RE: Second hand smoke

RE: Second hand smoke (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid

Message

MistressLorelei -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/9/2006 3:32:32 PM)
And now back to square one. Perhaps the smokers can teach their smoke to stay within the confines of their tables, and not filter through the vents or head over to the tables of others. Then, we'd all be fine.

ScooterTrash -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/9/2006 4:21:10 PM)
Just as an FYI; July 31, 2006 Christina Pearson, an HHS spokeswoman, said HHS Secretary Mike Leavitt appreciated Carmona's service. "He has helped provide good leadership and counsel to the department on prevention issues," Pearson said. "I would point to the recent smoking report he did, which got unprecedented attention. He also raised the profile of childhood obesity." Carmona's term expired over the weekend with no announcement from the Health and Human Services Department. No specific comment...just relaying information. edited to note; This WAS the Surgeon General who keeps getting mentioned.

EnglishDomNW -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/9/2006 6:27:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei And now back to square one. Perhaps the smokers can teach their smoke to stay within the confines of their tables, and not filter through the vents or head over to the tables of others. Then, we'd all be fine. Surely most restaurants and cafes in America have already banned smoking. I can't believe that a member of the anti-smoking group can really be having this much trouble finding somewhere that's smoke free. I still think this is less to do with smoking and more to do with enjoying the art of complaining.

MistressLorelei -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/9/2006 7:47:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EnglishDomNW quote: ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei And now back to square one. Perhaps the smokers can teach their smoke to stay within the confines of their tables, and not filter through the vents or head over to the tables of others. Then, we'd all be fine. Surely most restaurants and cafes in America have already banned smoking. I can't believe that a member of the anti-smoking group can really be having this much trouble finding somewhere that's smoke free. I still think this is less to do with smoking and more to do with enjoying the art of complaining. The comments I addressed early on in the thread were in regards to those who are upset about the ban or the possible ban (where not already banned), and then to those who insist that second hand smoke has not been proven to be of no harm to others. I have no trouble finding non-smoking places... it's banned publicly where I live. The "complaints" were to those who want the ban lifted in places such as where I live, and are no less valid than the "complaints" smokers have continued to make. Just as you feel the need to stand up for your right to smoke... I defend my right to to breathe carcinogen-free air in public places. I'm all for scrapping the ban when smokers decide to respect the common places shared by the general population, most who do trust the experts who deem second hand smoke harmful... but that's highly unlikely to ever happen. If the smokers displayed such consideration for the well-being of others, I bet you'd hear very little from the 'anti-smoking group'. If you are fine with no smoking indoors publicly... then we have no issue.

Termyn8or -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/9/2006 11:23:07 PM)
OK, go to places that are carcinogen free. I have no problem with that. When I am sitting at the bar, it will be in an establishment that allows smoking. Won't see you there. Your money will go elsewhere. The ratio of smoking to non-smoking establishments will undoubtedly follow market forces. Let it be. Establish a policy where non-smoking establishments proudly display a placard at each entrance that says "This business is a non-smoking evironment. If you smoke here you are guilty of criminal trespass and subject to a fine between $100-$1,000 and could serve jail time". I would support that. I would not have a problem, even having to leave the parking lot to smoke. I would comply. On the other hand, another business that has not decided to comply with the "Clean Air Guarantee" should post that as well. Go into one of the stank, smoke filled honkytonks I used to go to and you might get yourself a dose. Feel totally free to walk out and not spend your money there. We have no duty to make every publicly used place safe for everyobdy, much less comfortable. You haven't said a word about deisels, etc. But then OK they are needed. Cigarettes aren't needed, agreed. What about the air fresheners, inscense and all the wierd chemicals people put on their body ? What about that perfume or aftershave ? What about all that ? This is also going into your lungs. Therefore a "Clean Air Guarantee" certified place must not let those wearing excessive perfume or cologne in either, to me that is worse. If you say "Clean Air Guarantee", mean it. If people drop dead when they walk outside you're outta luck. T

EnglishDomNW -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/9/2006 11:27:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei quote: ORIGINAL: EnglishDomNW quote: ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei And now back to square one. Perhaps the smokers can teach their smoke to stay within the confines of their tables, and not filter through the vents or head over to the tables of others. Then, we'd all be fine. Surely most restaurants and cafes in America have already banned smoking. I can't believe that a member of the anti-smoking group can really be having this much trouble finding somewhere that's smoke free. I still think this is less to do with smoking and more to do with enjoying the art of complaining. The comments I addressed early on in the thread were in regards to those who are upset about the ban or the possible ban (where not already banned), and then to those who insist that second hand smoke has not been proven to be of no harm to others. I have no trouble finding non-smoking places... it's banned publicly where I live. The "complaints" were to those who want the ban lifted in places such as where I live, and are no less valid than the "complaints" smokers have continued to make. Just as you feel the need to stand up for your right to smoke... I defend my right to to breathe carcinogen-free air in public places. I'm all for scrapping the ban when smokers decide to respect the common places shared by the general population, most who do trust the experts who deem second hand smoke harmful... but that's highly unlikely to ever happen. If the smokers displayed such consideration for the well-being of others, I bet you'd hear very little from the 'anti-smoking group'. If you are fine with no smoking indoors publicly... then we have no issue. I absolutely agree that you shouldn't have to deal with anyone's smoke ever, indoors in a public place. But I'm all in favour of having smoking establishments which non-smokers can simply avoid, as Termyn8tor said. That seems to me to be the ideal answer. My only issue is when anti-smokers talk about a total ban in public places, it just proves that their interest isn't in health, or avoiding second-hand smoking - they just want to ban something because they personally find it distasteful.

MistressOfGa -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 12:04:53 AM)
quote: Surely most restaurants and cafes in America have already banned smoking. There is no smoking in public buildings in Georgia. I have recently moved to South Carolina. Pup and I went into an italian restaurant and the waitress asked us "Smoking or non?" I was surprised, because I had forgotten I was in S.C. lol I live just on the state line, so it is understandable <s> I asked the waitress, wasn't smoking in the restaurant against the law? She said, no not in this state. I must of looked confused because pup reminded me we were not in Georgia lol I really don't have anything to add to this thread other than I smoked for 33 years and I quit 3 years ago. Second hand smoke only bothers me when someone blows it directly in my face. I had a medical emergency a few months ago and they could not get my breathing under control. I have COPD so a visit to the emergency room was in order. The ambulance pulled up at the ER and they pushed the gurney I was on through a cloud of smoke. The ER nurses were standing right where the ambulance parks, smoking up a storm. As I felt my lungs filling with the smoke, I gasped out "You have got to be fucking kidding me!" I was very pissed off that I had NO choice but to go where the gurney went, and where the gurney went was right through the smoking area of the ER staff. My oxygen level had stabalized prior to being wheeled through the smoking area, it took the ER staff another 40 minutes to get my levels back up. Oh and before you ask, yes, I got the COPD from smoking all those years. Nothing like shutting the gate after the horses are out.

MistressLorelei -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 12:37:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EnglishDomNW I absolutely agree that you shouldn't have to deal with anyone's smoke ever, indoors in a public place. But I'm all in favour of having smoking establishments which non-smokers can simply avoid, as Termyn8tor said. That seems to me to be the ideal answer. My only issue is when anti-smokers talk about a total ban in public places, it just proves that their interest isn't in health, or avoiding second-hand smoking - they just want to ban something because they personally find it distasteful. Florida has some cigar bars, pool halls, pubs, where smoking is allowed. I think the laws in Fla tied indoor smoking into how much food could be sold in order to allow smoke. Most venues chose to ban smoking and make a buck on high quantity food sales. It would be ideal to have smoking and non-smoking places.... restaurants would work this way, but multiple courthouses, libraries, etc. wouldn't be a reasonable option, and then there is still the issue of employees. No, I can't stand smoke.... but that's not what motivates me on this issue. I can't stand red meat either, but I don't wish to ban it in public places because I don't like to look at it, or even smell it, as I am not harmed by its presence. Being that you stated the words I bolded, perhaps we never actually disagreed.

EnglishDomNW -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 7:04:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei quote: ORIGINAL: EnglishDomNW I absolutely agree that you shouldn't have to deal with anyone's smoke ever, indoors in a public place. But I'm all in favour of having smoking establishments which non-smokers can simply avoid, as Termyn8tor said. That seems to me to be the ideal answer. My only issue is when anti-smokers talk about a total ban in public places, it just proves that their interest isn't in health, or avoiding second-hand smoking - they just want to ban something because they personally find it distasteful. Florida has some cigar bars, pool halls, pubs, where smoking is allowed. I think the laws in Fla tied indoor smoking into how much food could be sold in order to allow smoke. Most venues chose to ban smoking and make a buck on high quantity food sales. It would be ideal to have smoking and non-smoking places.... restaurants would work this way, but multiple courthouses, libraries, etc. wouldn't be a reasonable option, and then there is still the issue of employees. No, I can't stand smoke.... but that's not what motivates me on this issue. I can't stand red meat either, but I don't wish to ban it in public places because I don't like to look at it, or even smell it, as I am not harmed by its presence. Being that you stated the words I bolded, perhaps we never actually disagreed. Yes but if you re-ead the words you emboldened, it says you "shouldn't *have to deal with anyone's smoke in a public place", not "smoking in public should be banned outright". What that means is you should have the choice* and wisdom to avoid places where tobacco smoking is allowed, rather than putting yourself in a smoking-allowed establishment and then complaining about it. Don't go to establishments that allow smoking. Everybody's problem is solved (except the hard-core of anti-smoking who want it banned altogether, not because of health but because they personally don't enjoy it and don't want to see anyone else enjoying it either.)

MistressLorelei -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 8:03:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EnglishDomNW Yes but if you re-ead the words you emboldened, it says you "shouldn't *have to deal with anyone's smoke in a public place", not "smoking in public should be banned outright". What that means is you should have the choice* and wisdom to avoid places where tobacco smoking is allowed, rather than putting yourself in a smoking-allowed establishment and then complaining about it. Don't go to establishments that allow smoking. Everybody's problem is solved (except the hard-core of anti-smoking who want it banned altogether, not because of health but because they personally don't enjoy it and don't want to see anyone else enjoying it either.) And in the states with the ban, smokers can choose to go to the places they can't smoke in... or to stay out. They have had the choice to go or not go since the day the ban began.... yet I still hear protesting from smokers. Your point works both ways. Smokers want it not banned altogether... because they personally enjoy smoking, and they don't want to see anyone else being able to enjoy smoke-free air. I am going to quit adding to it, and maybe this non-productive thread will eventually die.

mistoferin -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 1:48:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei quote: ORIGINAL: EnglishDomNW Yes but if you re-ead the words you emboldened, it says you "shouldn't *have to deal with anyone's smoke in a public place", not "smoking in public should be banned outright". What that means is you should have the choice* and wisdom to avoid places where tobacco smoking is allowed, rather than putting yourself in a smoking-allowed establishment and then complaining about it. Don't go to establishments that allow smoking. Everybody's problem is solved (except the hard-core of anti-smoking who want it banned altogether, not because of health but because they personally don't enjoy it and don't want to see anyone else enjoying it either.) And in the states with the ban, smokers can choose to go to the places they can't smoke in... or to stay out. They have had the choice to go or not go since the day the ban began.... yet I still hear protesting from smokers. Your point works both ways. Smokers want it not banned altogether... because they personally enjoy smoking, and they don't want to see anyone else being able to enjoy smoke-free air. I am going to quit adding to it, and maybe this non-productive thread will eventually die. Does what you say actually make any sense to you...because it surely doesn't to me. If it's banned everywhere....then where exactly do you see a choice? A "choice" would indicate that you can choose between one thing or another. If there were smoking establishments and non-smoking establishments...we both (smokers and non smokers) would have a choice as to which establishments we chose to frequent. See how that works??? If all establishments are non smoking....where is the choice? The part of your quoted that I bolded....yes, smokers don't want it banned altogether because they DO enjoy smoking. Because they want to have that choice. As for the part of your quote "they don't want to see anyone else being able to enjoy smoke-free air"....that is utter bullshit. There is not one person on this thread who has stated any such thing....although that is the sentiment you seem to draw no matter what anyone says. I don't know why it is that you or anyone else seems to have such a problem with others choices so long as they don't affect you. Grow up....the world doesn't revolve around you.

Termyn8or -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 10:42:02 PM)
Me too. I just lit a cigarette, it's sweet flavor and aroma, oh wait, that's a joint. Ever notice how alot of non-smokers smoke pot ? Or burn insence, or have one of those awful air fresheners in their car ? We should make caigarettes a prerequisite to these things. Non-productive ? I agree. Nothing put into this thread will convince certain people, their bad science trumps all. They might get their way, but what comes around goes around. It's just like the F______ game governments play, they don't see the end of the game. They are bringing about the end of the game when money will be worthless, but haven't relized that it is they who have the most to lose when it happens. Suppose we beam into a paralell universe or some shit. Smoking and non-smoking public places are strictly segregated. All but the top ten percent of all the idiots have been satisfied. They really do live in a smoke free environment. Want to know what happens next ? Everyone who gets lung cancer will be a non-smoker. I knew a non-smoker who died of lung cancer. Victim of second hand smoke ? Absolutely, apparently smoke is intelligent and stealths itself by causing kidney cancer first. Also for some reason this second hand smoke also manages to completely avoid the smokers and head straight for the non-smokers. Can't someone just be totally fucking honest and just say "I hate the smell of it" and just let smokers be polite and not smoke in their presence ? I will be happy to be polite, but you give an inch and they take a mile, and waaaaaay too many miles have been taken. End of story. If you can't accept that, this means war. T

FelinePersuasion -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/10/2006 11:31:46 PM)
I hope wheny ou were back to normal again you bitched them out quite throughly, and I hope the ER will rethink their smokeing area At my adult ed school there's a no smoking sign right by the door. well people will still sit right there and smoke in the door. quote: ORIGINAL: MistressOfGa quote: Surely most restaurants and cafes in America have already banned smoking. There is no smoking in public buildings in Georgia. I have recently moved to South Carolina. Pup and I went into an italian restaurant and the waitress asked us "Smoking or non?" I was surprised, because I had forgotten I was in S.C. lol I live just on the state line, so it is understandable <s> I asked the waitress, wasn't smoking in the restaurant against the law? She said, no not in this state. I must of looked confused because pup reminded me we were not in Georgia lol I really don't have anything to add to this thread other than I smoked for 33 years and I quit 3 years ago. Second hand smoke only bothers me when someone blows it directly in my face. I had a medical emergency a few months ago and they could not get my breathing under control. I have COPD so a visit to the emergency room was in order. The ambulance pulled up at the ER and they pushed the gurney I was on through a cloud of smoke. The ER nurses were standing right where the ambulance parks, smoking up a storm. As I felt my lungs filling with the smoke, I gasped out "You have got to be fucking kidding me!" I was very pissed off that I had NO choice but to go where the gurney went, and where the gurney went was right through the smoking area of the ER staff. My oxygen level had stabalized prior to being wheeled through the smoking area, it took the ER staff another 40 minutes to get my levels back up. Oh and before you ask, yes, I got the COPD from smoking all those years. Nothing like shutting the gate after the horses are out.

twicehappy -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/11/2006 4:00:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin If all establishments are non smoking....where is the choice? The part of your quoted that I bolded....yes, smokers don't want it banned altogether because they DO enjoy smoking. Because they want to have that choice. As for the part of your quote "they don't want to see anyone else being able to enjoy smoke-free air"....that is utter bullshit. There is not one person on this thread who has stated any such thing....although that is the sentiment you seem to draw no matter what anyone says. I don't know why it is that you or anyone else seems to have such a problem with others choices so long as they don't affect you. Grow up....the world doesn't revolve around you. Best post on this thread yet!

EnglishDomNW -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/11/2006 5:02:01 AM)
I had a cigarette last night outside in my garden. It was almost midnight. There was no wind at all. I blew a smoke ring and it rose up and made a halo around my head. I swear I heard Saint Peter say "Bless you my child, you enjoy your cigarette". "Cheers Pete, I always liked you", says I. "No problem, mate" says the heavenly geezer, "talk to you later". Disclaimer: While some of this story is true, other parts may have been enhanced for dramatic effect

juliaoceania -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/11/2006 7:49:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or Ever notice how alot of non-smokers smoke pot ? Or burn insence, or have one of those awful air fresheners in their car ? We should make caigarettes a prerequisite to these things. T I do not use air freshener or insense.. they make my head hurt too. In fact many people are allergic to these things. Air fresheners are chemicals for crying out loud, who needs more toxins in their environment.. remember, I am a granola eating hippie. I had a friend I lost about 18 months ago to cancer (shortly before I quit smoking I found out he had liver cancer). The research I did with him showed that smokers were much more likely to get all sorts of cancers because nicotine is a carcinogen that permeates your body.. it must be dispelled from the body via kidneys and liver (these organs collect toxins of all sorts including the ones found in cigarettes). He was a smoker, he thought it was the cigarettes before he died. His illness was part of the reason I quit (among many others)I loved Andy, he did much for voting rights in my state and was a political comrade of mine. I still miss him. He was only 43

MistressOfGa -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/11/2006 8:31:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FelinePersuasion I hope wheny ou were back to normal again you bitched them out quite throughly, and I hope the ER will rethink their smokeing area At my adult ed school there's a no smoking sign right by the door. well people will still sit right there and smoke in the door. quote: ORIGINAL: MistressOfGa quote: Surely most restaurants and cafes in America have already banned smoking. There is no smoking in public buildings in Georgia. I have recently moved to South Carolina. Pup and I went into an italian restaurant and the waitress asked us "Smoking or non?" I was surprised, because I had forgotten I was in S.C. lol I live just on the state line, so it is understandable <s> I asked the waitress, wasn't smoking in the restaurant against the law? She said, no not in this state. I must of looked confused because pup reminded me we were not in Georgia lol I really don't have anything to add to this thread other than I smoked for 33 years and I quit 3 years ago. Second hand smoke only bothers me when someone blows it directly in my face. I had a medical emergency a few months ago and they could not get my breathing under control. I have COPD so a visit to the emergency room was in order. The ambulance pulled up at the ER and they pushed the gurney I was on through a cloud of smoke. The ER nurses were standing right where the ambulance parks, smoking up a storm. As I felt my lungs filling with the smoke, I gasped out "You have got to be fucking kidding me!" I was very pissed off that I had NO choice but to go where the gurney went, and where the gurney went was right through the smoking area of the ER staff. My oxygen level had stabalized prior to being wheeled through the smoking area, it took the ER staff another 40 minutes to get my levels back up. Oh and before you ask, yes, I got the COPD from smoking all those years. Nothing like shutting the gate after the horses are out. Actually, crazy thing is, when I went to ex-ray, I left my eye glasses on the table beside the bed, when I returned they were gone. We searched everywhere for them and they were just simply gone. While I had them on the phone complaining about the loss of my glasses, I also mentioned the complete lack of concern for my well being as the ER staff chose to smoke right at the ambulance entrance. They paid for my new glasses, without a second thought.

Termyn8or -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/13/2006 7:24:01 AM)
Moga; It is common fucking sense that you don't smoke in hospitals or grocery stores. Those people were not too smart. Smoking or non, use the yellow pages. When a business is "Clean Air" compliant, there is more. Smoke from the kitchen must be exhausted, way up high, if the parking lot is to be non-smoking. Thirty feet would do. The restaurant furniture would be tested for outgassing, and nobody is allowed in if you can smell anything on them, including perfume. Violate, go to jail. I would actually agree to these terms, to be polite to non-smokers. But it does not seem to be enough. Nothing is ever enough for certain people. What I need to remind myself of is that this is a public place, and sociopaths and meglomaniacs are just as likely to be here as anyone else. The nice thing is that these nuts hear our words, something that would never have happened without these fora. When people start talking about me smoking in my car on the freway, that is too much. T

EnglishDomNW -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/13/2006 8:12:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or When people start talking about me smoking in my car on the freway, that is too much. T I think there is a genuine and legitimate case for non-smokers to say "Don't do it around me please" which smokers need to respect. But when they start saying "Don't do it anywhere except your own home, regardless of whether it's affecting anyone else or not", you wonder if it's really about health or just a section of people inflicting their beliefs on others simply because they personally don't want to smoke tobacco.

meatcleaver -> RE: Second hand smoke (8/13/2006 8:22:21 AM)
On the scale of things, smoking isn't that big a health issue for people who don't smoke and for the majority that smoke and with the absence of other threads ranting about more pressing health issues it is quite obvious, this thread was never about health issues in the first place. It is about social fascists and rabid puritans wanting power over other people. They are people who can't enjoy themselves and hate to see other people enjoying themselves. They really need to get a life and stop complaining about other people who enjoy certain habits as we journey between nothing and nothing.

Page: << < prev 19 20 [21] 22 23 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.15625