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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/1/2004 4:18:34 PM

jillwfsub4blkdom

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Dread,
i thought Your comments were spot on. i totally agree with what You had to say. lol don't fall over.

jill

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Our physical into a more spiritual level of understanding" - Musiq

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/4/2004 2:26:29 PM

houndguy

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From: Pittsburgh, PA - USA
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I fall somewhere in the middle of these two opposing camps...which means I need to keep my ass down or it will be shot off.

I am in an Open Marriage for about a year and a half now. It does require constant communication and understanding...but is possible to make it work.

My wife has no interest in BDSM nor do I have any interest in her kink...so in order to make us both happy this was the best course. She brought it up because we were heading for a very nasty divorce at the time...but still loved each other and wanted to try and make it work.

You got married because you love the man, talk to him...discuss it. He may surprise you. That being said I'm still not happy as the day I got married, but I'm happier today than I was yesterday.

Now for the other stuff...nothing should be more important than family. If work is more important than that to you it's time you consider the divorce factor. We have all put work before family at one time or another and as long as it's a temp sitution it's not bad.

Your post tended to indicate you would rather work than discuss this with him. That is a very bad thing.

Rant over.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/5/2004 5:06:10 AM

MistressIrish

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I've never posted here before, basically just reading all the threads...but this thread struck home for me. I, too, am a married female that has had to find satisfaction elsewhere. I understand that the opinions of some here have been opinionated, but you know you will get that when you seek advice. There will be advice that you don't want to hear.

In my situation, my husband simply has no interest or desire in anything sexual. He hasn't since starting a medication for a back injury. I've explained to him my needs and things that I desire to experience, to which he has simply said "I can't do that." Yes, I know, people are going to respond to that with...DIVORCE HIM! Easier said than done, especially when the two people share a terrific and wonderful child.

Our marriage has been strange at best. He is very self-involved, his basic needs come first and his child and I fit in somewhere between Monday Night Football and hunting season. We have, for the past 6 years, lived in the same house as roommates. There is very little communication, and basically no sexual fulfillment. But, I do love him but it isn't that crazy, obsessive love that a couple should have. I love him as a person I can't imagine not being in my life. I realize that I've broken our marriage vows, by cheating. Believe me, any person with any type of conscience realizes that. And I hate living a life of lies, but at this point in my life, I must.

As far as developing a realationship elsewhere, I have a wonderful pet. And we do trust each other implicitly. He knows all about my life and the situation I'm in, and he respects my decision.

I apologize for babbling, but I feel for you because I'm in the same situation. You need to make the decision for yourself about what to do. I applaud you by wanting to come clean, I know I've thought of it every day since I was unfaithful. It doesn't mean that your a slut, or any other derogatory name. It means that you realized that your wants and needs unfortunatley fall outside of your marriage. Be prepared, though, that your husband wont understand, at least at first. He may shock you, but more than likely, he will be very angry. The possibility of divorce or separation is very real. I have to ask you though, is that what you want? Sometimes people come clean or purposely get caught in things to bring on a dissolution of a marriage, just so they don't have to initiate the conversation. Let the truth come from you, true, it will hurt him...but it would hurt him so much more if he found out from someone else or stumbled upon something. I hope I've helped in some way.

I fully expect harsh comments to my post from some...fire away!

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/5/2004 10:24:17 AM

proudsub

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quote:

fully expect harsh comments to my post from some...fire away!

No harsh comments here, been there done that. Good luck MistressIrish.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/5/2004 8:36:25 PM

genuineredneck

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i have to agree with you "asyouwishmater" i read the posts from beginning to end and i was totally humiliated how cruel MisteressDread was. I have made my share of mistakes i and i am sure that there are things that you omitted from your post for reasons that it is not our business. but i have to say that those are yours to look at not anyone elses. I have made mistakes finding a Master and Dom and i have found that i want this but i am happy i did not get married before this because i would have been in a similar situation that you are. people grow sometimes it is in different directions.

We are never the same as when we get married the next day we are different. We grow and learn everyday. We learn more about ourselves . Keep your head up. I know in my life no matter what has happened that was bad, something good has come out of it... i hope you have this. don't regret what you have done it will lead you somewhere and to something bigger than you know now.
Regret is not about being remorseful. That is what not doing it again is about. regret is about being ashamed of who you are. HELL i don't and can't regret being abused as a child. my life and subsiquent choices have led me to have a child of my own and to protect her in everyway and to the point of being able to make better choices and to heal from within. I have lived and i continue. I encourage you to do what you need to to be happy.

My thoughts are with you.
red

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/5/2004 8:52:15 PM

genuineredneck

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I also have to add The lifestyle is different for everyone. Some things don't stay the same for everyone. some things are different in different situations and for different people.

People have different standards for the rules and laws that were spoken about above. interpretations are different for everyone. what works for one person does not work for everyone. let us help not hinder this woman in her plite. it is not anyones business how she got there. that is for her and her husband and possibly her Master to deal with. What we are here for is to offer support and help to get it solved. She is a fellow sister in submission. That is what ties us together (no pun intended) we are all into some form of kink or another and need support from others to help us on our own journey.

AsyouwishMaster honey, the only thing i can offer is i am here if you ever want to speak to me.

red

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/5/2004 9:48:32 PM

Estring

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She involved us in her situation by posting on the message board. She wanted opinions, not a Hallmark greeting.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/6/2004 10:47:16 AM

EStrict

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quote:

What we are here for is to offer support and help to get it solved. She is a fellow sister in submission.

That may be why you are here, but I am here to be honest in what I believe, truthful in what I say, and realistic in what I offer as advice. When asking advice in a public forum, remember the old adage, *if you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen*....

Of course, there are many that post in the hopes of getting validation on how everything they are doing is *of course* right, and how they are the *poor victims* of timing, society, or unusual circumstances. From my perspective, they are living in a fantasy world, and they are more than welcome to live there, but when they chose to float their boat in this pond, they best be prepared for the possible waves.

As far as *sisters*, well I have 2 (and only 2),, they were given to my by my mother. And if either of them was this dishonest with their spouse, I would slap some sense into them and support HIM. I would still LOVE them as my sister, but I would not respect them for their dishonesty, and would be unable to support them in continual dishonesty ... sorry...

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/6/2004 4:14:40 PM

jillwfsub4blkdom

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Sandy,
i agree with you wholeheartedly. lol i have two sisters too and only two.

jill

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Our physical into a more spiritual level of understanding" - Musiq

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/6/2004 10:43:53 PM

CTclay

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Dread's dread words were as much on the money as the Hallmark cards from other posters. Plain truth (from Dread) has its place, so does sympathy, and it's hard to map out for asyouwishmaster just how royally she was still screwed up while sounding sympathetic. (Actually, if you take another look at Dread's post, you'll find she does express some sympathy.)

I'm a bit more critical of some of the Hallmark-card posters in this thread. When you wish to send the very best, you don't eliminate judgment. Even sugarcoating is supposed to sugarcoat some medicine. Adultery happens to be wrong. It also happens to be repulsive. Start a thread about your adultery and expect people to express their revulsion. Remember people: There was a victim here. Sometimes we can take so much care to be nonjudgmental that we screw the victims.

None of us posting know the full situation with asyouwishmaster, and its entirely possible that Dread, for instance, may have been too harsh with someone in a situation where that wasn't appropriate. Big deal. It's hard to see much harm in that. I see a lot of good in it. Sometimes people need to be shaken up, sometimes soothed. Hard to tell on an Internet posting board, so you starts your thread and you takes your chances.

I think the more sympathetic posts will do some immediate good for asyouwishmaster because, as she said in a follow-up post, she's listening to that good advice. I hope she reads Dread's postings later when she's in a frame of mind to be open to them and absorb the good sense from them. I think sympathy and plain words were both useful.

And has anyone else noticed the irony in this fetish for nonjudgmentalism on a BDSM message board? When we get into BDSM, don't we open up ourselves to being judged by stricter standards about a lot of things? It's not so much that standards are higher in BDSM, but there sure are more of them. Sure, not every sub should be submissive to every domme, but thick skins are useful for more than accepting flogging, and spines are good for more than service.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/7/2004 5:16:47 PM

LadySonelle

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Actually, Ms Dread, My first servitor, k, and I were having a very similar discussion and this situation may be more apt than not.

We were talking about why gay marriages, kinky marriages, or even marriages formed by people who 'lifestyle' *anything* (SCA, SF Fandom, RVing, showing dogs, etc) just seem to *last longer* than conventional heterosexual, non-fannish, non-kinky marriages.

We came to a realisation: that most "mundames" (straight, non-kinky folk) too often marry because they feel it's expected of them. "Ohmigosh! I'm 24 and not *married* yet!!" they focus on the act of marriage. They could marry a *fencepost* and it wouldn't faze them because it's the *act* of matrimony that has them in its thrall...

Fannish, kinky, lifestyling, hobbyist, alternative folk tend to focus not on marriage, but on their interests. They find a friend who is into the same thing and they hang out together, learn together, become really great friends together... and eventually they look at each other and one of them (or the other) says "Y'know... we really need to house out Isaac Asimov (or model railroad or nipple clamp) collection in one place instead of two! Ya wanna get married? We can sell our duplicate Star Wars figurines (or St. Andrews cross or antique automobile or set of jousting armor) and pay for the next Con (or munch or Gather or...) The marriage is an afterthought.

What this means is that when people begin life, they are still discovering themselves. They don't KNOW for certain if they're gay, kinky, inclined toward poly or sub or whatever. They are led by society to marry, marry, forGodsakebeforeAuntBerthadiesunhappy M*A*R*R*Y! They find a guy/girl they like (or love) but the focus in on the marriage aspects. When they begin to grow a bit, find out that they really WANT a partner of the same sex/kinky/into Star Trek/who is a German Shepherd, they are already trapped!

This is the point where geeks, freaks and uniques have the last laugh. Having waited or having been convinced by society's distaste for them that they were not marriageable, they have bypassed the whole "who am I *really* now that I'm old enough to drink?" paradigm.

It's also why second marriages tend to be more stable than firsts, if the parties are not all culture-glamoured.

So let us not fall into the error of thinking that simply because a person changes *within* the marriage, that they have no honour! They may very well not have had a clue when younger.

Due to society's attitudes and opprobrium placed on homosexuality, I entered into an 8 year marriage I was ill-suited for. I made My husband aware, almost immediately, once I realised I was not the wife he thought I was, and we lasted for a while longer in mutual understanding, but in the end, for his own growth and well-being, I released him. I did not find out I was "into" BDSM as well as being bi, until I was 30 years old! Having married at 24 (because it was *expected* in our social circle) I was clueless.

It happens more often than we know. Who else here discovered their kinky side *after* they tied the knot?

Lady Sonelle

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/7/2004 9:04:10 PM

Lordandmaster

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Well, I didn't say Dread was wrong or evil; I said she was unhelpful. Like your saying "Adultery happens to be wrong"--how is that helpful to the original poster? Either she agrees with you or she doesn't, and either way she doesn't need to be told. It's not as though she's never heard it before.

quote:

ORIGINAL: CTclay

Adultery happens to be wrong.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/7/2004 10:02:31 PM

LadyShoshin

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From: Burlington, Ontario
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quote:

ORIGINAL: asyouwishmaster

Thank you all for your replies. I have a little more confidence now. I will pick up both books recommended by LadyShoshin, they are probably very good reading. I know this will not be easy at all but I am prepared for the worst. I will wait until after the holidays, only because I have a project at work that will need my full attention between now and year end. But in January I will make my move...one way or another (no pun intended). Thanks for all of your responses. I can't tell you how thankful I am to have found this site. It has been helpful beyond words.

I agree that around family centered holidays isn't a good time to drop a relationship bombshell. I knew last year in the fall that I had to end my 24/7 relationship, but I was going through a job change and then we moved to be closer to my job. Things went to hell from there and I really wanted to tell him to leave. But around the holidays I was blessed to have 2 wonderful friends who needed a place to stay. So Christmas came & went and my friends moved in. Before the holidays I was hospitalized several times and was off work which made things even worse. But with the support and love of my friends I was able to tell him to leave. I gave him time to find a place and I slept on the couch. By the end of February he knew I wasn't kidding. I let him know if he was there March 1st he would be arrested for trespass. Sorry, I am rambling, but I totally agree, wait until after the holiday hubbub has died down.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/7/2004 11:41:02 PM

amalie

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This has been a very interesting thread to read and i really appreciate having the opportunity to hear and consider the numerous informed and well considered if sometimes disparate viewpoints.

Unless i'm mistaken however the discussion got completely off track in terms of the question originally posed: how to inform the husband of what's happening.

This is probably a more difficult question to respond to which would explain why it has been difficult to stick to the topic.

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/8/2004 3:26:48 AM

MistressDREAD

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maybe My back ground SHOULD be stated here so that others can understand My mindset to this situation.

I was married at 14 in an arranged marriage. I was NOT in love with the person I married when I married.I learned to Love the person I married as He learned to love Me and Our marriage threw open and truthful COMMUNICATION worked by finding Our likenesses and differences and worked around them for Our Commitment to One another for life and both had to forsake some things and give up things for the better good of the One*, being US. Where I come from Marriage is a lifetime commitment and not something thats put on like a dress to see if it fits and thrown away if its no longer in style. Me and My Partner decided thru open communication on a Poly relationship from the onset as well as a BDSM based Lifestyle and after being married 11 years brought in a second partner into Our Poly Unit which lasted 27 years for My first Mate and 16 years for My second Mate till their both passing on. There was Great Love and commitment formed from these relationships as well as much Giving not only to one another but Giving up of the things that others desired for the betterment of the whole. Life and Love is give and take until its worked out for a lifetime in My Opinion and yes I am very critical in My comments because what I see today in society as a whole is not just laziness in working on relationships but laziness in all aspects of peoples life and living and so many take the easy way out on many levels and put priorities on the absolutely wrong thing and self gratification and this is what I seen in this post of a person whom asked OUR OPINIONS AND ADVICE of which I gave. I most definitely see a victim here and it is not the poster and for this person who I see not only as being betrayed but not being given even the slightest of consideration or thought and is being shown in My eyes as a * secondary object * I cannot but help become cynical and critical in My voice and state the nasties that no one else wants to come out and say but will no doubt whisper behind closed doors as many do. I'm a realist and I see things as they are shown but I do have Integrity and Honor and yes maybe even some Valor as well and will stand up for the ones being abused as well. I see this person as being abusive. Its one thing to have an affair and then feel guilty over it or to even fess up to it but when I see the whole slew of * OTHER things being put in front of this relationship and not just another persons or sex or servitude well all I see is well I will not even say what I see but as I said before I DO NOT see a slave............ JMO. Judge ME how You will on My opinions. I did show sum empathy but after the persons comments not desiring to hear the truths of all sides I no longer have any except for the husband at this point. just like a addict a person looks for those whom have something in common to gain strength from and this person in My opinion was weak and needed those strokes of those that were in her same position so that she could take action and then say that it was such and such whom said this and that to validity her actions. I will not do such. And as for her putting EVERYTHING else before her marriage well no doubt until she learns self sacrifice for the right priority she will have many of these kinds of relationships. And amalie I did give My advice and opinion however the poster didn't want to hear My advice and like My opinion has over looked it completely not wanting to deal with what is obviously the problem here. Cant fix a problem if you don't acknowledge it exists.

< Message edited by MistressDREAD -- 12/8/2004 3:39:37 AM >

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RE: Coming clean with The Husband - 12/8/2004 10:28:53 PM

CTclay

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Well, I didn't say Dread was wrong or evil; I said she was unhelpful. Like your saying "Adultery happens to be wrong"--how is that helpful to the original poster? Either she agrees with you or she doesn't, and either way she doesn't need to be told. It's not as though she's never heard it before.

Actually, the original poster seemed pretty ambivalent about the morality of it, with some statements seeming to realize it was at least a little wrong and others seeming to want to water down the turpitude even further ("Please save your judgement ... I have no regrets." -- Those sentences were literally woven in between others that seemed to view her actions as something worse -- so I'd call her statements ambivalent.) Then she expresses rage about Dread's post.

I was actually making that comment as much to her as to the posters who were expressing so much sympathy that they gave the impression there wasn't much wrong with what she did. Ambivalence on her part about remorse and on their's about whether she really did need to be all that sorry -- sounds like she, and they, were acting "as though she's [and they've] never heard it before."

Your comment about not being "helpful" and Amalie's about the discussion getting "off track" show an admirable desire to want to be helpful and to wish that a lot of help be given, but I don't think we need to rigidly fulfill only the original poster's desires in this thread. One of the ways we can be helpful is by pointing out what we see wrong in the original post.

This is a message board, not a therapy session where a nonjudgmental attitude is useful and even necessary to help a person open up or accept other comments. On a message board, it is less unhelpful to express a judgment, and there are competing values here. Applying nonjudgmentalism to a message board is inappropriate because the board is set up to share opinions (among other things) and the hurt it may cause is less damaging than in a therapy session. If being nonjudgmental ("she doesn't need to be told") is your way of being cool, socially correct, courteous, "helpful" or whatnot ... hey, sorry -- not my kink.

Just remember to be nonjudgmental about my being judgmental.

The message board is for the benefit of all of us, not just the one who initiates a thread. I actually think it's unhelpful to the rest of us to try to discourage discussion of her attitude regarding adultery.

Adultery is a big deal -- an especially big deal in the BDSM community. I've cut off "get to know you" instant-message sessions with more than one domme who said in her profile that she was interested in finding someone for BDSM and sex but told me it was none of my business whether or not she was married. I recently found out from another domme that she was married and that in meeting me and getting naked together, she was acting behind her husband's back.

We literally play with emotions in BDSM, and we literally play with fire. so strict attitudes about integrity are damn good habits to want to spread around.

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