RE: Drugs Injection centres

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tweakabelle -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 1:09:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 Death penalty severely reduces the number of people who takes drugs. It will also save 10,000 lives. Prevention is better than cure. According to the 2008 World Drug Report by the United Nations office on drugs and crime 8.2% of the UK population are cannabis abusers; in Singapore it is 0.005%. For ecstasy, the figures are 1.8% for the UK and 0.003% for Singapore; and for opiates – such as heroin, opium and morphine – 0.9% for the UK and 0.005% for Singapore. Our tough stance against drugs has saved tens of thousands of lives from the drug menace. It is therefore not surprising that the majority of Singaporeans continue to support the death penalty. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/jun/05/singapore-policy-drugs-bay Greta Singapore has not solved its drug problem. It has exported it across the border to Malaysia where illegal drugs are more plentiful, cheaper and the police are far more corrupt than in Singapore. If your claim that the death penalty is successful in combating drug addiction and supply, then Malaysia, which also operates a mandatory death sentence for anyone convicted of drug trafficking or smuggling more than 15 grams (circa half an ounce) of heroin, would also have 'eliminated' its drug problem. However the numbers of drug users and addicts in Malaysia is increasing: "Drug problems in Malaysia seem to be on the increase despite harsh penalties for those caught supplying the drug. Of particular concern is the growing popularity of methamphetamine – seizures of this substance in 2010 were the highest on record. For many years the main threat appeared to be from heroin. This continues to be the most widely abused drug in the country but other substances are catching up. Up until the 1960s drug abuse in Malaysia mostly involved opium, and it was restricted to the Chinese immigrant population. By the 1980s the Malays had become the ethnic group in Malaysia that is most likely to abuse illegal drugs. Concerns for the rapid increase in heroin used were so high that the government decreed it was a national threat. This led to the creation of a national anti drug task force team along with a mandatory death sentence for anyone caught smuggling more than 15 grams of heroin. The government also decided that anyone caught using heroin would be forced to undergo compulsory addiction treatment. The ambition of the Malaysian government has been to completely eradicate drug problems by 2015, but the problem is in some ways getting worse. Half of all illegal drug use in Malaysia involves heroin. Records from 2006 show there were 22,811 drug users who had been officially detected, and this is a drop from 2005 when there were 34,813 cases detected. The majority of drug users seem to live in Pulau Pinang and Kedah. It is believed that at least 1.1% of the Malaysian population is involved in illegal drug use.] http://alcoholrehab.com/drug-addiction/drug-addiction-in-malaysia/ So the death penalty hasn't worked in Malaysia at all. The main reason Singapore has a relatively low drug problem is that it is a small island with tiny borders that are relatively easy to police. Singapore junkies travel to the mainland to get their supplies. There is not a single country or jurisdiction where prohibition has succeeded in eliminating the so-called drug problem. For all practical purposes, the only things achieved by prohibitionist policies and approaches is forcing up the cost of drugs, thereby enriching the drug cartels and ratcheting up crime levels as desperate junkies need to steal more to finance their habits. It also fills the jails with low level drug users and/or suppliers - at considerable cost to the taxpayer - and spawns a huge medico-legal-police-prison warder drug industry all of whom dependent on illegal drug users for their existence. The costs in lives lost, property lost and the hundreds of billions taxpayer $ squandered, is enormous. If you think prohibition is so successful, can you nominate a single country where it has succeeded in eliminating the drug 'problem'? Not even Singapore has eliminated the drug 'problem'. For a variety of reasons unique to Singapore it has a lower level of drug use than most other countries but it still has drug users and addicts - prohibition has not eliminated the drug problem there either. Why persist with a strategy that has failed in every jurisdiction and country it has been tried? Sticking with a strategy guaranteed to fail makes no sense at all.

Termyn8or -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 1:18:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mnottertail St. Wrinklemeat fixed this in fine nutsucker fashion, Just say no. Cant really feel bad about your criminal relative cakking, he would have ended up shooting Americans in a terrorist action anyway. Why didnt you didn't take your relative inside the compound and get him off the drug? You are a fucking asshole. But I am convinced that you own collarchat. there is no fucking way anyone owning this site would put up with your bullshit. Keep it up and more good people will leave and go to Fetlife, or maybe even Usenet. Go on Usenet Mr Asshole, because from there a computer hacker can find you without a court order and make your life much better by ending it. Go ahead Mr Keyboard Warrior. here is a nice offensive place where you'll fit right in : https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups=#!forum/alt.revisionism Nice friendly place for assholes like you, it is like PLO meets IDF there. there is no moderation possible because it is not centralized. You should be much happier there. Now go suck a dick you useless piece of shit who takes advantage of others' bad fortune because you have the money to buy their family heirlooms for pennies on the dollar. That makes YOU the welfare patient. I hope Karma is in good form when it catches up to your slimeball ass. Care to sell collarchat ? With your participation its value is down to about ten bucks. How about I send you a few good steaks or something, I can get dry ice. you can put it on your dick while you eat your meat. You RON, YOU are a total piece of shit. T^T

Greta75 -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 1:52:15 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tweakabelle So the death penalty hasn't worked in Malaysia at all. You cannot compare the policies of Malaysia to Singapore, as our policies are completely different. On top of that, our rehabilitation program is far superior to theirs. We have better facilities. On top of that. HAVE YOU BEEN TO Malaysia? Every official and every policemen can be bribed. I have personally bribed policemen myself all the time! How are they suppose to control drugs and arrest drug lords and arrest drug addicts, when you can bribe your way out of everything? It doesn't cost much to make a policeman walk away and turn a blind eye. 50RM is all it takes, and that is only like what? AUD15? Drug Crime is probably one of the lowest of their priorities too. Hell I am not even sure any crime is of any priority over there! Crime Rate is horrendous there because their police all will accept bribes. Please do not compare the effectiveness of an utterly corrupt country where the police will turn a blind eye to any kind of crime to Singapore, where everything is done properly and regulated properly. I mean this is a country where their current PM can receive bribery himself of multi-million dollars from Saudi Arabia and get away with it. Despite it being proven that such a personal sum was given to him as a gift for some special benefits in return for him to return certain favour to Saudi. We are in the Top 10 least corrupt countries of the world, while Malaysia is like at the 55th Place. http://www.transparency.org/news/feature/corruption_perceptions_index_2016 quote: If you think prohibition is so successful, can you nominate a single country where it has succeeded in eliminating the drug 'problem'? Not even Singapore has eliminated the drug 'problem'. For a variety of reasons unique to Singapore it has a lower level of drug use than most other countries but it still has drug users and addicts - prohibition has not eliminated the drug problem there either. 0.005% is close to elimination. That is something safe centres will not achieve. Bringing drug use down to 0.005%. I'd say we already produce the best possible results. Like crime, it's impossible to achieve zero crime, but if you achieve one of the lowest percentage of crime compared to the rest of the world, your methods are doing well. All safe centres is achieving is. Is to simply help drug users avoid the consequences of their actions. Allow them to continue their harmful habits but keep making sure they have a safety net to prevent them from ODing. This is like completely giving up on the real fight which is to become a drug free Nation. And keep people off drugs in the first place!

Termyn8or -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 1:54:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: vincentML FR Why people take drugs is complicated in their personal histories. Why they become addicted and stay on drugs is brain chemistry. Each dopamine high is never as high as the first one. The social and personal cost is terrible. Greta's offer of the death penalty as a "cure" is obscene. Proven to be effective considering our low 0.005% rate of drug addicts. What is the rate in the US in comparison? How is the current system working to keep people off heroin. Not working at all. 1. The goal is to prevent people from getting hooked on drugs in the first place. NOT create safe spaces to enable them to enjoy their lethal drugs in safety. I tell ya when you got a teenage kid into drugs and they got these safe spaces, as a parent, you are gonna be like soooooooooo frustrated with the kid, telling you, he won't die from it, because he is gonna take them at these safe spaces! And he will be fine. I can only if I was a parent, I'd just wanna say, "I love you and I don't want you to die!" 2. Can you please seek treatment and stop taking these drugs?" And then the kid will go, "Don't worry mom. I won't die. I promise you I will only take the drugs at safe centres, so they will take care of me and make sure I won't die. They got zero death ratio after all!" 1. The goal is to get the fuck pout of their lives. It is none of your business to tell me what I can take into my body. I don't cause trouble, I don't steal for it, I don't hurt anyone and I don't even have an unkind word for anyone. I do niot stick needles in my arms, not that I am squeamish, hell I cut my hand way open and was looking at my bone in the ER at the hospital waiting to get stitched up and the broad sitting next to me fainted. I just think that direct injecting a drug is just going a bit too far. So smoking is the best it gets for me. If I want crack, actually freebase, I can make a phone call. if I want weed I say "I'm here in case you would like to stop by". try to bust us o that. We White boys know what we are doing. I REALLY do believe the Black v White crime stats are off, why ? Because we Whites know how to get away with shit. We had a very good pot dealer for like 50 fucking years, he never got busted. i was in jail once and I had a talk with a bunch of Black people. I said "You know why you n____s are in here ?". bacuase you are out on the streetcorners yelling "Dimes dimes, anyone need any dimes ?". Idiots, you are making seven grand a fucking week, get an apartment. Well they came up with a good arguiment satying that on the outside you can still run but I trumped them with "Well you are in here now". I have no problem with drug dealers. Once in a while the shit os not as good as it should be or maybe the sack is short but tehy are not sticking a gun in your ribs robbing you. They are no more dishonest than a convenience store owner that charges to five bucks for what should be three bucks. And taxes ? People who depend on the system to make money owe taxes by right, when the system is out to get you then you owe them nothing. 2. First of all, anyone can stop at any time, as long as they want to. i see these ads on TV sometimes about the nicotine patch and all that. I have laughed about the smoking cessation aid pill that causes suicidal tendencies, WHICH THEY STILL SELL and had a fucking belly laugh. I stopped smoking tobacco August 11th, 2011 cold turkey. I simply said that I am not doing this any more. years before I stopped biting my nails the same way, I am simply not doing this anymore. If your kid is an addict I cannot help you. and they will not be helped until they want it. If they live long enough there will come a day when they say "I am doing this more and more and enjoying it less and less". When that day comes they might be ready. Not a minute sooner, get that through your head. And they might just do it again, they got the money and the means, they get into the mood for it them there they go. Some will die because this new heroin is much more potent. Like "I always used to do X mgs. so I'll do X mgs." and then find out it is three times as powerful. Many will just end up where they were before and get tired of of it. then you gotta run them through the wash again. Bottom line, it is a personal choice every minute of every day. I am in a unique position because I have a pretty much unaddictable mind. I have done alot of dope of many kinds and alot of it was very very good. but I have seen what it does, people steal and all this. I have also known people who made alot of money and shot smack once in a while, but Monday morning back to work. they could afford it, he didn't drink, just did smack and pot. Sometimes freebase coke. But he could afford it. I like beer and pot. had no pot for a month, had no beer for a month up to yesterday. No ill effects. Granted, I am going out to the garage sometime today for a good toke, but not having it did not bother me. I see the TV commercial where the guy missed his kid's wining basketball shot because he was out in the parking lot for a smoke, so he decided to get the thing they sell. Well they can't sell self. And I can't really call it willpower. If I had an addictable personality then maybe wilpower would be in play, but it is not. The simple fact is that people are defective. Let them earn their Darwin awards. T^T

Greta75 -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 2:04:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or It is none of your business to tell me what I can take into my body. I don't cause trouble, I don't steal for it, I don't hurt anyone and I don't even have an unkind word for anyone. I do niot stick needles in my arms, not that I am squeamish, hell I cut my hand way open and was looking at my bone in the ER at the hospital waiting to get stitched up and the broad sitting next to me fainted. I just think that direct injecting a drug is just going a bit too far. So smoking is the best it gets for me. Termy it is none of my business if you wanna kill yourself with drugs. But it is 100% my business if this was my brother or my child! And I will be on their case to get them off it! They are family and I care for their health. There are no health benefits to Heroin. And it is arguable that someone resorting to Heroin may not also be in good mental health. Definitely not a happy and well person. Don't tell me there are any positive to someone's life taking Heroin. I can accept perhaps Marijuana can have "some" positive effects like improving creativity. But Heroin??? If my teenage kid was taking Heroin, that kid is still not legal and I am still responsible to help my kid out to the right path. These safe centres are gonna just make the problems worst. Enabling it big time. Can you imagine the kids? They gonna be telling their friends about this safe space to enjoy drugs. And they are all gonna chill out there together. Enabling each other, because it's safe! And there are drugs to save them if anything goes wrong. And end of the day. Things like Heroin and Gambling addiction. If anybody ever have a family member with these issues. They usually spend all their money on drugs or gambling and usually struggle to stay motivated with work or keep a job, and lead a normal life, and will be hounding all their friends and family and guilt tripping the fuck out of them for money to get more drugs or for more gambling. And usually it involves threatening to hurt themselves if you do not give them the money they need for more drugs. Since Safe Spaces aren't supplying free drugs. Those things will continue being nightmares for families. And yes, I think gambling is evil too, I am really upset that my country allows casino to happen.

tweakabelle -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 3:14:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: tweakabelle If you think prohibition is so successful, can you nominate a single country where it has succeeded in eliminating the drug 'problem'? Not even Singapore has eliminated the drug 'problem'. For a variety of reasons unique to Singapore it has a lower level of drug use than most other countries but it still has drug users and addicts - prohibition has not eliminated the drug problem there either. 0.005% is close to elimination. That is something safe centres will not achieve. Bringing drug use down to 0.005%. I'd say we already produce the best possible results. Greta the main reasons why Singapore's figures are so low are (i) Singapore's junkies travel to Malaysia to score and use, the problem is exported and so doesn't show up in official figures and (ii) Singapore is a tiny island with limited points of entry and exit, making policing drugs and smuggling much easier. These factors are unique to Singapore and especially its geographical location. They have little or no relation to Singapore's drug policies. Because these factors are not replicable anywhere else on the planet no other country has similar stats. You are deluding yourself if you put these low stats down to Singapore's drug policies rather than its geography. It doesn't matter how punitive you make the drug laws, people will continue to take drugs. That is the experience everywhere. Prohibition has been a universal failure, an expensive catastrophe that only serves to enrich the drug cartels and drug lords.

Termyn8or -> RE: Drugs Injection centres (2/1/2017 10:27:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or It is none of your business to tell me what I can take into my body. I don't cause trouble, I don't steal for it, I don't hurt anyone and I don't even have an unkind word for anyone. I do niot stick needles in my arms, not that I am squeamish, hell I cut my hand way open and was looking at my bone in the ER at the hospital waiting to get stitched up and the broad sitting next to me fainted. I just think that direct injecting a drug is just going a bit too far. So smoking is the best it gets for me. Termy it is none of my business if you wanna kill yourself with drugs. But it is 100% my business if this was my brother or my child! And I will be on their case to get them off it! They are family and I care for their health. There are no health benefits to Heroin. And it is arguable that someone resorting to Heroin may not also be in good mental health. Definitely not a happy and well person. Don't tell me there are any positive to someone's life taking Heroin. I can accept perhaps Marijuana can have "some" positive effects like improving creativity. But Heroin??? If my teenage kid was taking Heroin, that kid is still not legal and I am still responsible to help my kid out to the right path. These safe centres are gonna just make the problems worst. Enabling it big time. Can you imagine the kids? They gonna be telling their friends about this safe space to enjoy drugs. And they are all gonna chill out there together. Enabling each other, because it's safe! And there are drugs to save them if anything goes wrong. And end of the day. Things like Heroin and Gambling addiction. If anybody ever have a family member with these issues. They usually spend all their money on drugs or gambling and usually struggle to stay motivated with work or keep a job, and lead a normal life, and will be hounding all their friends and family and guilt tripping the fuck out of them for money to get more drugs or for more gambling. And usually it involves threatening to hurt themselves if you do not give them the money they need for more drugs. Since Safe Spaces aren't supplying free drugs. Those things will continue being nightmares for families. And yes, I think gambling is evil too, I am really upset that my country allows casino to happen. When it is your underage kid it is your business, after that it is not. What the real problem is that people are spawning the addictables. As I said, I have known people who can do hard drugs and then be done with it Sunday morning, eat a good meal and go to work Monday. You have no right to tell such people what to do with their money or their body. I have seen the difference. Scenario number one, a buddy and I have good jobs. We go to the coke dealer and spend $100 each and get enough for Saturday night. the blow sits on top of a high dresser where the little ones cannot get to it. There is a pool table, music, a bunch of people flirting and sometimes using one of the bedrooms :-). the kids run wild and tear the place up and we enjoy every minute of it. Every 15 minutes or so we go do some blow. Goes good with a half a case of beer. there are o f course a few joints going around but we kinda keep that away from the kids. In fact alot of pot smokers don't even smoke cigarettes around the kids. Fine. Scenario number two, a bunch of crackheads. And crack is the same as coke. There is a diningroom table and dark blankets are nailed to the woodwork around the windows so nobody can see in. Everyone has a razor blade and is scraping the table to try to find just another little piece of that valuable commodity. If there is a knock at the door everyone except who lives in the house hides in the bedroom. And of course there is a broad holding a baby dropping her cigar ashes on him. Not really abuse, just total carelessness. The second scenario is not a party, it is a bunch of people suffering. Perhaps they do need help, but forcing it on them never works. I mean never. Down south where they grow the coca or whatever to make the shit (the process is remarkably similar to refining sugar) a doctor found the pleasure center of the brain affected by the active ingredients in coke. Apparently the boss thought the pickers were chewing on too many leaves and cutting into his profits. Actually I disagree with that reasoing because it is a stimulant nd it probably made them work faster, but I was ot the boss so my opinion meant nothing. Well he went ahead and had that little piece of the brain removed from some of the workers. It worked at first, but in a few moths they were back to chewing the shit out of his leaves all day long. the biggest problem I have with the lw is things that grow in the groud. Pot is a weed, it grows all over the place. so people figure out the types that taste better and havee more THC, good for them. And then there are peyote buttons, a natural source of mescaline. Natives used to take a bunch of them and climb down in a hole and have visions n shit. They did not do it every weekend. The government might have some limited authority to regulate substances when their active ingredients are intentionally concentrated. That does make some sense, but still it is your choice what to put in your body. to argue against that is to argue that they OWN you. Do they own you ? Well they don't fucking own me, I do whatever I please whenever I please. People are really lucky I am a nice guy and honest. Nothing the law says affects me in the least. Well actually a little bit but not much. I agree that kids should not do drugs, and in fact I advocate boarding schools that are secure and gender segregated. But once of the age of majority then they do what they want. And if that is drugs they should have someone experienced in the matter around to make sure they don't do too much or whatever, and keep them from doing stupid shit like driving after downing a fifth of whiskey, and on coke you can do that but if you wreck you get a DUI. Not a good way to start adult life. Do keep your kids off drugs. Actually don't make a big deal out of it because then they get curious like "Why all the hubbub about this shit ? Must be pretty good, I'll have to try it". And if they are addictable it is over. But once they got a job and a car everyone else, including you, are irrelevant. T^T

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