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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/22/2006 11:07:46 PM

fullofgrace

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it's funny...i used to take a very negative view of arranged marriages (particularly in india) until i took a hindu goddesses course that touched on a lot of cultural things (arranged marriages and marital relationships involving women repeatedly), which broadened my view a lot beyond my western, "democratic" conceptualization of how relationships should work. (that said, i don't think anyone should necessarily be forced into a relationship they HATE, but i know at least one young indian woman in an arranged marriage who is happy with it and the institution as a whole).

i do think arranging the situation, as others have said, based on long-term reasons and not just short-term infatuation/romance is a fabulous idea. and as someone else mentioned, a good thing about arranged marriages is no one goes in with delusions that the romance is going to last forever and things like that. i think in western culture it's best to strike a balance though - find someone you are romantically happy with and try to arrange and match things in the long term and deal with the eventuality of the honeymoon period going away.

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/22/2006 11:14:46 PM

popeye1250

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Hmm, that gives me an idea.
In a B&D M/s relationship the participants could "arrange" their own marriage, kind of.
Sounds sexy.

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 12:20:30 AM

fullofgrace

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in a way, i think contracts serve that function :) it's an interesting parallel.

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 3:13:54 AM

Vandervecken

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Speaking from the Jewish perspective, arranged marriages in Judaism run a gamut. Ont he one end there's the ones which are done by the parents as pure social contract, The idea is that the marriage is purely for procreative reasons, and the participants are enjoined to keep a celibate mindset. It amounts to a strong ruleset on male-female sexual relations, and a banning of homosexual behaviours.
On the other end, there's the idea of an arranged marriage as a system for finding a partner while still following the rules of not touching, kissing, etc before marriage. Usually it's just a way to go out on dates and find out about the other person before committing.

As far as slave/master relationships in an arranged marriage. A lot of the point of arranging marriages was to remove unpredictability from a society's continuity. As such, the relationships tend to be much more calm, less lustful, etc. As we all know, one of the whole points of the slave/master relationship is to excite a visceral response in the other person. It may be mental, but it's not dryly intellectual. So it strikes me that a master/slave bdsm relationship cannot arise easily from a cultural form of an arranged marriage.

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 3:24:17 AM

Dollbecky

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I like the idea of arranged (yet consensual) marriges ...the idea of two well matched people building a life based on something other than the fleeting scaps of romantic tripe that many western cultures thrust down ones throat is deeply appealing.
Could you have a BDSM conponant in such a marriage ...its possible ...but how would you tell a marrige broker you like the idea of some slap and tickle ?

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 3:43:54 AM

SusanofO

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Bingo (to Vandervecken).

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 7/23/2006 3:44:16 AM >

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 5:00:10 AM

JessieMe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SusanofO

Jessie: I am not sure I'd be a fan of arranged marriage, simply because I believe people should have some say in who they spend a good part of their life with in a marital relationship,(even if people do screw up that choice, or trying to get things to work well, about half the time, it seems). I know in many cases, I know arranged marriage appears to work well. Personally, I think this has a lot to do with the people involved having been enculturated to work with eachother, and not thinking, perhaps, that marriage in general is going to be a bastion of complete all-the-time happiness.That is a generalization, of course, but it may be at least partly true.

- Susan

Susan, this is exactly the point I was trying make. My question is.. shouldnt we expect as a lifestyle or "culture" of our own to have that expectation to "work with each other" esp if what we are entering into amounts to an agreement of service?

Yes I do know that we are not talking about arranged relationships in the tried and true way where someone else is choosing our partners, but just because we make this choice based on certain criteria we seem to think important to us at the time.. what ever happened to the concept of a collar being more sacrosanct than a wedding ring? It has for most become little more than a wedding ring to others which is just as disposable as the ring is in vanilla life.

Personally, I wish (although I do admit to being too chicken to actually put my money where my mouth is in a matter of speaking) that there was a system in place where someone else "arranged" who I would be with based on what would be in my (and my partners) best interest and lifestyle practices.

BDSM Yentas.... the wave of the future LOL

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 5:21:23 AM

SusanofO

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Well, it might be easier - unless they screwed it up, somehow. If it was next to foolproof, then I agree wholeheartedly with you, Jessie. I understand what you mean, and the idea (to me) does rather highlight the concept of trying hard to relate well to another person simply because of their pre-arranged position in a relationship, in a way - and that is kind of romantic to me, in a sense.

But - I do have a question: How are they (the Matchmaker) gonna know just what really "lights your fire", in terms of "chemistry" - which I consider really important? I would not be seeking any kind of bdsm relationship with anyone, if I didn't think it was important. It would have to be a very, very good Matchmaker. I think it could happen, but they would have to be an expert.

- Susan

< Message edited by SusanofO -- 7/23/2006 5:51:02 AM >

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 5:46:53 AM

MasterC46910

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"Love is not about finding the right person but creating the right relationship, its not about on how much love you have at the beginning but how much love you can build til the end."

This is a old quote that I firmly believe in. It is the simple concept behind an arranged marriage or relationship. It also can work with one of your own choosing. You need to look at the relationship more then the person. While the type person you are partnered with can make a relationship fail or succeed, the right partner will give you a lifetime of happiness.

We seem to want instant love and respect, just like in the movies. Well movies aren't real, but too many people are expecting life to be like what they see on screen. Love and respect have to be earned, then carefully nurtured to continue to grow and blossom.

< Message edited by MasterC46910 -- 7/23/2006 5:50:37 AM >

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 7:46:53 AM

sophia37

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I for one, do have to love a person in order to "serve" them well. Thats something though, that one can only find out first hand. It can be a theory, but a theory then put into practice.

Obviously this would be different in a paid setting.. Helath care workers can care for people without loving them. But I am not a healthcare worker, and am not cut out to be one. I would have trouble caring for a patient I did not like. But its taken me many years to come to this understanding of myself.

Thank you for starting this excellent thread. xoxo Sophie

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 8:00:23 AM

mellian

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Not all marriages involve love or an actual relationship of any kind, I have and heard of some that is purely for business reasonsand the couple are business partners having a business relationship, nothing else. As for the marriages arranged by some higher ups or parents, then that becomes an issue for me as it ends not being consentually. So yes, love or not, if it is not consentual, then the marriage shouldn't happen.

-mellian

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RE: Arranged vs Love - 7/23/2006 9:01:17 AM

popeye1250

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Dollbecky, yes, that's what I meant, arranged but consentual by the partners themselves.
I think that as a relationship progresses from "Sir"/"sub" to having both agree to a Collaring making the sub a slave marriage should definately be considered.
I consider a Collar a permanent, lifetime committment and at that point shouldn't a marriage be somehow "arranged" by the two?
Just fishing for ideas.

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