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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 12:59:57 PM   
crazyml


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Let me know when China and India start to reduce their emissions. This whole thing is a farce. The Republicans in charge will give no money as they should not.


Erm.... their emissions per capita are pretty low... are you little bit fucking confused?

China's emissions per capita are less than half of the USA.

India's less than a quarter.

Fuck me... you must feel pretty stupid now!



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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 2:42:01 PM   
PeonForHer


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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:07:01 PM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Language, Crazy.

I remain unconvinced that vulgarities and profanities diminish the value of truth.

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:07:11 PM   
tj444


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Let me know when China and India start to reduce their emissions. This whole thing is a farce. The Republicans in charge will give no money as they should not.

if y'all want China and India to reduce their emissions then stop buying stuff from them.. Y'all wanna point fingers at these countries but y'all want yer iphones and icrap and all the other crap gobbled up by brain-dead consumers hell bent on having more stuff than the Joneses... talk about being hypocrites..

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:10:37 PM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

I asked if you had read all the details on the accord...could you point me to the copy you have read that from???

From your own link Lucy: "So the individual countries’ plans are voluntary, but the legal requirements that they publicly monitor, verify and report what they are doing, as well as publicly put forth updated plans, are designed to create a “name-and-shame” system of global peer pressure, in hopes that countries will not want to be seen as international laggards."
ETA (opinion): We all know that the US won't approve any real decent measures and kick the can down the road... again.
China don't give a flying fuck about what anyone thinks of them.
But does it goad them into any sort of positive action?? Fuck no!!
So this proposed 'name and shame' shit ain't gonna do shit for anyone.

Each country to create its own plans - but they are VOLUNTARY.
The only "legal" requirement is to monitor and report. Nothing else.
From the same link Lucy gave: "while every country is required to put forward a plan, there is no legal requirement dictating how, or how much, countries should cut emissions."
As much as many people thought it had teeth, it's a paper tiger.
No sanctions for any country.
India and China are exempt from taking actions from lowering greenhouse gasses.

India, I can understand; but China is THE worlds biggest CO2 polluter by far.
This is closely followed by the US.
On a per-capita basis, the US is more than double that of China and only beaten by the UAE.

If you include the other greenhouse gasses (eg; methane, nitrous oxide etc), China again tops the charts, closely followed by the US.

So how did those Chinese manage to wriggle out of everything and be exempt, along with India??

So... of the worst three offenders in the world (China, the US, and UAE): one is exempt, one won't get anything thru congress, and the last doesn't have to pay up to help developing countries.
And there are no penalties for anyone if they fail the targets or just blatantly refuse to do anything.

All I can see they have done is to agree to agree - nothing positive, no sanctions, nothing but useless waffle.


< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 12/13/2015 3:16:58 PM >

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:15:02 PM   
thompsonx


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Status: offline 		So how did those Chinese manage to wriggle out of everything and be exempt,

I posted this but perhaps you do not care to know what you are about before you open your mouth.

http://www.forbes.com/sites#/sites/jackperkowski/2014/06/17/china-leads-in-renewable-investment-again/


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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:15:06 PM   
tj444


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Status: offline 		I dunno.. they came to this "landmark accord" awfully fast, how can it possibly have any teeth or mean much??? Hope I am proven wrong but... I guess we will see who the doers are and who is just farting in the wind..

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:18:51 PM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

So how did those Chinese manage to wriggle out of everything and be exempt,

I posted this but perhaps you do not care to know what you are about before you open your mouth.

http://www.forbes.com/sites#/sites/jackperkowski/2014/06/17/china-leads-in-renewable-investment-again/



I know exactly what I said and meant every word of it.
They are still the worlds #1 polluter - whether they are leaders in renewables or not.


< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 12/13/2015 3:20:39 PM >

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:26:06 PM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

So how did those Chinese manage to wriggle out of everything and be exempt,

I posted this but perhaps you do not care to know what you are about before you open your mouth.

http://www.forbes.com/sites#/sites/jackperkowski/2014/06/17/china-leads-in-renewable-investment-again/



I know exactly what I said and meant every word of it.
They are still the worlds #1 polluter - whether they are leaders in renewables or not.

No this is what you said:

China is THE worlds biggest CO2 polluter by far.
This is closely followed by the US.
On a per-capita basis, the US is more than double that of China

Since china is not exactly a small country with just a few people how long do you think it might take to turn things around if they were not the number one in renewables? Do you think that has anything to do with it or is this just white guys are kewel and yellow ones are shitheads?

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:39:45 PM   
freedomdwarf1


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Status: offline 		In sheer volume, China is still #1 world polluter.
It tops every numerical chart.

UNTIL they turn it around, the fact that they are the leaders in renewables is pretty moot.
You can be leader all you like.
But until that is put into practice and make a difference so you are no longer #1, it's empty rhetoric

As of right now, they are #1 for the amount of CO2 or greenhouse gas emissions.

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:43:12 PM   
thompsonx


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Status: offline 		Kewel...your opinion is what matters to you so please do try to have a nice day.

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:46:52 PM   
freedomdwarf1


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Status: offline 		I'll have wonderfully stupendous day knowing I quoted facts, not spin and opinion.

Care to find a different spin somewhere that disputes my figures??
Or are you going to continue drinking the Koolaid??

< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 12/13/2015 3:47:20 PM >

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:46:59 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Language, Crazy.

I remain unconvinced that vulgarities and profanities diminish the value of truth.



That's because you're common, Thompson.



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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 3:53:27 PM   
littleclip


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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 4:58:24 PM   
thompsonx


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Status: offline 		ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

Care to find a different spin somewhere that disputes my figures??

It is not the figures that are in dispute.
I pointed out that china has decided to do something about the issue and you wish to point out that there is an issue....something that was not in dispute.

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 4:59:36 PM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: PeonForHer


ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

Language, Crazy.

I remain unconvinced that vulgarities and profanities diminish the value of truth.


That's because you're common, Thompson.


We are all common...no one is special.

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 7:04:42 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
It's been on the news constantly for days and days.
All the reports from those commentating at the site are saying anything tough has been watered down a great deal to make it palatable.
Anything of any real consequence has been buried and is virtually insignificant.
To be honest, I really don't see anything much coming from this except rhetoric from every quarter.
Another Kyoto but with more countries.
A very expensive waste of time IMHO.


I just have to wonder how much carbon was released into the atmosphere because of this meeting. The irony of all the green conferences is how "un-green" they are because of all the travel-related carbon.

It has to turn into more of a videoconference type thing. Significantly less carbon output due to the significantly reduced transportation.



I'll believe it's a crisis when the people who are telling me it's a crisis start acting like it is a crisis.


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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/13/2015 8:35:41 PM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

Care to find a different spin somewhere that disputes my figures??

It is not the figures that are in dispute.
I pointed out that china has decided to do something about the issue and you wish to point out that there is an issue....something that was not in dispute.

That still doesn't answer the question as to HOW China, the world's #1 polluter, has managed to get itself exempt from whole idea of reducing greenhouse gasses in this 'historic' agreement on climate change.

If we take the equally compelling (and arguably, the better 'normalized' figure) of pollution on a per-capita basis, how comes the US or the UAE didn't also get themselves into this somewhat exclusive exemption club??
According to THIS wordpress report, the top 3 countries for green renewables are Denmark, Israel, and Sweden; followed by Finland, USA, Germany, Canada, South Korea, Ireland, with the UK coming in 10th place.
China didn't figure in the top 10.
Wiki reports that the US is 2nd highest producer of electricity from renewable sources behind China.

It seems to me that China has pulled some strings behind the scenes to get themselves excluded from the main thrust of the climate change tenet while others who are also deserving are faced with producing plans to reduce greenhouse emissions.
195 countries agreed to this 'green' drive for climate change, including some of the poorest island nations whose very existence could depend upon it; yet China is exempt???

Something stinks, and it ain't the local 'Tchai Kneze Phuk Yu' takeaway shop.


< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 12/13/2015 8:38:01 PM >

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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/14/2015 1:17:37 AM   
Lucylastic


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http://grist.org/climate-energy/no-the-new-climate-deal-does-not-let-china-off-the-hook/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/china-us-agree-to-limit-greenhouse-gases/2014/11/11/9c768504-69e6-11e4-9fb4-a622dae742a2_story.html?wpisrc=al_national


I dont disagree about china actually doing their shit sooner, is a good thing, IF it happens, BUT....
THey have agreed to do something. IF they adopt it and move forward, republicans in the US will STILL refuse to adopt it.
India? THey are reacting faster than anyone expected.

It doesnt go far enough in my taste, I have severe doubts, I dont trust anyone. BUT it is something that needs to be done and soon. the topic ISNT going away like it did after kyoto, people wont let it, it IS a topic that is growing. Its 40 years past due. its a move forward.
hopefully.


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RE: Nations Approve Landmark Climate Accord in Paris - 12/14/2015 2:09:19 AM   
Greta75


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Status: offline 		China has been suffering national emergency of toxic level, orange air, this December. They had to shut down power plants, and ask cars not to plough the roads, to clear their air again.

Their own people is suffering bad!

I hope they will fix their emissions, after all, they are killing their own people.

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