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Is Modern Academic Feminism Harming Women?

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Once again I have very up close and personal experience with the fallacy here. A very close relative spent almost 20 years at Aetna insurance. [She] went with a smaller casualty & property insurance co. nearer her home. They needed and hired her as VP of claims which was what her area was at Aetna.

They started her at $84K and told her up front that should she do the job as they expected she could, she would get a fairly substantial raise every year until what ? Until she was being paid as much as the male VP's were already making.

That $84K went to $96K the next year and $108K the following, whereupon any future raises would be solely on merit...not due to previous sexism. As in marketing, being that there exists these anecdotal facts, the are at least 100 more within the same local market and country wide...even more than that.

Oh and she also raised two daughters during all of this.

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ORIGINAL: Nnanji

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Once again I have very up close and personal experience with the fallacy here. A very close relative spent almost 20 years at Aetna insurance. [She] went with a smaller casualty & property insurance co. nearer her home. They needed and hired her as VP of claims which was what her area was at Aetna.

They started her at $84K and told her up front that should she do the job as they expected she could, she would get a fairly substantial raise every year until what ? Until she was being paid as much as the male VP's were already making.

That $84K went to $96K the next year and $108K the following, whereupon any future raises would be solely on merit...not due to previous sexism. As in marketing, being that there exists these anecdotal facts, the are at least 100 more within the same local market and country wide...even more than that.

Oh and she also raised two daughters during all of this.

There's so much BS in that story it would be difficult to start pointing it out.

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ORIGINAL: thishereboi

I'm not sure if it's harming women, but it seems to be driving you crazy. Don't you have any other interests or do you think about this 24/7

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ORIGINAL: respectmen

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/more-mortal/201609/is-modern-academic-feminism-harming-women

All women need to do is to work as hard as men if they want to get far in life. Christina Hoff Sommers knows this. Any woman with a functioning brain knows this. If the feminuts realised this instead of blaming men for everything and expecting men to hand them everything on a silver platter, there would be a far better outcome for the little darlings. Hey, I know, instead of taking a women's study course, why not take a course in STEM instead. Gotta larf.

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ORIGINAL: smartsub10

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ORIGINAL: respectmen

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/more-mortal/201609/is-modern-academic-feminism-harming-women

All women need to do is to work as hard as men if they want to get far in life. Christina Hoff Sommers knows this. Any woman with a functioning brain knows this. If the feminuts realised this instead of blaming men for everything and expecting men to hand them everything on a silver platter, there would be a far better outcome for the little darlings. Hey, I know, instead of taking a women's study course, why not take a course in STEM instead. Gotta larf.

I grew up in a dysfunctional family. Escaped as soon as I could when I turned 18. Left behind a mother who couldn't give a shit what happened to me. I worked full time days and went to school at night. Sometimes I worked an additional part-time job to make ends meet. It took almost ten years to finally graduate with a science degree. Got a job in research and worked my way up to a management position in a Contract Research Organization earning six figures. No help at all from anyone. Not complaining just stating a fact.

Oh yeah, not one mention of silver platters or men handing me success.

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ORIGINAL: respectmen
All women need to do is to work as hard as men if they want to get far in life. Christina Hoff Sommers knows this. Any woman with a functioning brain knows this. If the feminuts realised this instead of blaming men for everything and expecting men to hand them everything on a silver platter, there would be a far better outcome for the little darlings. Hey, I know, instead of taking a women's study course, why not take a course in STEM instead. Gotta larf.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: Nnanji

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Once again I have very up close and personal experience with the fallacy here. A very close relative spent almost 20 years at Aetna insurance. [She] went with a smaller casualty & property insurance co. nearer her home. They needed and hired her as VP of claims which was what her area was at Aetna.

They started her at $84K and told her up front that should she do the job as they expected she could, she would get a fairly substantial raise every year until what ? Until she was being paid as much as the male VP's were already making.

That $84K went to $96K the next year and $108K the following, whereupon any future raises would be solely on merit...not due to previous sexism. As in marketing, being that there exists these anecdotal facts, the are at least 100 more within the same local market and country wide...even more than that.

Oh and she also raised two daughters during all of this.

There's so much BS in that story it would be difficult to start pointing it out.

Apparently too difficult for you.

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ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
So ... the obvious, glaring question is: Were those male VPs hired at the same time she was or had they been "doing the job as the company suspected they could" for a number of years?

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All women need to do is to work as hard as men if they want to get far in life. Christina Hoff Sommers knows this. Any woman with a functioning brain knows this. If the feminuts realised this instead of blaming men for everything and expecting men to hand them everything on a silver platter, there would be a far better outcome for the little darlings. Hey, I know, instead of taking a women's study course, why not take a course in STEM instead. Gotta larf.

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ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

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ORIGINAL: Nnanji

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

Once again I have very up close and personal experience with the fallacy here. A very close relative spent almost 20 years at Aetna insurance. [She] went with a smaller casualty & property insurance co. nearer her home. They needed and hired her as VP of claims which was what her area was at Aetna.

They started her at $84K and told her up front that should she do the job as they expected she could, she would get a fairly substantial raise every year until what ? Until she was being paid as much as the male VP's were already making.

That $84K went to $96K the next year and $108K the following, whereupon any future raises would be solely on merit...not due to previous sexism. As in marketing, being that there exists these anecdotal facts, the are at least 100 more within the same local market and country wide...even more than that.

Oh and she also raised two daughters during all of this.

There's so much BS in that story it would be difficult to start pointing it out.

Apparently too difficult for you.

As someone who worked in the insurance industry (A good portion of time for a company as large or larger than Aetna), I'll take a stab at one part:

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers

... They started her at $84K and told her up front that should she do the job as they expected she could, she would get a fairly substantial raise every year until what ? Until she was being paid as much as the male VP's were already making.

So ... the obvious, glaring question is: Were those male VPs hired at the same time she was or had they been "doing the job as the company suspected they could" for a number of years?



Michael

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ORIGINAL: JeffBC

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ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr
So ... the obvious, glaring question is: Were those male VPs hired at the same time she was or had they been "doing the job as the company suspected they could" for a number of years?

Agreed. I don't find MR's story very supportive of his claim even though, by my previous post, I'm sympathetic to the claim itself.

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
The whole issues may have been and I rather think so, is that she may have been starting out as they did but management wanted to see, make sure and then bring her pay to theirs, in 3 years and by which time I am sure, [they]...were making even more.

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ORIGINAL: JeffBC

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ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
The whole issues may have been and I rather think so, is that she may have been starting out as they did but management wanted to see, make sure and then bring her pay to theirs, in 3 years and by which time I am sure, [they]...were making even more.

But even were that true, that is SOP. I was a grade 7 in my last job. I made less than most other grade 7's because I was pretty new to the position and had not accumulated raises in that grade.

I feel like my anecdotal story was much more on-target. There I was talking about women who'd been in grade for longer (sometimes much longer and with glowing annual reviews) and yet hadn't been promoted and weren't at pay equity much less earning more. There really wasn't any room for alternate theories. They had been screwed over. The powers that be wanted that fixed... promptly.

What is particularly concerning is that my story happened in a corporate culture where it should never have occurred to start with and where, when it was discovered, brass very much wanted to fix it. There were no "old dinosaurs preserving the patriachy". There was just the [larger] cultural bias affecting the corporate culture invisibly.