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Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 5:49:07 AM

Greta75

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Joined: 2/6/2011
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This isn't recent news but I just read about it.

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/heroin-other-drug-users-may-get-a-safe-use-site-in-seattle/

Seattle could become the first city in the U.S. with a public site where users can inject and smoke hard drugs under medical supervision.

Proponents say one or more sites could reduce overdose deaths, HIV and hepatitis C transmissions and the number of used needles that litter sidewalks and alleys.

They say the sites would keep drug users alive long enough to seek treatment and give people on the margins of society means to access help.

This is obviously a Liberal Idea!

But WTF is this! Let's enable drugs users by feeding them more drugs. Maybe they'll volunteer to seek help after we give them more of the drugs they are addicted to!

We are talking about legally feeding them Heroin and Cocaine until they voluntarily seek treatment.

I know the article says a facility such as this have ran in Vancouver with Zero deaths. But that's not what we want. We want complete elimination of addiction to Heroin or Cocaine. Obviously anybody getting drugs legally with correct dosage, regardless the addiction, wouldn't freaking die from it. What do they think morphine is used for in Hospitals?

But how does this eliminate drugs completely?

Yay or Nay?

Oh apparently it's already approved to be opened!!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/awash-in-overdoses-seattle-creates-safe-sites-for-addicts-to-inject-illegal-drugs/2017/01/27/ddc58842-e415-11e6-ba11-63c4b4fb5a63_story.html?utm_term=.5c928c1755fc

Officials in Seattle on Friday approved the nation’s first “safe-injection” sites for users of heroin and other illegal drugs, calling the move a drastic but necessary response to an epidemic of addiction that is claiming tens of thousands of lives each year.

Gosh I remembered having an argument with some folks in this forum that they claim US does not have a drug problem. And here they are claiming epidemic.

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 1/31/2017 5:52:30 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 6:06:20 AM

MrRodgers

Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

This isn't recent news but I just read about it.

http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/heroin-other-drug-users-may-get-a-safe-use-site-in-seattle/

Seattle could become the first city in the U.S. with a public site where users can inject and smoke hard drugs under medical supervision.

Proponents say one or more sites could reduce overdose deaths, HIV and hepatitis C transmissions and the number of used needles that litter sidewalks and alleys.

They say the sites would keep drug users alive long enough to seek treatment and give people on the margins of society means to access help.

This is obviously a Liberal Idea!

But WTF is this! Let's enable drugs users by feeding them more drugs. Maybe they'll volunteer to seek help after we give them more of the drugs they are addicted to!

We are talking about legally feeding them Heroin and Cocaine until they voluntarily seek treatment.

I know the article says a facility such as this have ran in Vancouver with Zero deaths. But that's not what we want. We want complete elimination of addiction to Heroin or Cocaine. Obviously anybody getting drugs legally with correct dosage, regardless the addiction, wouldn't freaking die from it. What do they think morphine is used for in Hospitals?

But how does this eliminate drugs completely?

Yay or Nay?

Oh apparently it's already approved to be opened!!!

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/awash-in-overdoses-seattle-creates-safe-sites-for-addicts-to-inject-illegal-drugs/2017/01/27/ddc58842-e415-11e6-ba11-63c4b4fb5a63_story.html?utm_term=.5c928c1755fc

Officials in Seattle on Friday approved the nation’s first “safe-injection” sites for users of heroin and other illegal drugs, calling the move a drastic but necessary response to an epidemic of addiction that is claiming tens of thousands of lives each year.

Gosh I remembered having an argument with some folks in this forum that they claim US does not have a drug problem. And here they are claiming epidemic.

Greta, I don't come here and call people names or claim they are this or that but you do have this wrong. I tend to ask more questions then claim to know answers on my own. I try to site.

You set up your own strawman as usual with so many particularly on the 'right.'

I see nobody 'feeding' anybody drugs ? Who is doing this ?

I see nobody is legally feeding anybody heroin and cocaine ? Who's doing this ?

I see nobody 'giving' anybody anything but an area that helps protect users from the health risks of what really is a public health problem.

_____________________________

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Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to Greta75)

Post #: 2

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 6:08:44 AM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
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We do not care.

I like beer, I like weed. I got a garage.

I support anyone to do whatever they want as long as they do not hurt anyone. If you got a problem with that I got a problem with you.

I 5hink everything, eth, coke whatever, should be available cheap at the grocery store. Let them kill themselves.

If you don't like it then you stand watch and force peoiple to live who would rather die. you are the sentinel and must keep these people in misery.

Yup.

T^T

(in reply to Greta75)

Post #: 3

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 6:09:41 AM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

Greta you should do a little research before dissing a very good idea.

In Sydney we have had a Medically Supervised Injecting Centre for over a decade now. It is located less than 10 mins walk from where I live.

Just about everyone agrees that it has been a great success for all concerned - residents business people medical professionals, drug users and government, in fact everyone associated with the clinic. Thousands of lives have been saved, the streets (which used to have dirty needles spread everywhere) have been cleaned up and are needle free. The previously common sight of junkies shooting up and going on the nod in public streets and parks has for all intents and purposes disappeared. Thousands have been referred on to detoxes and rehabs for recovery services.

You claim that "We are talking about legally feeding them Heroin and Cocaine until they voluntarily seek treatment.". This is simply untrue. The service offered is a clean safe place where addicts and other users can inject themselves safely. No drugs are supplied whatsoever.

You can read the evaluation report here: https://kirby.unsw.edu.au/sites/default/files/hiv/attachment/EvalRep4SMSIC.pdf
This is the service's website: https://uniting.org/our-services/for-adults/sydney-medically-supervised-injecting-centre
Here are some media reports about the service: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/why-troy-grant-is-so-wrong-about-the-kings-cross-injecting-room-20160725-gqd3wj.html ; and
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/call-for-second-injecting-centre-for-sydney-20140624-zsk2e.html

The success of the Sydney clinic is not unique. It is my understanding that this level of fantastic success is replicated whenever and where ever such clinical services are offered. Please acquaint yourself with the facts - they report unqualified success in an area where success is very rare, and traditional punitive approaches have proved themselves useless and often deadly failures around the world.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 1/31/2017 6:11:26 AM >

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 6:55:07 AM

Greta75

Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrRodgers
I see nobody 'feeding' anybody drugs ? Who is doing this ?

I see nobody is legally feeding anybody heroin and cocaine ? Who's doing this ?

I see nobody 'giving' anybody anything but an area that helps protect users from the health risks of what really is a public health problem.

Did you even read the links??

The sites — which offer addicts clean needles, medical supervision and quick access to drugs

These centres are feeding drug addicts their heroine and cocaine, so that they can give them medical help if they freaking overdose.

(in reply to MrRodgers)

Post #: 5

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 6:56:39 AM

Greta75

Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle
You claim that "We are talking about legally feeding them Heroin and Cocaine until they voluntarily seek treatment.". This is simply untrue. The service offered is a clean safe place where addicts and other users can inject themselves safely. No drugs are supplied whatsoever.

We are talking about the seattle one and they ARE supplying the Heroine and Cocaine.

Your links are Australia system. So not the same as the seattle one I am talking about!

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 6

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 7:31:00 AM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle
You claim that "We are talking about legally feeding them Heroin and Cocaine until they voluntarily seek treatment.". This is simply untrue. The service offered is a clean safe place where addicts and other users can inject themselves safely. No drugs are supplied whatsoever.

We are talking about the seattle one and they ARE supplying the Heroine and Cocaine.

Your links are Australia system. So not the same as the seattle one I am talking about!

It seems that you either don't read your own links, or you don't understand them. There is nothing in either of the links you supplied to suggest that the proposed centres would supply drugs to users. That would be highly illegal - anyone doing that would expose themselves to charges of drug trafficking.

According to the link you supplied:
"Officials in Seattle on Friday approved the nation’s first “safe-injection” sites for users of heroin and other illegal drugs, calling the move a drastic but necessary response to an epidemic of addiction that is claiming tens of thousands of lives each year.

The sites — which offer addicts clean needles, medical supervision and quick access to drugs that reverse the effects of an overdose — have long been popular in Europe.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/awash-in-overdoses-seattle-creates-safe-sites-for-addicts-to-inject-illegal-drugs/2017/01/27/ddc58842-e415-11e6-ba11-63c4b4fb5a63_story.html?utm_term=.51282d994a83

Nothing there to support your claim that the proposed centres will supply drugs to clients. Perhaps you are confusing "drugs that reverse the effects of an overdose" (eg Narcan ) with illegal drugs but they are completely different drugs. Supplying heroin and cocaine to clients would be insane, and will remain so for as long as drugs remain illegal and trafficking drugs remains a serious crime.

Please get your facts straight. This issue already attracts enough emotional uninformed comments without you adding to them.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 1/31/2017 7:35:04 AM >

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 8:00:54 AM

Greta75

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Joined: 2/6/2011
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Okay, I did misread. I thought they will literally be like a centre providing free heroin and cocaine to the users until they decide to seek treatment.

So basically users go buy their own illegal heroin and cocaine and abuse themselves in these facilities, so that IF they overdose the facilities give them the drug that will save their life from that over dose.

Still how the hell DOES THIS STOP people from picking up Heroin and Cocaine IF now they got safe spaces to play with them?

To me, it simply prevents overdoses, but encourages facilitating a safe way to play with these drugs!!! But it does not stop the problem at the root! Which is the whole point is to stop people from taking any heroin or cocaine in the first place!

Now it's like, "Son, you could die taking Heroin! Stop it!" "NO Mom! They got safe facilities now. I can take as much Heroin as I want and they got the medication to save me if I went too far with it! So Heroin is Safe now!!"

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 1/31/2017 8:04:08 AM >

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 8

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 8:17:55 AM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

Greta it's all very well to say "Don't take drugs" but the reality is that people do take drugs, that people have always taken drugs and no amount of punitive legal or police action has ever succeeded in stopping people taking drugs anywhere. That includes the death penalty.

That is the reality. People take drugs and will continue to take them until they decide to stop. Accepting that reality, the best course is to try to keep them alive until they eventually decide to stop and then when that decision has been made, supply them with the services they need to recover.

No one dies, and the cost to society is an awful lot less than the cost in lives and property under the current prohibition model, a model whose distinguishing feature is the fact that it has failed utterly and completely in every jurisdiction it has been tried.

So in the end the choice is between a strategy that works and a strategy that fails every time it is deployed.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 1/31/2017 8:19:29 AM >

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 8:34:16 AM

Greta75

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Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline

Death penalty severely reduces the number of people who takes drugs. It will also save 10,000 lives. Prevention is better than cure.

According to the 2008 World Drug Report by the United Nations office on drugs and crime 8.2% of the UK population are cannabis abusers; in Singapore it is 0.005%. For ecstasy, the figures are 1.8% for the UK and 0.003% for Singapore; and for opiates – such as heroin, opium and morphine – 0.9% for the UK and 0.005% for Singapore. Our tough stance against drugs has saved tens of thousands of lives from the drug menace. It is therefore not surprising that the majority of Singaporeans continue to support the death penalty.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/jun/05/singapore-policy-drugs-bay

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 1/31/2017 8:43:59 AM >

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Post #: 10

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 8:36:52 AM

ManOeuvre

Posts: 277
Joined: 3/2/2013
Status: offline

We have a safe injection site in my city. We also have a very very modest heroin supply program. People frequently talk about one as if it were the other.

I have mixed thoughts about it.

The calculus frequently cited in support seems to fall short of differential equations, but most of the arguments against are of the pearl-clutching variety.

Most in my city can sing live and let steal, but few know the words to live and let die.

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 11

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 8:47:29 AM

WickedsDesire

Posts: 9362
Joined: 11/4/2015
Status: offline

I think i read in the last month they were planning in opening shoot yourself in the eyeball centers with; drugs, ether, shrooms... in UK - i have zero problems with this. Now, were they basing this on a dutch model on Finnish model, I cannot quite remember.

I myself smoke cigarettes, drink cheap chardonnay, can no longer afford Drambuie-Drambuie such are my 3 cats numbers. Now, i have CFS/ME and tried the dope thing thrice just made me iller

I think the dirty needle policy has been operational in most countries for a long time, or at least since Team America-EVERYONE HAS AIDS! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yC7HwPh6Es

So, I am addicted to:
1. Cats
2. Smiles
3. Cigarettes
4. Chardonnay - sure i can give up any time but if you reach for my bottle i will chib you
5. This sites forums as I can type undiluted…nods owner not that your ever about always hiding
6. Oh and cake its the sponge I like for the record
7. People with nice eyes and souls
Addicts are not creatures. They are human being you must understand all formats and I can assure you i am against the legalisation of cannibis in many american states

But, what is a drug or addict?
1. caffeine
2. Social media
3. attention
4. fake news sites
5. brain washings
etc

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Post #: 12

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 9:56:11 AM

Greta75

Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
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Everything you are addicted to does not kill you the way Heroin could. Even cigarettes can kill you but it kills you alot slower. Considering my granddad smoked 2 packs a day since 13 yr old and died of lung cancer at 88 yr old. That's pretty good! For a smoker! But to be fair. He works out alot and is very fit, and he can out-run and out-swim me despite having so much years above me! I reckon exercise delayed his lung cancer.

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 11:11:07 AM

stef

Posts: 10215
Joined: 1/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

We are talking about the seattle one and they ARE supplying the Heroine and Cocaine.

No, they're not, you fucking idiot.

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 12:37:41 PM

BoscoX

Posts: 11343
Joined: 12/10/2016
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

We are talking about the seattle one and they ARE supplying the Heroine and Cocaine.

No, they're not, you fucking idiot.

We lose a lot of people to heroin, there's an ongoing epidemic due in large part to the flood of cheap plentiful Mexican heroin. I still mourn someone who was very close to me, a family member who died of an overdose a year ago. Died alone after what he thought was his standard dose, turned out to be some pure synthetic. The cops said it is happening a lot. He was a good kid.

These centers should save a lot of lives. Bring on the wall.

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 12:48:27 PM

mnottertail

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Joined: 11/3/2004
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St. Wrinklemeat fixed this in fine nutsucker fashion, Just say no.

Cant really feel bad about your criminal relative cakking, he would have ended up shooting Americans in a terrorist action anyway. Why didnt you didn't take your relative inside the compound and get him off the drug?

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 2:01:29 PM

vincentML

Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
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FR

Why people take drugs is complicated in their personal histories. Why they become addicted and stay on drugs is brain chemistry. Each dopamine high is never as high as the first one. The social and personal cost is terrible. Greta's offer of the death penalty as a "cure" is obscene.

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Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 7:11:25 PM

Aylee

Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoscoX

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

We are talking about the seattle one and they ARE supplying the Heroine and Cocaine.

No, they're not, you fucking idiot.

We lose a lot of people to heroin, there's an ongoing epidemic due in large part to the flood of cheap plentiful Mexican heroin. I still mourn someone who was very close to me, a family member who died of an overdose a year ago. Died alone after what he thought was his standard dose, turned out to be some pure synthetic. The cops said it is happening a lot. He was a good kid.

These centers should save a lot of lives. Bring on the wall.

But why are illegal drug overdoses such a large concern? 55,000-80,000 cases of overdose for acetaminophen. That number does not include the overdoses from NSAIDs. With those kinds of numbers, it is difficult to get worked up about heroin deaths or overdoses. I will say that acetaminophen and NSAID overdoses are on the rise now that narcotic painkillers (which are actually SAFER) are being stopped.

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RE: Drugs Injection centres - 1/31/2017 8:11:01 PM

Greta75

Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

FR

Why people take drugs is complicated in their personal histories. Why they become addicted and stay on drugs is brain chemistry. Each dopamine high is never as high as the first one. The social and personal cost is terrible. Greta's offer of the death penalty as a "cure" is obscene.

Proven to be effective considering our low 0.005% rate of drug addicts.

What is the rate in the US in comparison? How is the current system working to keep people off heroin. Not working at all. The goal is to prevent people from getting hooked on drugs in the first place. NOT create safe spaces to enable them to enjoy their lethal drugs in safety.

I tell ya when you got a teenage kid into drugs and they got these safe spaces, as a parent, you are gonna be like soooooooooo frustrated with the kid, telling you, he won't die from it, because he is gonna take them at these safe spaces! And he will be fine.

I can only if I was a parent, I'd just wanna say, "I love you and I don't want you to die!" Can you please seek treatment and stop taking these drugs?"

And then the kid will go, "Don't worry mom. I won't die. I promise you I will only take the drugs at safe centres, so they will take care of me and make sure I won't die. They got zero death ratio after all!"

< Message edited by Greta75 -- 1/31/2017 8:15:07 PM >

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Post #: 19

RE: Drugs Injection centres - 2/1/2017 1:04:14 AM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75

Everything you are addicted to does not kill you the way Heroin could. Even cigarettes can kill you but it kills you alot slower. Considering my granddad smoked 2 packs a day since 13 yr old and died of lung cancer at 88 yr old. That's pretty good! For a smoker! But to be fair. He works out alot and is very fit, and he can out-run and out-swim me despite having so much years above me! I reckon exercise delayed his lung cancer.

Smoking does not cause cancer. No chemical agent does, though a few viruses have been linked quite tightly to it. Outside influence enables cancer in people who were prone to it anyway. Forget all the atatistics, they are bullshit and provided by people who do not know that correlation is not causation.

My evidence ? People who die of lung cancer with not one smoker in the family. there are plenty of them. The other example are these 95 year old geezers at the bar drinking Jack Daniels and smoking Lucky Strikes by the pack. They also eat all kids of red meat and probably eat whatever the doctors tell them not to.

I had to laugh the other day. I was exposed to TV again and on was an episode of Hoarders. Of course the dumb fuck had shit stacked to the ceilings and whatever, I guess that is normal. but what made me laugh was the people throwing out the trash were wearing masks while the owner of the house stood there, much older than them, lighting a cigarette.

All this shit about smoking causing lung cancer was another "reconstruction" designed to take away as much wealth as possible from those who had it, to those who wanted it. And THAT is one of the reasons for skeptical of AGW. They say the world is going to end, so we need to tax it. What do you think I believe ? I believe they want money.

Know what else I believe ? Let them shoot up. give them the drugs. Give them a free abortion, namely a uterectomy. That way the government only has to commit murder once per customer. Plus society saves 18 years of useless liberal indoctrination followed by decades of imprisonment, which may now include a few hundred grand sex change operation.

Fuck all that.

T^T

(in reply to Greta75)

Post #: 20

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