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RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 4:06:49 PM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

But, it does bring up your colonialism in fact, why the fuck (this is american) should the Scots be paired with you cunts? the UK at its inception was not united unless by dint of force. Scots have never been nobody and never will be, and there aint a man jack of you would have cried in your fucking pie mate, had their referendum passed. Now you have paired them with you. I wouldnt be surprised to see the IRA fragging your ugly ass again.

You might be middle of the road mate, but you aint wif it.

As i have said in the world you are a nobody, your time has came and went, you rolled out as much dole as you can and bucked up against our economy for support, they are gloaming onto the us.I remember the day your shit was at least 2.65 a dollar, what is your shit worth today? A buck 20? Jesus man, you put us into it. You fucked it up. You should be respbonsilbe for your bills, think about that mate, you want trump our president we will shove him down your throat any you willl say yesser, nossir come to that, if you blokes think you are playing in the big leauges you are sadly mistaken my tory friend. We werent holdin your ass up the first time.


Yet, colonial or not, I do know English and Scottish history. The two nations were joined first of all in 1603, by James VI of Scotland who also became James I of England, cousin a gazillion times removed of Elizabeth I. A hundered years later, is 1707, we had "The Union of the Parliaments" Two Parliamentary Acts took place, one by the English to join the Scots, and one by the Scots to join the English. This was done by TWO Sovereign parliaments. This became the Kingdom of Great Britain. There was no theft of anything, not even any Viking Style pilfering.



(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 701
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 4:16:40 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph

We are not back at war.

Your questions:
1.
Stockholm convention 1960 Articles 1 and 16
and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_abode_(United_Kingdom)

UK citizen law 1971

While I agree (and did so before) on the basic fact that EU executives are not voted in or out but appointed by EU commission which is your and mine and the other governments while we all vote for our MEPs you should never forget what governments refused from the beginning to hand over any legislative powers from national government and parliament to the European parliament and thus refusing EP vital democratic legitimation to control EU commission as every parliament controls executive administration. What you complain about is "no cessation of national sovereignty to the EU" ... Tories' lament for decades. You complain a vital deficit the Tories are largely responsible for (long before Cameron's days).



The right of abode has nothing to do with the freedom of movement across borders. You will find that while you are right in as much it as been the Tories lament for decades, back in the 70s the most Tories wanted in and Labour wanted out. It was the Tories, under Ted Heath, who took us in in the first place.

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Profile   Post #: 702
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 4:43:34 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		I am a little confused here. What has the IRA to do with the Scots ? Why would the IRA want to start another bombing campaign because the Scots disagree with the British decision ? The IRA wants a united Ireland, NOT a union of Scotland, Ulster and Ireland, last time I looked.
As you say P.S, there was no theft in the joining of Scotland and England. Plenty of wars before it happened but when it DID happen, it happened peaceably.

(in reply to Politesub53)
Profile   Post #: 703
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 5:40:54 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Northern Ireland disagreed as well.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 5:57:32 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		And to answer a question that wasn't even asked by anything remotely human, Northern Ireland still has very little to do with Scotland apart from the fact that they are joined in a union called Great Britain and/or The United Kingdom. I STILL don't believe the IRA is going to start a bombing campaign because Scotland wants to exit Britain.

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Profile   Post #: 705
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 6:19:13 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
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Status: offline 		It would be kinda like Oregon sending fanatics to bomb Washington D.C. because Texas wants to exit the Union.

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RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 6:35:20 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

It would be kinda like Oregon sending fanatics to bomb Washington D.C. because Texas wants to exit the Union.

I couldn't imagine what brought this up till I checked who you were taking to.
The kind of clear rational thougt I would expect from them.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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Profile   Post #: 707
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 6:49:51 PM   
Dvr22999874


Posts: 2849
Joined: 9/11/2008
Status: offline 		Sorry if I confused you Bama *smile*..........Mnotaclue had posted on here and I picked on his rant via P.S.'s posts. I guess I should have left it alone but I guess I have a streak of stupidity in me that can't help it.

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RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 8:00:05 PM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

And to answer a question that wasn't even asked by anything remotely human, Northern Ireland still has very little to do with Scotland apart from the fact that they are joined in a union called Great Britain and/or The United Kingdom. I STILL don't believe the IRA is going to start a bombing campaign because Scotland wants to exit Britain.

Nobody is following that. Northern Ireland, as well as Scotland voted remain. The IRA has been at it for far lesser reasons.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 9:21:04 PM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

It would be kinda like Oregon sending fanatics to bomb Washington D.C. because Texas wants to exit the Union.


Oh shit...the cat is out of the bag.

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RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 9:22:29 PM   
thompsonx


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ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

Sorry if I confused you Bama *smile*..........Mnotaclue had posted on here and I picked on his rant via P.S.'s posts.

Of course you did

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Profile   Post #: 711
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 11:00:44 PM   
Staleek


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

Wow, just wow

Exactly. Typical right-wing, "I'm alright Jack" fucktard who believes free-markets and laissez faire capitalism are the only things which really matter. He couldn't give a damn about anyone who's poor, sick or a member of an underclass because he implicitly believes that all of those things are a product of being lazy.



I'm a socialist actually.

I believe in free healthcare, a decent safety net for everyone whether they are shirkers or not, and a citizens income. I don't believe poverty comes from laziness and I never said that. I believe that immigrants should be paid what local people are paid, with the same conditions, and should not be exploited.

For that I'd actually get called a loony leftie here.

But to deny that capitalism has had any benefits, and to deny these economic and free travel unions have had any benefits, is not a credible position to take.

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Profile   Post #: 712
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 11:12:48 PM   
Staleek


Posts: 361
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quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph


And if the MPs vote against what then? It would be their democratic right to do so. One could say it is even their obligation to avert damage to the nation even if a popular opinion wants them to. Would you accept that as the democratic process in action?




They might. What a lot of people here don't seem to understand is the distinction between a representative democracy and a direct democracy. The UK has a representative democracy. Sovereignty and power rests with the people we elect, not us. The referendum was not legally binding, it was advisory. This is why we haven't brought back hanging, even though polls show there is consistent support for it. If the people demand their leaders lead them to ruin, parliament is not obliged to obey. It is the job of suitably qualified and experienced politicians to make the final decision on any issue.

In short, any MP can simply ignore the referendum result. It might be career suicide, but they can certainly do it if they so choose, and if enough of them do then we remain in Europe.

Now let's look at the facts.

37.4% of the electorate voted to leave the EU. That isn't a ringing endorsement for leaving, as much as people might scream otherwise. Politics isn't like a basketball game where 101-99 counts as a win. And this isn't simply a vote on which path to take for the country, this is a vote on deviating from a path we've been on for 43 years. The laws we've made, the economy we built, the infrastructure that surrounds us, and the UKs place in the modern world are all tied to the EU, like it or not.

If we backtrack on this we'll be unraveling four decades of building our nation to what it is today, unraveling the relationships and commerce we've built both with Europe and the wider world.

So, pretend you're an MP, going into parliament to vote on this issue.

1. If article 50 is not triggered we remain a huge part of the biggest trading block on earth. And we remain the financial hub of that trading block, with access and freedom to move and trade in it, as well as being the gateway to that trading block for other nations and the powerhouse of the US economy.

2. If article 50 is triggered we plunge into the unknown, but we know it will hurt badly. Our financial sector, our most important sector, will be a major casualty. We have no manufacturing base and no way to compete with China on that. We don't even have agriculture to feed all the hungry mouths in this country. We'll become an economically destitute non-entity with nuclear weapons.

What would you vote for?

(in reply to blnymph)
Profile   Post #: 713
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/3/2016 11:28:46 PM   
Staleek


Posts: 361
Joined: 6/1/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

I am a little confused here. What has the IRA to do with the Scots ? Why would the IRA want to start another bombing campaign because the Scots disagree with the British decision ? The IRA wants a united Ireland, NOT a union of Scotland, Ulster and Ireland, last time I looked.
As you say P.S, there was no theft in the joining of Scotland and England. Plenty of wars before it happened but when it DID happen, it happened peaceably.


The IRA want unity with Ireland. Whilst the UK and Ireland were in the EU together they pretty much had that. They could hop on over any time and the borders were down. Unionists (those from Ulster who want to remain with the UK) still got to say they were in the UK. There was tension. But except for more hardline elements we've pretty much had peace since the Good Friday Agreement.

The fetal alcohol syndrome addled nutters who just voted to leave the UK have fucked with that in a number of ways. Firstly Ulster was split, with most of the Catholics (pro-Irish) voting to remain as this keeps them closer to Ireland, and most of the Protestants (pro-UK) voting to remain. That's reopened this schism quite nicely in Northern Ireland.

If we leave the EU then the people of Ulster who feel closer to Ireland will feel isolated and occupied again. The IRA will be resurgent.

http://qz.com/716515/with-the-brexit-vote-millions-of-english-voters-may-have-handed-the-ira-its-ultimate-victory/

< Message edited by Staleek -- 7/3/2016 11:29:41 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 714
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/4/2016 12:09:19 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1598
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		FR
I posted the link to the right of abode because there you 'll find the 1971 law.

Regarding Northern Ireland I guess the IRA or rather Sinn Fein is still celebrating. Even the smaller unionist parties recommended to remain, only the DUP was for leaving. The province since 1973 has gained so much by the ups and downs of the celtic tiger years in the republic that the closing of the border affects everybody. No matter what might happen in Scotland the chances for a referendum in Northern Ireland to leave the UK are growing on both sides of the sectarian divide.

Did the tories' divide over the EU begin in Ted Heath's days already? - I thought it is one of Thatcher's leftovers. In any case this is the true reason behind it all. The brexit referendum turned an inner-party problem into an (inter)national one. No cure for the one and none yet for the other.

(in reply to Staleek)
Profile   Post #: 715
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/4/2016 3:53:56 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

Sorry if I confused you Bama *smile*..........Mnotaclue had posted on here and I picked on his rant via P.S.'s posts. I guess I should have left it alone but I guess I have a streak of stupidity in me that can't help it.


Thats why you guys like to hang out, to share your brains, but they still rank stupid.



_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Dvr22999874)
Profile   Post #: 716
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/4/2016 3:58:30 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dvr22999874

It would be kinda like Oregon sending fanatics to bomb Washington D.C. because Texas wants to exit the Union.

I couldn't imagine what brought this up till I checked who you were taking to.
The kind of clear rational thougt I would expect from them.

You dont know shit about your own country, welfare patient, don't hold forth on the UK. Oregon probably wouldnt do that, but Idaho would.



_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 717
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/4/2016 8:27:51 AM   
WhoreMods


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Joined: 5/6/2016
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_____________________________

On the level and looking for a square deal.

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Profile   Post #: 718
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/4/2016 8:29:16 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		And now they are all quitting, even that useless UKIP poofter.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 719
RE: Brexit Vote Results - 7/4/2016 9:16:02 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1598
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		what was that story ... about rats and sinking ships ...?

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 720
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