Voter ID in practice....

Voter ID in practice.... (Full Version)

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MercTech -> Voter ID in practice.... (11/15/2016 1:57:48 PM)
This was the first election I've actually gone to the polls for since Voter ID was required. There is a list of acceptable documents which include the free "voter registration card". I still have my voter registration card but I have enough pocket plunder in my wallet I don't want another card there. I did see two ladies who arrived in a church bus use the voter registration card as they hadn't driven in years (80 plus years old I think) I think I flummoxed the poll worker when I came to my Passport Card before I found my Driver's License. The lady had never seen one and didn't know how to record it on the poll register. I relented and gave her my Driver's License. Changes I've noted since the legislation to prevent a re-occurance of two cases of someone illegally voting blocks of votes. 1> You either have to present an appropriate photo ID or a voter registration card. 2> You can get a replacement voter registration card as late as the day before the election (day before in person. week before by mail) 3> The voter registration cards are serialized and the serial number is entered into the poll registry when presented. One person, one card, one vote. 4> The poll registry is no longer a book but a computer database. 5> You no longer have to go to a government office to obtain an absentee ballot but can obtain a serialized ballot from a state website. Fill out and mail in with no longer having to have your ballot notarized. (that was an old old requirement)

Greta75 -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/15/2016 7:00:38 PM)
Because of the lack of standard national ID card. There should be just one universal voter ID acceptable. So there is no confusion. In my country, National ID is compulsory, and they put a 5 year jail term for those who refuse to get one. IF for any reason really cannot leave your house to process and collect your National ID. Like for example, bedridden or something. They will come to your house and help you process it and then deliver your ID to you. So there is no excuse. Alot of things seems common sense and simple in my country seems to be so difficult to enforce efficiently in the US. When I had to change my National ID photo to a current photo. It was as simple as uploading my picture online, fill in an online registration form, and then go collect it in person on my chosen date and time.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/15/2016 8:41:37 PM)
I think Canada's voter ID law is really sensible. They have such an extensive list of possible ways of providing ID (including having somebody with ID vouching for you), that it is actually pretty hard to not have appropriate ID.

littleclip -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/15/2016 8:48:31 PM)
the us is 50 different countries called states that all want it their way, and trying to get them to agree on anything is like trying to heard a bunch of cats if there is a simple way to do something it will be sent to a committee to make it complicated and expensive

KenDckey -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 1:42:56 AM)
National ID might be a good idea but here are some negatives. 1-The Constitution is mute on ID. Doesn't matter if it is voter, drivers, gun, etc. Therefore it is a states right. 2-Jail sentences for lack of ID seems a tad bit rough. Might be useful in sorting out the legal's from the illegals in this country. There are probably others but it is 2 am out here in the desert and my brain isn't awake yet LOL

BamaD -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 4:46:56 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick I think Canada's voter ID law is really sensible. They have such an extensive list of possible ways of providing ID (including having somebody with ID vouching for you), that it is actually pretty hard to not have appropriate ID. Same in Alabama.

Musicmystery -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 4:47:33 AM)
Isn't this how we used to describe fascists and communists when we were kids? Show me your papers?

bounty44 -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 4:59:28 AM)
sure, but do you respond that way in every other instance in life when you are asked for identification?

Musicmystery -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 5:02:28 AM)
AND he misses the point completely. Papers it is. I miss America. I really do.

MercTech -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 10:06:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 Because of the lack of standard national ID card. There should be just one universal voter ID acceptable. So there is no confusion. In my country, National ID is compulsory, and they put a 5 year jail term for those who refuse to get one. IF for any reason really cannot leave your house to process and collect your National ID. Like for example, bedridden or something. They will come to your house and help you process it and then deliver your ID to you. So there is no excuse. Alot of things seems common sense and simple in my country seems to be so difficult to enforce efficiently in the US. When I had to change my National ID photo to a current photo. It was as simple as uploading my picture online, fill in an online registration form, and then go collect it in person on my chosen date and time. The U.S. does have a standard National ID but it isn't compulsory. The passport and passport card are the only National identifications in the U.S. Most in the U.S. are so colloquial that they don't even recognize a Passport card when shown.

MercTech -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 10:13:59 AM)
Legal nit picking and philosophy rather than realpolitik: If you come down to basics; a driver's license is NOT an identification. A driver's license is a permit to operate a motorized vehicle on public roads. It is only issued when proven that the holder can safely operate a vehicle. Other than a quick check for outstanding tickets or warrants; no background check is done to obtain a driver's license. All you have to have to obtain a driver's license in most states is a copy of a birth certificate showing U.S. nationality or immigration papers and a bill or rent receipt to show you are actually a resident in the state who is issuing the license. A driver's license shows that the person in the picture on it is most probably the person named; but it is no certification of identity. But, it has become the de facto identification in the U.S.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 6:24:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MercTech Legal nit picking and philosophy rather than realpolitik: If you come down to basics; a driver's license is NOT an identification. A driver's license is a permit to operate a motorized vehicle on public roads. It is only issued when proven that the holder can safely operate a vehicle. Other than a quick check for outstanding tickets or warrants; no background check is done to obtain a driver's license. All you have to have to obtain a driver's license in most states is a copy of a birth certificate showing U.S. nationality or immigration papers and a bill or rent receipt to show you are actually a resident in the state who is issuing the license. A driver's license shows that the person in the picture on it is most probably the person named; but it is no certification of identity. But, it has become the de facto identification in the U.S. It is a de facto ID card. The only difference between it and a State ID card, is that a State ID card doesn't carry the permit to drive. How does one go about proving who they are?

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 6:31:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BamaD quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick I think Canada's voter ID law is really sensible. They have such an extensive list of possible ways of providing ID (including having somebody with ID vouching for you), that it is actually pretty hard to not have appropriate ID. Same in Alabama. Yeah, that's a pretty good list, not as extensive as Canada's, but pretty fucking inclusive, especially since one of them (the voter ID card) is available free.

Nnanji -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 6:39:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Isn't this how we used to describe fascists and communists when we were kids? Show me your papers? That was just being stopped on the street. When we were kids parents had ID's to drive, to bank, to be employed and to be in social programs. ID's of parents and birth certificates for kids to get in school and when I first started voting I had to show an ID.

MercTech -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 7:07:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: MercTech Legal nit picking and philosophy rather than realpolitik: If you come down to basics; a driver's license is NOT an identification. A driver's license is a permit to operate a motorized vehicle on public roads. It is only issued when proven that the holder can safely operate a vehicle. Other than a quick check for outstanding tickets or warrants; no background check is done to obtain a driver's license. All you have to have to obtain a driver's license in most states is a copy of a birth certificate showing U.S. nationality or immigration papers and a bill or rent receipt to show you are actually a resident in the state who is issuing the license. A driver's license shows that the person in the picture on it is most probably the person named; but it is no certification of identity. But, it has become the de facto identification in the U.S. It is a de facto ID card. The only difference between it and a State ID card, is that a State ID card doesn't carry the permit to drive. How does one go about proving who they are? For obtaining a passport; one produces a birth certificate and two other forms of identification that show the person applying is the person noted on the birth certificate (or naturalization papers). If no birth certificate is available; you have to provide two people with appropriate ID to swear that they know that you are a born citizen. We actually had to do that to get a birth certificate for a great aunt who was born at home and no birth certificate registered. She had my grandfather, and older brother, who was in the house when she was born along with a child who could swear an affidavit (cough cough) that she had known her mother all her life and to the best of her knowledge was a U.S. citizen. For a security clearance; you have to provide references that can vouch you are who you say you are and they go back verifying residence and/or schooling for a period of time concomitant with the level of clearance you are being vetted for. (5 years, 15 years, or back to investigating your parents as it applies) The passport is the only form of identification that is certified by a government entity that the person shown is the person of the name on the passport. The certifying agency is the U.S. State Department with input from the FBI who handles criminal background checks. _____________________________________ Sidebar: I think I've had a clearance of one sort or the other for way too long. (30+ years). I never had to pay for and have an FBI check done for a clearance before but I had to for a work visa and clearance as a nuclear worker in Canada. I arranged to pay for my own background check. They said it takes two to six weeks for a background check for clearance to come back. I live about 20 minutes from where I had my fingerprints done and the request for background check was sent in. It was in my email when I got home. A bit scary if my FBI file is that readily to hand. <grin>

Greta75 -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 7:19:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: littleclip the us is 50 different countries called states that all want it their way, and trying to get them to agree on anything is like trying to heard a bunch of cats if there is a simple way to do something it will be sent to a committee to make it complicated and expensive But some things can be forcefully nationally implemented at a federal level. So voter ID should be one of them.

Greta75 -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 7:25:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Isn't this how we used to describe fascists and communists when we were kids? Show me your papers? I don't know why the words "fascists" should even pop up in your mind, with simply a country keeping proper track of it's people. This way, you can make sure people who needs help get the help they need too. I guess because our country is running on surpluses every year, the government distribute back taxpayers money based on interestingly, their housing level. So if they live on the streets, they are gonna get way more money than someone who have a luxury home.

BamaD -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 7:39:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Isn't this how we used to describe fascists and communists when we were kids? Show me your papers? I don't know why the words "fascists" should even pop up in your mind, with simply a country keeping proper track of it's people. This way, you can make sure people who needs help get the help they need too. I guess because our country is running on surpluses every year, the government distribute back taxpayers money based on interestingly, their housing level. So if they live on the streets, they are gonna get way more money than someone who have a luxury home. He is equating making sure that the properly registered people vote is the same as being able to drive from one city to another. I wounder how he feels about needed a DL, registration, and proof of insurance in your car at all times?

Edwird -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 10:04:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Musicmystery Isn't this how we used to describe fascists and communists when we were kids? Show me your papers? It used to be "Ihr Papiere (sometimes 'Unterlagen'), bitte." (Your papers, please.) But I watch all the Jason Bourne series to keep up to date. As witnessed thereon: "Ihr Hand, bitte." Eyeballs are next.

Edwird -> RE: Voter ID in practice.... (11/16/2016 10:21:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: MercTech A driver's license shows that the person in the picture on it is most probably the person named; but it is no certification of identity. But, it has become the de facto identification in the U.S. It is a de facto ID card. The only difference between it and a State ID card, is that a State ID card doesn't carry the permit to drive. Unfortunately, Merc is correct when it comes to the state of Illinois. My legally blind brother was denied entrance into 3 different bars in that state because he didn't have a driver's license. This is not a joke. He presents Illinois state ID (w/picture), doorman says "Sorry, man, gotta have a driver's license." Not kidding. #notthesmartestguys His Illinois state ID worked fine in Georgia, S. Carolina, and N. Carolina, though. He now has a N. Carolina state ID and that's where he will remain. #smartmove

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