quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: Phydeaux

Should the matter go to trial, the government will lose, presuming a reasonably evenhanded jury.

This would seem to suggest that the jurist in the tobacco trials were not evenhanded.

There is certainly a reasonable doubt that AGW is occuring.

Only among morons.



It is also certain that what the IPCC describes as AGW is not occuring. Both would be profitable avenues in a courtroom.

Second, even if there is global warming, the government would have to prove that carbon emissions cause it. No one has done this to date, and there are several compelling alternate explanations.

Third, even if the government were to prove both one and two; it then has to prove deliberate intent. The government would have to prove that the corporation knew that the political situation would develop in such a way that its continued emission of CO2 would cause a material threat to its business - something that hasn't happened in the last 30 years. Saying therefore that Exon committed fraud when actual events matched its internal predictions - would mean no fraud occurred.


Only to another moron

This is political theater, meant to intimidate opponents of global warming, nothing more. I doubt the AG's could even find a person with standing to sue. What shareholder suffered monetary damage from the alleged failure to disclose the alleged fraud. Uh, no one.


Just as the government had trouble finding persons with standing for the tobacco trials.
Jesus you are phoquing stupid.

quote:

We quite agree on multinational companies, people and organiztions lying about AGW.

Of course, from my point of view its pretty much the AGW side doing the lying.

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

Since someone brought up the anti-holocost crowd, how about flat earthers. They have their own society that believe that the earth is flat. The society collects money which to the rest of us might be considered fraud using misleading (lying) and don't follow proven science (at least I believe that the earth is round based upon the scientific evidence). Since the society is committing fraud (theoretically at least) the AG's could prosecute and jail them for their beliefs. Some political parties (the NAZI party comes to my mind first) have non-main stream beliefs such as minorities are substandard to white people. Using the AG's logic, they could prosecute them for lying. The list of organizations could go on and on. Prosecution of those with opposing views would be silenced for their beliefs. Doesn't really matter if it is global warming, that might just be used as a precidence and then moving on to other areas. until the only ones left are those that agree with whatever just one person thinks. or else

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

Since someone brought up the anti-holocost crowd, how about flat earthers. They have their own society that believe that the earth is flat. The society collects money which to the rest of us might be considered fraud using misleading (lying) and don't follow proven science (at least I believe that the earth is round based upon the scientific evidence). Since the society is committing fraud (theoretically at least) the AG's could prosecute and jail them for their beliefs. Some political parties (the NAZI party comes to my mind first) have non-main stream beliefs such as minorities are substandard to white people. Using the AG's logic, they could prosecute them for lying. The list of organizations could go on and on. Prosecution of those with opposing views would be silenced for their beliefs. Doesn't really matter if it is global warming, that might just be used as a precidence and then moving on to other areas. until the only ones left are those that agree with whatever just one person thinks. or else

The flat earth society, isnt a multi billion corporation trying to hide information from their shareholders, let alone the population buying their bullshit.
try reading the panama papers and get your mind blown by the depth of how shafted the world is and has been for oil.
Exxon and BP are companies not societies that are lying and maybe even defrauding people, not just shitty ideas....
please get a freakin grip.

Edited to add...the "finished" pipeline that was sposed to be part of XL keystone pipeline sprung a leak today, but it was sposed to be safe,
BP just settled on 20 billion for deepwater horizon.... no more claims, but I think it should have been far higher and lots of people should have gone to jail..
flint michigan tainted water was sat on by the governor, should he be allowed to get away with it?

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

Since someone brought up the anti-holocost crowd, how about flat earthers. They have their own society that believe that the earth is flat. The society collects money which to the rest of us might be considered fraud using misleading (lying) and don't follow proven science (at least I believe that the earth is round based upon the scientific evidence). Since the society is committing fraud (theoretically at least) the AG's could prosecute and jail them for their beliefs. Some political parties (the NAZI party comes to my mind first) have non-main stream beliefs such as minorities are substandard to white people. Using the AG's logic, they could prosecute them for lying. The list of organizations could go on and on. Prosecution of those with opposing views would be silenced for their beliefs. Doesn't really matter if it is global warming, that might just be used as a precidence and then moving on to other areas. until the only ones left are those that agree with whatever just one person thinks. or else

The flat earth society, isnt a multi billion corporation trying to hide information from their shareholders, let alone the population buying their bullshit.
try reading the panama papers and get your mind blown by the depth of how shafted the world is and has been for oil.
Exxon and BP are companies not societies that are lying and maybe even defrauding people, not just shitty ideas....
please get a freakin grip.

Edited to add...the "finished" pipeline that was sposed to be part of XL keystone pipeline sprung a leak today, but it was sposed to be safe,
BP just settled on 20 billion for deepwater horizon.... no more claims, but I think it should have been far higher and lots of people should have gone to jail..
flint michigan tainted water was sat on by the governor, should he be allowed to get away with it?

Seriously Lucy, It sounds to me that you believe that fraud can only occur by huge corporations and the ultra rich. I am looking at the presidence being set, not the size of someone's bank account.

quote:

Lucy

oh FFS ken no I dont, but the situations are miles apart, not even relevant. you just want to seem to deny you could be wrong or misinformed..
you are like that with all of your "conspiracies" that aren't

quote:

ORIGINAL: KenDckey

quote:

http://dailysignal.com/2016/04/04/16-democrat-ags-begin-inquisition-against-climate-change-disbelievers/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=thf-fb

Speaking at a press conference on March 29, New York Attorney General Eric Schneiderman said “The bottom line is simple: Climate change is real.” He went on to say that if companies are committing fraud by “lying” about the dangers of climate change, they will “pursue them to the fullest extent of the law.”

The coalition of 17 inquisitors are calling themselves “AGs United for Clean Power.” The coalition consists of 15 state attorneys general (California, Connecticut, Illinois, Iowa, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Rhode Island, Virginia, Vermont, and Washington State), as well as the attorneys general of the District of Columbia and the Virgin Islands. Sixteen of the seventeen members are Democrats, while the attorney general for the Virgin Islands, Claude Walker, is an independent.

Believe as we say or else? come on. No law requires you to believe whatever. It is actions that violate laws and if there is one out there that says you have to publically proclaim something as truth it probably violates the 1st amendment.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr


I referenced this in another post, recently. A.G. Lynch was in front of a congressional panel saying she was looking for ways to prosecute (mark the word) climate change "deniers".

First off: That's an interesting word, originally used to belittle people that questioned the holocaust of WWII.

Secondly, my understanding was that the actual target was companies that advertise as if climate change doesn't exist. In the article I saw, a parallel was drawn between oil companies and tobacco companies. I don't think any oil company has taken a stand on whether climate change is a fact or not (I suppose I might have missed something, though).

Not that the first two are negligible, but what really scares me is if something like this could be used to go after research scientists that don't come up with the proper results as far as the tree-huggers are concerned. Shouldn't a scientist be able to publish their findings, no matter what they are? Well, I see this avenue as a way for the government to persecute legitimate scientists, much like the Vatican persecuted Galileo.



Michael

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

We quite agree on multinational companies, people and organiztions lying about AGW.

Of course, from my point of view its pretty much the AGW side doing the lying.

On the latter point I'd have to admit that you and I somewhat disagree, Phydeaux - to roughly the same degree as if you'd said 'Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot were actually quite agreeable and woefully misunderstood chaps'.