RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya?

RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

Real0ne -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/10/2015 3:39:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tj444 quote: ORIGINAL: GotSteel I mean you do get that her use of an unsafe water supply is putting her health in danger right? so what? whats it to you? there are lots of people that put their health in danger day-after-day, year-after-year, those that smoke, do drugs, overtake prescription drugs, eat junk food, dont exercise, drive too fast, sky dive, work as soldiers, those that are homeless, people that eat puffer fish, sushi eaters, drunks, etc, etc.. Imo, how she lives hurts no one else and its her life to live it as she wishes to.. But there is no public junk food umbilical cord hooked up to you that they have the legal authority to collect money from you every month regardless if you use it or not! We are right back to the gubmint taking your money issues which is invariably a forced democratic one shoe fits all arrangement.

GotSteel -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/10/2015 3:50:14 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne where does it say she or by anyone other than you that her water was treated with CS? Says it all over the place: quote: ORIGINAL: http://www.fox4now.com/features/4inyourcorner/Living-off-the-grid-231951011.html And gets her water from rain barrels. She uses a colloidal-silver generator to disinfect that rain water quote: ORIGINAL: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/patrick-j-kiger/off-the-grid-life-below-zero_b_5027563.html For nearly two years, a Florida woman named Robin Speronis reportedly has been relying upon solar panels for her electricity and collecting rainwater, which she treats with colloidal silver to kill the pathogens and render it safe for drinking and bathing. She uses a five-gallon bucket with a plastic bag inside for a toilet. quote: ORIGINAL: quote: ORIGINAL: http://zap2it.com/2014/04/sponsored-ngcs-life-below-zero-explores-living-off-the-grid/ For nearly two years, a Florida woman named Robin Speronis reportedly has been relying upon solar panels for her electricity and collecting rainwater, which she treats with colloidal silver to kill the pathogens and render it safe for drinking and bathing. She uses a five-gallon bucket with a plastic bag inside for a toilet.

Real0ne -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/10/2015 3:54:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GotSteel quote: ORIGINAL: MAINEiacMISTRESS Raising the temperature above 170F (boiling or leaving a water bottle on sun-heated metal or rock) kills bacteria. Also there are products like PUR and Brita that make faucet filters and filtering pitchers. I've hiked the Appalachian trail, 2,182 miles from Georgia to Maine. As well as having stayed at a number of off grid places that used cisterns. It isn't that I'm unfamiliar with water purification. Everyone agrees that there are ways to do what she's trying and that includes the city: quote:* ORIGINAL: http://www.bloomberg.com/bw/articles/2014-07-10/off-the-grid-in-florida-robin-speronis-fights-municipal-code#p2 “There are an awful lot of alternatives out there that meet code,” says Frank Cassidy, the city’s code compliance division manager. “The problem is that she is not using those methods.” He ticked off a litany of municipal resources for cisterns, composting toilets, retrofit grants, equipment, housing assistance, and programs to sell excess solar power to the grid. The problem is that she's not using those ways. From th eOP link: Special Magistrate Harold S. Eskin ruled that the city’s codes allow Robin Speronis to live without utility power but she is still required to hook her home to the city’s water system. Her alternative source of power must be approved by the city, Eskin said. As previously reported in Off The Grid News, Speronis has been fighting the city of Cape Coral since November when a code enforcement officer tried to evict her from her home for living without utilities. [Yes city logic: she is far better off living in the street!] The city contends that Speronis violated the International Property Maintenance Code by relying on rain water instead of the city water system and solar panels instead of the electric grid. The International Property Maintenance Code is used in communities throughout the United States and Canada. The code states that properties are unsafe to live in if they do not have electricity and running water. Speronis has electricity and water. She gets running water by collecting rainwater and electricity from solar panels. “It was a mental fistfight,” Speronis’ attorney Todd Allen said of Eskin’s review of his clients’ case. “There’s an inherent conflict in the code.” Part of the conflict: She must hook up to the water system, although officials acknowledge she does not have to use it. Magistrate Admits Code is Unreasonable Eskin spent several hours reviewing the case and admitted that the code might be obsolete, the local Press-News newspaper reported. Harness the power of the sun when the power goes out… “Reasonableness and code requirements don’t always go hand-in-hand … given societal and technical changes (that) requires review of code ordinances,” Eskin was quoted as saying. Eskin’s remarks indicate that he views the code as both obsolete and unreasonable and in need of change. Yet he felt he had to enforce it. [Lower courts NEVER rule against the city, and ALWAYS waste your money by deferring forcing you to appeal!] The city did overstep its authority and may have violated due process procedures, Eskin noted. He felt that the city had not given Speronis proper notice of violations and ruled that some of the charges against her were unfounded. How about that? The gubmint leveling FALSE charges against someone, what a shocker!!! [:)] “I am in compliance,” Speronis told the News-Press. “I’m in compliance of living … you may have to hook-up, but you don’t have to use it. Well, what’s the point? A code enforcement officer designated Speronis’s home as uninhabitable and gave her an eviction notice a day after the piece aired. It is not known what action the city will take but city officials told Fernandez that they would be willing to let Speronis stay in her home if conditions are “sanitary.” [irellevant they have no right to inspect her home for sanitation over a utility code violation charge. They want to use that as their get out of jail free ticket] At the hearing, Eskin noted that city officials have not actually been in Speronis’s home to make that determination. http://www.offthegridnews.com/current-events/court-rules-off-the-grid-living-is-illegal/ That said I do not see where you are coming from with your claims that she has violated any ordinances? Care to explain yourself, that is where you are getting that that from?

Real0ne -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/10/2015 4:08:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GotSteel quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne where does it say she or by anyone other than you that her water was treated with CS? Says it all over the place: I'll be damned, learn something new every day [8D] I use CS myself for other reasons but had no idea it was almost totally effective as a water purifier against 'growing stuff'. Colloidal Silver and Unsafe Drinking Water in Developing Nations According to the World Health Organization (WHO), contaminated drinking water is one of the leading causes of preventable deaths, worldwide. “Every year more than five million human beings die from illnesses linked to unsafe drinking water, unclean domestic environments and improper excreta disposal,” says WHO. In fact, over 2 million deaths occur each year from water-related diarrhea alone, caused by pathogen contamination in the drinking water. Indeed, at any given time, almost half of the people in developing countries suffer from water-related diseases, according to WHO. Could using colloidal silver help resolve this tragic problem, until the standards of living in these remote areas of developing nations can be raised and new infrastructure built? Hi, Steve Barwick here, for www.TheSilverEdge.com... The answer to the above question is a resounding yes. Colloidal silver could easily be used to dramatically reduce the tragic and indefensible numbers of deaths caused by pathogen-contaminated drinking water. The use of colloidal silver as a means of ridding drinking water of bacterial, viral and fungal contaminants is not a new idea by any means. For example, in Mexico, where local water supplies are not always safe in rural areas, a colloidal silver product called Microdyn has been used for decades to help keep residents safe from contaminated drinking water. According to The Silver Institute, a group that reports on the many uses of silver worldwide: “Since 1955, with the approval of the Ministry of Health of Mexico, Microdyn, a silver colloid, with a particle size of about 2 manometers, has been used to provide healthful water for its citizens. ‘A few drops of Microdyn available in small bottles provides sufficient silver to disinfect clear drinking water in about 10 minutes,’ states Luis Arizcorreta Buchholz, president of Roland de Mexico, S.A, de C.V, Mexico D.E, Mexico. ‘It’s a convenient disinfectant for individual use in areas wherever tap water is suspect. Microdyn has also found wide popularity in Mexico as a rinse to disinfect fruit and vegetables. It is also active against spores and parasites.’ Microdyn is also made available in a soluble carrier which is painted on the interior of cisterns for the long-term disinfection of drinking water. Its use is credited with a dramatic improvement in the health of the residents of the town of Cruz Azul, Lagunas, Oaxaca, Mexico, who for years had suffered rampant gastroenteritis. The introduction of a Microdyn coating to the town's water supply cisterns in 1977 made the difference. Other local water supply systems treated with Microdyn achieved similar results. A study by Microbiological Research & Development Inc. of Tucson, Arizona, proved the relative power of Microdyn against that of chlorine. At the 0.025 milligram per liter (mg/liter) level of Microdyn silver (the United States Environmental Protection Agency suggested limit for silver in drinking water is 0. 100 mg/liter]… …water charged with 2,700 units per liter of the fecal conform Echerichia coli (E.Coli) bacterium was completely sterilized in less than three hours, whereas the chlorine to sterilize the same charge of bacterium over the same period of time required 40 times greater concentration. In another test, water charged with 100 times that amount of fecal coliform required 8 times the normal concentration of Microdyn for complete sterilization, whereas 10 times the concentration of chlorine was required. In every case, the disinfectant power of Microdyn was greater than that of chlorine. Silver's antibacterial power is so strong that Microdyn contains only 3,575 parts per billion of silver per liter, or less than 2 milligrams silver per liter-sized bottle.” What’s more, back in 2001 a water purification company called NVID International of Clearwater, FL tested colloidal silver in drinking water in the Mexican city of Celaya, and found that it was astonishingly effective in reducing coliform bacterial counts in the water. Far better than any city supply I know of. So is your point that CS is not effective against pathogens or that she is somehow polluting or?

MercTech -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/10/2015 5:14:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne Well thats not quite the way it works though. Despite words like 'social covenant' has that all-for-one one-for-all kum by ah coziness that statists over the last few millenium have been pounding into our heads that is not the governing authority. Actually, it does work that way. A municipality is "incorporated" as in existing as a legal entity and to dwell in the "incorporated area" you are legally bound to follow the rules of the "incorporated" municipality. If you don't like the rules of an incorporated area; you move to one better to your liking or go rural and live in an "unincorporated" area. It is a bit like "it is my bat, ball, and my yard. You have to follow my rules to be here" Not talking about a theoretical social covenant but about legal requirements that start with a charter of incorporation. And a charter for a municipality can be lax, strict, or as crazy as the residents want to vote in. But, once incorporated, the municipal government has the say to the extent the charter allows. A municipal government cannot supersede legal requirements of higher authority but it can certainly be stricter, alternative, or totally whacked.

Real0ne -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/12/2015 7:07:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MercTech quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne Well thats not quite the way it works though. Despite words like 'social covenant' has that all-for-one one-for-all kum by ah coziness that statists over the last few millenium have been pounding into our heads that is not the governing authority. Actually, it does work that way. A municipality is "incorporated" as in existing as a legal entity and to dwell in the "incorporated area" you are legally bound to follow the rules of the "incorporated" municipality. If you don't like the rules of an incorporated area; you move to one better to your liking or go rural and live in an "unincorporated" area. It is a bit like "it is my bat, ball, and my yard. You have to follow my rules to be here" Not talking about a theoretical social covenant but about legal requirements that start with a charter of incorporation. And a charter for a municipality can be lax, strict, or as crazy as the residents want to vote in. But, once incorporated, the municipal government has the say to the extent the charter allows. A municipal government cannot supersede legal requirements of higher authority but it can certainly be stricter, alternative, or totally whacked. So then you are claiming that the municipality extends beyond just a body politic 'incorporated' and somehow possesses a superior title and 'ownership' rights to ALL property within some arbitrary boundary? Where or how do/did they get this [presumed legitimate] 'police' authority, since the constitution does not authorize police powers?

GotSteel -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/12/2015 3:39:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne So is your point that CS is not effective against pathogens or that she is somehow polluting or?[/color] Or is the wrong conjunction, my point involves the use of and, not the use of or. She isn't using an effective water treatment AND she's flushing silver down a system not designed for it (your quack site is freaking out about the EPA shutting that down by the way: http://www.thesilveredge.com/stop_epa.shtml#.VaLrp_nZmnE) AND you're being scammed: quote: ORIGINAL: http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-779-colloidal%20silver.aspx?activeingredientid=779&activeingredientname=colloidal%20silver Colloidal silver is a mineral. Despite promoters’ claims, silver has no known function in the body and is not an essential mineral supplement. Colloidal silver products were once available as over-the-counter drug products, but in 1999, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) ruled that these colloidal silver products were not considered safe or effective. Colloidal silver products marketed for medical purposes or promoted for unproven uses are now considered “misbranded” under the law without appropriate FDA approval as a new drug. There are currently no FDA-approved over-the-counter or prescription drugs containing silver that are taken by mouth. However, there are still colloidal silver products being sold as homeopathic remedies and dietary supplements. There are many Internet ads for the parts of a generator that produces colloidal silver at home. People who produce colloidal silver at home will likely not be able to evaluate their product for purity or strength. There are many products that are far safer and more effective than colloidal silver.

MAINEiacMISTRESS -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/12/2015 4:06:16 PM)
This whole thing is nuts. Many people who live in NICE homes in arid areas have entire systems installed to collect rainwater, store it in barrels or underground cisterns, filter/sterilize it, and circulate it where needed in the home (wind or solar electricity). They also recycle "gray water" (from showers/washing machine) to flush toilets or even water crops. Why do they mandate hooking up to municipal water when she could dig a well and run some pipes? I have always lived in homes with wells. It beats drinking all the nasty chemicals they put in public drinking water.

GotSteel -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/12/2015 6:52:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MAINEiacMISTRESS This whole thing is nuts. Many people who live in NICE homes in arid areas have entire systems installed to collect rainwater, store it in barrels or underground cisterns, filter/sterilize it, and circulate it where needed in the home (wind or solar electricity). They also recycle "gray water" (from showers/washing machine) to flush toilets or even water crops. She could do that as well, I've quoted the city saying that several times now. The problem is that she doesn't have any potable water because she's a crackpot.

tj444 -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/12/2015 7:54:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MAINEiacMISTRESS This whole thing is nuts. Many people who live in NICE homes in arid areas have entire systems installed to collect rainwater, store it in barrels or underground cisterns, filter/sterilize it, and circulate it where needed in the home (wind or solar electricity). They also recycle "gray water" (from showers/washing machine) to flush toilets or even water crops. Why do they mandate hooking up to municipal water when she could dig a well and run some pipes? I have always lived in homes with wells. It beats drinking all the nasty chemicals they put in public drinking water. I wouldn't trust well water any more than I would trust rain water.. I grew up on a farm out in the middle of nowhere and our well water had some sorta bacteria in it.. but we didn't find that out until we all moved away and my mother tried to sell the farm. She had to put in a special water purification system in.. really, you don't know what is actually in the water unless you get it tested regularly.. I don't trust city water either.. omg.. when I lived in Anaheim, CA, OMFG.. they put so much frickin' chlorine in that water that when I took a shower the air smelled like I was in an enclosed swimming pool.. my skin was so dry & itchy from that crap..

MercTech -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/13/2015 2:51:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: MercTech quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne Well thats not quite the way it works though. Despite words like 'social covenant' has that all-for-one one-for-all kum by ah coziness that statists over the last few millenium have been pounding into our heads that is not the governing authority. Actually, it does work that way. A municipality is "incorporated" as in existing as a legal entity and to dwell in the "incorporated area" you are legally bound to follow the rules of the "incorporated" municipality. If you don't like the rules of an incorporated area; you move to one better to your liking or go rural and live in an "unincorporated" area. It is a bit like "it is my bat, ball, and my yard. You have to follow my rules to be here" Not talking about a theoretical social covenant but about legal requirements that start with a charter of incorporation. And a charter for a municipality can be lax, strict, or as crazy as the residents want to vote in. But, once incorporated, the municipal government has the say to the extent the charter allows. A municipal government cannot supersede legal requirements of higher authority but it can certainly be stricter, alternative, or totally whacked. So then you are claiming that the municipality extends beyond just a body politic 'incorporated' and somehow possesses a superior title and 'ownership' rights to ALL property within some arbitrary boundary? Where or how do/did they get this [presumed legitimate] 'police' authority, since the constitution does not authorize police powers? In short, Yes. In each and every one of these United States; there exists a legal method to incorporate a municipality and grant to municipal government certain powers in accordance to state law and some sort of legal document. I'm accustomed to seeing such a legal document called a "City Charter" but I've seen "Articles of Incorporation" uses also. Whether your state calls it a Town, Township, Village, or City; there are legal forms to be done empowering local government with certain powers. Have you never been privy to an "Annexation Battle" when a municipality wants to take over more acreage and the residents, or others, fight the annexation? And, yes, within incorporated boundaries; the local government can take over private property. There are legal forms to follow and the procedure is called "eminent domain". Often you see this used to take over part of your property to widen a street. No, the constitution does not address how a municipal government is run. That is one of those powers that is reserved to the individual states (as in .... those powers not specifically granted to the U.S. Government may be reserved to the sates). And the method does vary from state to state but exists in all states.

MercTech -> RE: Off-Grid Living Is Illegal! So hows that Constitution Working for ya? (7/13/2015 3:01:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MAINEiacMISTRESS This whole thing is nuts. Many people who live in NICE homes in arid areas have entire systems installed to collect rainwater, store it in barrels or underground cisterns, filter/sterilize it, and circulate it where needed in the home (wind or solar electricity). They also recycle "gray water" (from showers/washing machine) to flush toilets or even water crops. Why do they mandate hooking up to municipal water when she could dig a well and run some pipes? I have always lived in homes with wells. It beats drinking all the nasty chemicals they put in public drinking water. Different climate and soil. If you just sink a well in Cape Coral; you get brackish water that will kill everything but saw-grass in your yard and isn't fit to drink without a lot of processing. (I lived in that area for a few years back in the 90s) Heck, they even have to have salt water swimming pools there otherwise the salty ground water floats and cracks your freshwater swimming pool. And the requirement to hook up to municipal water is part traditional health department requirements for and incorporated municipal government and part greed because they have other taxes tacked on to the monthly water bill. Different states, different laws. Different states, different soil conditions.

Page: << < prev 4 5 6 7 [8]

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.046875