virtually anything has its risks.

I agree. I think she just wanted some FRIENDLY suggestions.
OP good luck finding a group of people who make you feel comfortable enough to tear down those walls. I think starting small as others suggested is fine. I'm going to back away slowly now.

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RE: Shyness - 3/30/2015 7:21:20 PM

camille65

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FR

I'm seriously shy. Like life interfering type shy. Strangers I have to interact with socially are the hardest, ironically I excel at retail and customer service work. I think because those are short interactions with a defined role for me. People I have to um.. having trouble with the wording but I guess 'establish a bond with' works, that is really hard for me.

The weirdest part is that I love people lol, I really do. I love humanity in all of its variety.

A few years of therapy didn't help. Antianxiety medication did not help. It is not a matter of not knowing myself or having a low self-esteem, it is shyness that I was born with.

Over time I've learned a few tricks. I plan all sorts of potential conversational gambits, I practice them at home (to my cat hahaha)so that I sound natural. I mentally line up things like movies, current events, foods I love etc.

This bit is slightly embarrassing but hey, why not. I also channel one of my sisters. She is really outgoing and confident with strangers. I've picked up on some of her body language and phrases. That way the person I'm talking to feels comfortable because my shyness isn't just radiating off me like a neon sign. Once that barrier is gone it is a lot easier for me.

I also get the whole turning away at the door thing. I do Tai Chi, when I first started I sat in the parking lot literally in tears because it was a whole lot of strangers and I wasn't even sure I could do Tai Chi. My Owner was on the phone with me and really left me no choice but to go in (damn I love him lol), so I did. The first three months I bet I didn't say a word to anyone. Now they make jokes about how I never shut up.

It is almost like having to break down a dam, over and over for me. Once that dam is breached I'm okay. Pushing myself to that point is the hard bit, but with practice I've gotten a lot better. (this is where I ask/plead that the post on my profile asking for someone to go to a munch with me because I'm too shy be utterly ignored by all lmao).

I'm a shy person who has an inner outgoing bubbly person inside.

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RE: Shyness - 3/31/2015 12:02:55 AM

Awareness

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Your shyness is linked to your self-esteem and assertiveness (or lack thereof).

I debated whether or not to reply to this... but I think I should.

Social anxiety disorder is a mental problem. http://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/social-phobia-social-anxiety-disorder/index.shtml It has nothing to do with self-esteem or assertiveness, although they can contribute to a degree to the disorder. What the OP describes as shyness sounds a great deal like the symptoms of social anxiety disorder. The fact that they use the phrase in the OP is also a clue that they likely have been either diagnosed, suspect they have it or they are in treatment for it.

Jesus Christ, you Americans are fucking certifiable. I point out that her shyness is linked to her self esteem - which it is - and you guys react by reaching for the DSM, diagnosing her with a personality disorder and suggesting she drug herself up to the eyeballs.

You'll have to forgive me if I decide that most of you have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

quote:

quote:

If you lack the ability to set and enforce boundaries, then you need to focus on your own growth before becoming involved with someone else.

The OP stated that they were in a relationship for 7 years. I suspect that this is their first venture out into the big bad world of finding a new partner after the end of that relationship... I am willing to be wrong about my suspicion, but I'll stand by it for now. That they are anxious about the process is not unusual.

She didn't say she was anxious about the process. She gave a bunch of clues. Such as:

"when it comes to first time meetings I actually find it terrifying."
"It took me 6 months to meet him."
"I find most guys very pushy and it just makes me crumble and hide."
"I do often feel very judged and often get lied to"

Someone who feels judged all the time is generally someone who fears the opinions of strangers. If you fear the opinions of strangers it's because you trust their judgment more than your own and the greatest fear is that they'll see who you really are and dislike you.

That is not the thought process of someone brimming with confidence. It's the thought process of someone who constantly fears not measuring up. Someone who doesn't believe in themselves.

The road to overcoming her shyness rests upon modifying those beliefs she has about herself. It is incredibly possible to do so, there's nothing fundamentally WRONG with her at all. She simply has a set of beliefs which don't serve her best interests.

quote:

Nowhere in the OP did it state or indicate that they had problems setting or enforcing boundaries.

Wrong. She absolutely did. I quote: "I find most guys very pushy and it just makes me crumble and hide." - when confronted with people who violate her boundaries, rather than reasserting or enforcing those boundaries she retreats and hides. This is crystal clear.

quote:

Crippling shyness that the OP described is more than likely social anxiety gone wild.

Bullshit. I find the tendency for people to slap a label on things and call for the medication to be one of the most ludicrous responses I've ever seen.

I'll also point out that the DSM is written by psychiatrists. Who have no evidence-based practice behind anything they do. It's all voodoo black-magic nonsense with no scientific foundation whatsoever. So it should come as no surprise to discover that I consider it a bunch of utter fucking horseshit.

quote:

Not everything is as easily answered as you tried to make it. I have had to endure people for years telling me that all I needed was a kick in the ass to get over my depression. I have suffered major depression all of my life... if a kick in the ass was all it took, I would have folks lined up around the block with steel tipped boots on.

No, not everything is easily answered, however despite your personal experience, there's no reason to presume personality disorder because someone's shy. That strikes me as one hell of an overreaction.

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RE: Shyness - 3/31/2015 3:16:17 AM

IcarusBurning

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quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65

FR

I'm seriously shy. Like life interfering type shy. Strangers I have to interact with socially are the hardest, ironically I excel at retail and customer service work. I think because those are short interactions with a defined role for me. People I have to um.. having trouble with the wording but I guess 'establish a bond with' works, that is really hard for me.

The weirdest part is that I love people lol, I really do. I love humanity in all of its variety.

A few years of therapy didn't help. Antianxiety medication did not help. It is not a matter of not knowing myself or having a low self-esteem, it is shyness that I was born with.

...

I'm a shy person who has an inner outgoing bubbly person inside.

exactly. shyness is not a disease. its lovely to read how you have worked out your life around it and not given up something that makes you unique.

< Message edited by IcarusBurning -- 3/31/2015 3:17:15 AM >

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RE: Shyness - 3/31/2015 8:06:32 AM

Charles6682

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I can be shy around people I don't know. I have had issues of social anxiety in the past. Once I get to know certain people and know they are descent people, then I am more open and social. It really just depends on who the person is.

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RE: Shyness - 3/31/2015 8:37:43 AM

camille65

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IcarusBurning

quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65

FR

I'm seriously shy. Like life interfering type shy. Strangers I have to interact with socially are the hardest, ironically I excel at retail and customer service work. I think because those are short interactions with a defined role for me. People I have to um.. having trouble with the wording but I guess 'establish a bond with' works, that is really hard for me.

The weirdest part is that I love people lol, I really do. I love humanity in all of its variety.

A few years of therapy didn't help. Antianxiety medication did not help. It is not a matter of not knowing myself or having a low self-esteem, it is shyness that I was born with.
O
...

I'm a shy person who has an inner outgoing bubbly person inside.

exactly. shyness is not a disease. its lovely to read how you have worked out your life around it and not given up something that makes you unique.

I really have no choice but to work around it, unless I want to be isolated.... Which I don't. I'm even really shy around
People I haven't seen for awhile, I have to break through it all again. Using tai chi as my example once more: I've missed about a month of classes, now I'm all worried that when I go back no one will remember me. Intellectually I know that is just plain goofy, emotionally it is valid. That fear of not being recognized is also why I never change my hairstyle lol.

Sorry for odd syntax/typing, on iPad and I'm not fond of touch screens!

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RE: Shyness - 3/31/2015 3:33:09 PM

DesFIP

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Benzos don't work for mood disorders. SSRIs do. 18 months on Paxil would probably eliminate much of the anxiety you get from these situations.

Having multiple mood disorders, I'm fairly knowledgeable. Actually I'm remarkably knowledgeable about it. That's why my daughter's still alive, despite having an exceedingly rare disorder that according to the textbooks should have seen her kill herself by no later than age 20. As far as we know, she's the first with this to survive, and thrive.

I'm positive about the things I do excel at. It's not self esteem. It's a fucking mood disorder. I'm fourth generation mood disorder in this country, no data from prior to immigrating. And yes, we only see psychiatrists who are knowledgeable about genetic mood disorders. None of this "it's because your parents didn't love you enough bs".

Therapy helps as does learning coping skills. But just because you have developed non medication coping skills does not mean you don't have the mood disorder.

Any book on ADHD will give you a list of coping skills, tricks to help you deal with it. It doesn't mean that because you aren't so ill that you require medication that you still don't have the problem. Far from it. Or that you wouldn't be even better off if you took the medication and used the coping skills.

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RE: Shyness - 5/12/2015 9:40:28 PM

MisterDutton

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Great topic and line of thinking...Would love to share and hear more..

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RE: Shyness - 6/21/2015 8:17:41 AM

daniel1973

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Dear cerebralfem, if your would-be masters can't handle your shyness they are not really cut out to be masters.
I am shy myself and I can tell you taking off all of my clothes in front of another person at first felt like facing a firing squad.
I say: face your fears but expect to be rewarded.

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