gnathic
Posts: 85
Joined: 12/2/2016
Status: offline
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: Alecta
I have to wonder if it was made clear from the get-go that you don't want him to change you, just train you to serve him. You mentioned the "normal you" and the "sub you", or something to that effect earlier, so I have to wonder if that point was made when you were originally setting up the dynamic, and that he only had the right to try to change the one, not the other.
Pride(or Humility) and Confidence are two of the many common things that people tend to be horrible judges of when it comes to themselves. Many many people think they are confident when they aren't, or have pride in themselves (which isn't quite the same as being proud or proud of themselves) when they actually don't, and many many people think they are humble or lack confidence when that is in fact not true. Usually the disconnect occurs because instead of actually being humble or confident, they have an idea of how a humble or confident person would act or speak and pretend to be thus by following those behaviours. But there are many tells, most significantly of which is how they react when said quality is examined or questioned. Just some food for thought.
I am mystified that you would think it an affront to be set up with people he wants you to talk to and learn from. Isn't that part of training "sub you" to his liking? I would understand more if he'd said "ok you can't talk to any of your existing friends, here's some people you should be best friends with instead", but I think to be upset that he wanted you to also try to befriend and talk to people who embody what he feels is more to his liking than your existing friends is childish and a little ridiculous.
It is very common that the person we think we are isn't the same person as what other people see. The philosophical question is then "who is right? which is the truth?"
In D/s, I believe the answer is it doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is how you present yourself in the Master's eyes. Of course, this is a subjective matter in practice, and for some it is easier to find someone who can be taught to see you in the way you want to be seen than change yourself to suit them, for others it is the other way around. That's what's really going on when most people talk about "seeking compatibility". Finding someone who sees and treats you the way you want to be treated, or learning to adapt to become who they want to see and welcome how they treat you.
I personally cannot care less about a submissive's vanilla achievements if they have no bearing on their "submissive side". So you're a Harvard grad, big whoop. It doesn't make you a better slave, and it doesn't forgive the mistake you made in service today. So you own your own business, great, but you still make an awful cup of tea and are terrible at being punctual for me. These achievements are irrelevant to me so far as being my submissive is concerned.
I also don't see why anyone should be celebrated for achieving the bare minimal expectation of them. So you passed the class... but that's what you're supposed to do so why should it be celebrated? Now, fail the class and be punished for not meeting the minimal standard, or make honour roll and be rewarded for exceeding expectation, but just passing is hardly worth noting.
I don't think that's denigration. Your "vanilla" achievements simply aren't relevant to your performance and growth as a submissive. Many people use irrelevant achievements as a way to validate themselves in completely unrelated ways, it's a common bad habit: "you should listen to me and invest in gold, trust me, I've been a baker for 20 years" (except baking has nothing to do with banking and investing!). If your being a honour roll student or big bad corporate exec is irrelevant to the dynamic, it is completely insensible for "sub you" and him, as your Dom, to care about those achievements. I would consider allowing "sub you" to feel validated by those irrelevant achievements and expecting him, as your Dom, to validate those achievements to be ridiculous. That said, "normal you" can and should absolutely be proud of your achievements if you have earned them, no matter what direction they are in, and him as your friend and life partner should be happy for you too.
So perhaps aother thing to think on is, are you being a submissive to be validated and celebrated for your desire to "serve"? Or are you bring a submissive to serve (and validation and celebration are gravy, but only expected when earned)?
Hi Alecta, thanks for your response.
Admittedly no, I probably didn't make that clear to him. I had presumed - wrongly, on my part - that it would be obvious that I don't want who I am as a person to be changed. I had assumed that kink is similar to vanilla in that respect, so it didn't occur to me that I would have to be explicit about this. This is something that I'm going to change in terms of my own approach in my next D/s dynamic.
My inferences about my own confidence comes from a variety of things. How I feel about myself, how I handle things, my ability to work for what I want, and so on. I agree with your point, but I disagree that I am lacking in confidence and just don't know about it. I simply wouldn't make the choices that I make in my life if I was someone that isn't confident.
I think it got my back up (the talking-to-other-subs thing) because he brought it up by saying that he wants me to "meet other subs", as opposed to "I want you to meet some subs that can give you a better understanding perhaps of the kind of sub I'd like you to be". The former implies that I don't know subs and haven't already immersed myself in the kink community in my town (which I have done and did so before ever even having met him). The latter approach is clearer and would have been something I may have been open to. But the way he phrased it implied I didn't know anything about submission. I can't read his mind, I can only respond to what he chooses to say to me. And I wiould agree with you about it being 'childish and ridiculous', however you have misunderstand/misframed what my position was. My reaction stemmed from him *not being clear*. If that makes sense? This formed one aspect of a cluster of behaviours that made his behaviour look a certain way.
I agree on your next paragraph. That is, in essence, why I called it off in the first place, after all.
I mentioned the achcivements not because of any weird "look how good I am" mentality. I was meaning it in terms of "Look, I wouldn't have had the balls to go for these things if I was lacking in confidence". I'm talking about choices I've made and huge risks that I've taken. I'm not talking achievements, per se. Also, given that some of what I am working towards are simply matters that are going on in my life and form a big part of what I am interested in... It kind of *is* important. It's like me expecting you to never talk about your job/whatever you do in your day, e.g. education. Especially if what you are doing you are very passionate about. But he seemed to avoid talking about any subject he didn't know more than me about like the plague; including my job and my degree (that are both ongoing at the moment). My friend that I introduced him to - right towards the end - also noticed this about him. So yes, it isn't relevant to me "as a sub"... but I'm more than a sub, I am a person. So yes, I do expect to be able to talk about things going on in my life. I'm a person, not just something to have kinky, sexy play with. To be clear: I am *not* talking about being celebrated. I would find that just as weird if he did celebrate me for that, just as much as I find it weird that he would *refuse* to see me as confident and capable.
EDIT: (I'd also just like to point out, that by his own admission - during the conversation in which I called it off with him - he said that yes, he knows far less about me than I do him, because of how much he had started to speak mostly about himself and not allow me to open up about my own self/life. When I called him up on talking down to me, he had no explanation as to why he was doing so, and simply kept apologising. I would have thought that he would surely have an explanation as to why he is not interested in learning more about me, or why he was taking such an approach to me, but he didn't have one. I also don't understand why he would feel the need to apologise - I wasn't angry on the phone to him, or emotional in any way - if even *he* didn't perceive his conduct as unpleasant. By his own admission, this was unfair.
So yes, I would agree that this would be ridiculous too... But what you have framed is not my position. At all. I only want to be acknowledged as an equal - but he was unwilling to do this. I don't think this is unreasonable on my part. I would have thought everyone wants this, sub or otherwise.
I was being a submissive because I desired to serve. I still do. But no, I disagree that I need to earn basic respect. I do expect to be seen and treated like I have a basic degree of competence and confidence. I do think there's a difference between basic respect and being celebrated, and I was only aiming for the former. Just the same as I gave him respect and listened to his own stories of what he's done in his life, and what goes on in it. It's not about "celebrating" the other person, it is about getting to know them and having that emotional intimacy with each other. And I don't think my attitude indicates that I am lacking in confidence... I think, if anything, if I lacked confidence I would just have put up with this behaviour.
< Message edited by gnathic -- 12/3/2016 11:10:57 AM >
|
Question about Guidance and Domination - 
Profile
New Messages
No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages
Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages
Locked w/o New Messages
Post New Thread