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SecondBestBoy -> Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 1:58:56 PM)


The reality is that you're more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than by a "Muslim terrorist". And since 1975, the chance of an American being killed by a refugee in a terrorist attack has been 1 in 3.6 Billion annually. We've been "extreme vetting" them since 9/11 and as a result not one out of 800,000 admitted has committed a terrorist act. And of course, a grand total of ZERO Americans have been killed by terrorists from the seven countries Trump banned from entering the US. But try telling any of this to a Trump supporter huddling trembling in his gun closet in Topeka. These poor useful idiots are scared to death of their own shadow. And demagogues from George W. Bush to Donald Dumpster have well known that and taken full advantage of the poor slobs.

It doesn't get talked about much - our "politically correct media" no doubt trying to spare the fragile egos of these poor afflicted "real men" - but neuroscience has been studying this phenomenon for years. There's a deep literature on why conservatives are so easily manipulated by fearmongering. Here's one brief rundown of some of it:

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/10/negativity-anxiety-and-resistance-to-change-a-neuroscientist-explains-conservatives-fear-driven-political-attitudes/

What can be done to treat these emotional messes of a human being, so that they can be positive contributing members of society? Xanax? Therapy? Or do we just skip right to straightjackets? I don't know. Discuss.

References:
http://www.snopes.com/toddlers-killed-americans-terrorists/

https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/terrorism-immigration-risk-analysis





Real0ne -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 2:04:24 PM)

holy shit its a terrorist muslim invasion!





Real0ne -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 2:05:52 PM)

yep, they thought they could pull off an adolph with 911 and the whole damn thing blew up right in their faces.






SecondBestBoy -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 2:48:11 PM)

Nothing but dull stares and derping grunts from conservatives. Too many big words, right?




Kirata -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 3:11:57 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

What can be done to treat these emotional messes of a human being, so that they can be positive contributing members of society? Xanax? Therapy? Or do we just skip right to straightjackets? I don't know. Discuss.

In a 2009 study Haidt and two of his colleagues presented more than 8,000 people with a series of hypothetical actions. Among them: kick a dog in the head; discard a box of ballots to help your candidate win; publicly bet against a favorite sports team; curse your parents to their faces; and receive a blood transfusion from a child molester. Participants had to say whether they would do these deeds for money and, if so, for how much—$10? $1,000? $100,000? More? Liberals were reluctant to harm a living thing or act unfairly, even for $1 million, but they were willing to betray group loyalty, disrespect authority or do something disgusting, such as eating their own dog after it dies, for cash. Conservatives said they were less willing to compromise on any of the moral categories. ~Scientific American

More from SciAm....

The left's war on science begins with the stats cited above: 41 percent of Democrats are young Earth creationists, and 19 percent doubt that Earth is getting warmer. These numbers do not exactly bolster the common belief that liberals are the people of the science book. In addition, consider “cognitive creationists”—whom I define as those who accept the theory of evolution for the human body but not the brain. As Harvard University psychologist Steven Pinker documents in his 2002 book The Blank Slate (Viking), belief in the mind as a tabula rasa shaped almost entirely by culture has been mostly the mantra of liberal intellectuals, who in the 1980s and 1990s led an all-out assault against evolutionary psychology via such Orwellian-named far-left groups as Science for the People, for proffering the now uncontroversial idea that human thought and behavior are at least partially the result of our evolutionary past.

There is more, and recent, antiscience fare from far-left progressives, documented in the 2012 book Science Left Behind (PublicAffairs) by science journalists Alex B. Berezow and Hank Campbell, who note that “if it is true that conservatives have declared a war on science, then progressives have declared Armageddon.” On energy issues, for example, the authors contend that progressive liberals tend to be antinuclear because of the waste-disposal problem, anti–fossil fuels because of global warming, antihydroelectric because dams disrupt river ecosystems, and anti–wind power because of avian fatalities. The underlying current is “everything natural is good” and “everything unnatural is bad.”

Surveys show that moderate liberals and conservatives embrace science roughly equally (varying across domains), which is why scientists like E. O. Wilson and organizations like the National Center for Science Education are reaching out to moderates in both parties to rein in the extremists on evolution and climate change. Pace Barry Goldwater, extremism in the defense of liberty may not be a vice, but it is in defense of science, where facts matter more than faith—whether it comes in a religious or secular form—and where moderation in the pursuit of truth is a virtue.
~Scientific American

K.




SecondBestBoy -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 3:28:17 PM)

Ha, right on cue. No comment on the fact that conservatives are easy fodder for demagoguing madmen who manipulate with fear. But lots of distraction. Okay, let's just go with your distractions, hmm?

So liberals are more concerned with whether or not something hurts another human being than they are about following arbitrary dictums from authoritarian leaders or irrational social mores? Well gosh, I'm guilty as charged! And proud of it. I'd rather do the right thing than blindly obey stupid people. If Germany had had a few more liberals than conservatives back in the 1930s, maybe we'd all have been spared a huge devastating war started by that right wing fascist authoritarian regime.

And then you offer up a second dish of Gish Gallop, trying to paint liberals as the evolution and climate change deniers of the US? You quote stats about liberal endorsement of those ideas - without comparing them to the demonstrably much higher rates among conservatives? LOL! What exactly do you think you accomplished there?

Any time you want to respond to the original topic, feel free. If you can manage to in between hyperventilating about little 4-year old Syrian terrorists.




Kirata -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 3:56:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

And then you offer up a second dish of Gish Gallop...

Actually, what I offered came from Scientific American. What you offered came from Rawstory. Food for thought there, and here too:

Surveys show that moderate liberals and conservatives embrace science roughly equally (varying across domains), which is why scientists like E. O. Wilson and organizations like the National Center for Science Education are reaching out to moderates in both parties to rein in the extremists on evolution and climate change. Pace Barry Goldwater, extremism in the defense of liberty may not be a vice, but it is in defense of science, where facts matter more than faith—whether it comes in a religious or secular form—and where moderation in the pursuit of truth is a virtue.

Maybe you should dial down your sense of superiority and do a little more reality-based thinking.

K.




SecondBestBoy -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 4:20:47 PM)

Gish Gallop: not a website, but a concept. Someone vomits up a pile of stuff unrelated to the topic, hoping that it will keep someone busy in responding enough to give the superficial appearance to bystanders that there is some kind of substantive debate going on.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop

What you offered from SciAm was an opinion piece from someone with an obvious agenda to push back against the well developed (for good reasons) notion that conservatives have been engaged in a war against science. You didn't even bother to include in your selected excerpt the comparison stats on evolution/climate change denial among conservatives offered in that same screed - which in turn were likely cherry picked by the author to find the survey with results most friendly to his desperate thesis. The overwhelming balance of data out there shows that creationism and climate change denial is considerably higher among conservatives than liberals. Are you trying to pretend this isn't true?

The story from rawstory has links to abstracts of the studies they are discussing. See all the places where it says study in bold face? You can hover of them and then go to read the original research. Aren't hyperlinks wonderful?

Still waiting for an acknowledgement that conservatives are easy fodder for fearmongering demagogues like the current one sitting in the White House. And yes, it's a problem, when you want your country to proceed rationally instead of based on exaggerated fears.




bounty44 -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 5:44:12 PM)

quote:

Let’s see what the peer-reviewed research has to say about the conservative brain.


When someone on a left wing website starts out like that, the suspicion is it’s a hit piece.

and when someone titles a thread the way you did, its likely youre not really looking for "discussion" either.

quote:

1. Conservatives tend to focus on the negative
In a 2012 study published in the prestigious journal Behavioral and Brain Sciences, liberal and conservative participants were shown collages of both negative and positive images on a computer screen while their eye movements were recorded. While liberals were quicker to look at pleasant images, like a happy child or a cute bunny rabbit, conservatives tended to behave oppositely. They’d first inspect threatening and disturbing pictures—things like car wrecks, spiders on faces, and open wounds crawling with maggots—and would also tend to dwell on them for longer. This is what psychologists call a “negativity bias”. If you think about it, this makes a lot of sense. When attention is biased toward the negative, the result is an overly threat-conscious appraisal of one’s surroundings. Essentially, to many conservatives the world looks like a much scarier place. This would seem to explain why so many major conservative viewpoints tend to be rooted in irrational fears—like fear of the president, immigrants, Muslims, vaccinations, etc.


I’m right up there with him until he says “overly threat conscious” and then goes on to make the statement “the world looks like a much scarier place.” Those are not only conjecture; they are value judgments by the author that do not follow explicitly from the methodology he describes.

Further, how ironic the study he’s referencing and the article itself here was from when obama was president. Who’s “fearing the president now??” What’s more, his use of the word “irrational” is also a value judgment that he’s not justified in making. Lastly, it’s the liberals who label everything conservatives oppose as being because they are “afraid” of things. Rejecting illegal immigration is not being “afraid” of immigrants. Recognizing most terrorists are muslim is not being “afraid” of islam or muslims.

oh, and the "vaccinations" thing? there's relatively ideological parity on that.

quote:

2. Conservatives are more anxious
A study found that conservatives have a stronger physiological response to startling noises and graphic images. This adds to a growing body of research that indicates a hypersensitivity to threat—a hallmark of anxiety. But why exactly would those that scare more easily tend to support conservative views? One social psychologist from the University of Central Arkansas, Paul Nail, has a pretty interesting answer: “Conservatism, apparently, helps to protect people against some of the natural difficulties of living. The fact is we don’t live in a completely safe world. Things can and do go wrong. But if I can impose this order on it by my worldview, I can keep my anxiety to a manageable level.” This could explain the two parties’ different stances on gun control. It only makes sense that those who startle more easily are also the ones that believe they need to own a gun.


A “stronger physiological response” does not equal “hypersensitivity” any more than conservatives being more muscular than liberals translates into “hyper-masculinity.” Neither does a “strong physiological response” translate into “anxiety” which is not a physiological state, but a psychological one. State and trait anxieties are not assessed physiologically so the author’s make an unacceptable stretch.

I’d really need to see the original article but unfortunately, the link to the whole article from the hyperlinked pubmed page is no longer working (so gee, in spite of your bluster, at least in this case, no you cant "see the original research") and I was not able to get the article in two other places I looked. My internet connections bad and perhaps ive given up too early---but either way, its interesting to note that the word “conservative” does not appear in the abstract which is where it should, nor are there any political terms in the key words used to describe the research. This makes me think the author of the rawstory piece is talking out his hind end.

quote:

3. Conservatives fear new experiences
A 2008 study catalogued items found in the bedrooms of college students and saw that while liberals owned more books and travel-related items, conservatives had more things that kept order in their lives, like calendars and cleaning supplies. This tells us that liberals more often seek adventure and novel experiences. Conservatives, on the other hand, seem to prefer a more ordered, disciplined lifestyle. This could help explain why they are so resistant to change and progressive policies.


you don't see any gigantic leap there between looking at bedrooms and submitting therefore that conservatives are "resistant to change and progressive policies???" the idea that we've examined them critically and rejected them seem a reasonable alternative? any idea how absurd it is to say that if I keep my dorm room clean, im afraid of new experiences?? this is laughable on its face.

quote:

4. Conservatives’ brains are more reactive to fear
Using MRI, scientists from University College London have found that students who identify themselves as conservatives have a larger amygdala than self-described liberals. This brain structure is involved in emotion processing, and is especially reactive to fearful stimuli. It is possible that an oversized amygdala could create a heightened sensitivity that may cause one to habitually overreact to anything that appears to be a potential threat, whether it actually is one or not. This disproportionate fear response could explain how, for example, Bush’s administration was able to gather wide public support amongst conservatives for invading Iraq. They knew if they said the phrase “weapons of mass destruction” enough times that it wouldn’t matter whether they really existed or not.


heres what I wrote the last time that misinterpreted garbage appeared here:

note that the area of the brain is merely larger in conservative types...and not completely absent in liberals. its a part of everyone's brain. everyone but the physiologically deficient experiences fear.

as it is, I say so what? but show me data that says that size necessarily translates into experiencing more fear, and id still say "so what?"

alternatively, let me turn this (and your thinking) on its head. if there is a "so what" im likely to say being better equipped to recognize danger, and chose the "fight or flight" option (or some other alternative) is better than not, or being less equipped to do so.

fear can be and is overcome by cognitive processes--show me data that says conservatives eschew activities or professions that require courage, especially compared to liberals, and then i'll think maybe you have something. otherwise, not and i'll just chalk it up to [liberals] being sad and bitter fellows. [who don't think very well either]

here’s a good tidbit to end the section on:

quote:

it’s still unclear what a bigger amygdala (or a bigger anything in the brain) actually means in terms of behavior, not to mention how most brain regions have multiple functions. [in case you are wondering, that quote is from the author of the study]


http://www.zdnet.com/article/gray-matter-liberal-brains-vs-conservative-brains/

by the way---one of my old a&p texts tells me the amygdala is central to memory. if its smaller in liberals, gee, that might help explain why you all have such trouble learning from history.

gotta love this:

quote:

The amygdala is also thought to participate in the height of a person's emotional intelligence. It is particularly hypothesized that larger amygdalae allow for greater emotional intelligence, enabling greater societal integration and cooperation with others.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amygdala


oooh, that's gotta hurt...





Kirata -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 6:07:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

Aren't hyperlinks wonderful?

You really do live in your own reality, and so does Rawstory. Let's consider a couple of those "wonderful" hyperlinks:

In this article, we argue that one organizing element of the many differences between liberals and conservatives is the nature of their physiological and psychological responses to features of the environment that are negative.

Features of the environment that are negative.

Rawstory: the result is an overly threat-conscious appraisal of one’s surroundings

Not quite. And then there is this:

These data suggest that the aversive nature of stimuli contribute to the potentiation of startle above and beyond the effects of emotional arousal, which may be a universal phenomenon not modulated by individual differences.

A universal phenomenon not modulated by individual differences.

Rawstory: conservatives have a stronger physiological response to startling noises and graphic images

quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

Still waiting for an acknowledgement that conservatives are easy fodder for fearmongering demagogues

Well at least that's an honest admission of stupidity. [:)]

K.




tj444 -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/6/2017 7:01:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy


The reality is that you're more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than by a "Muslim terrorist". And since 1975, the chance of an American being killed by a refugee in a terrorist attack has been 1 in 3.6 Billion annually. We've been "extreme vetting" them since 9/11 and as a result not one out of 800,000 admitted has committed a terrorist act. And of course, a grand total of ZERO Americans have been killed by terrorists from the seven countries Trump banned from entering the US. But try telling any of this to a Trump supporter huddling trembling in his gun closet in Topeka. These poor useful idiots are scared to death of their own shadow. And demagogues from George W. Bush to Donald Dumpster have well known that and taken full advantage of the poor slobs.

It doesn't get talked about much - our "politically correct media" no doubt trying to spare the fragile egos of these poor afflicted "real men" - but neuroscience has been studying this phenomenon for years. There's a deep literature on why conservatives are so easily manipulated by fearmongering. Here's one brief rundown of some of it:

http://www.rawstory.com/2015/10/negativity-anxiety-and-resistance-to-change-a-neuroscientist-explains-conservatives-fear-driven-political-attitudes/

What can be done to treat these emotional messes of a human being, so that they can be positive contributing members of society? Xanax? Therapy? Or do we just skip right to straightjackets? I don't know. Discuss.

References:
http://www.snopes.com/toddlers-killed-americans-terrorists/

https://www.cato.org/publications/policy-analysis/terrorism-immigration-risk-analysis




Well,.. I agree that you are more likely to be killed by a kid with a gun than a refugee but nothing is 100%.. sometimes shite happens and you are in the wrong place at the wrong time.. there are always situations that are outside the norm used in these statistics.. exceptions to the rule, so to speak..

The Boston marathon bombers were allowed into the US as asylum refugees (which are different than regular refugees who are vetted for much longer, years usually) but they were children when they were allowed in.. one became an American citizen and the other didn’t.. so, there are exceptions.. Of course you could argue that they weren’t the same kinda refugee that you are talking about, they were radicalized right here in the US, not in their birth countries, and one was American..

I think they are also an exception in that they seemed to believe in the “American Dream” but its not easy to obtain and they didn’t put the effort in to get it, they seemed to expect it to be given to them or come easy (ya know, cuz the streets are paved with gold), they had a crazy-assed mother who helped fire their disappointment into hate.. I have met a few refugees and immigrants and they are nothing like that crazy-assed nutbar family, the people I have met work hard and don’t blame someone else for failures or setbacks, they just try harder and work harder and they are happy to have the opportunity to do that and be free of the horrible situation they came from..




thishereboi -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/7/2017 2:53:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

Nothing but dull stares and derping grunts from conservatives. Too many big words, right?



Well I can't speak for any other conservatives but this one is only mildly amused at the trolls attempt to entertain. But I will give you a B for your copy and paste skills. Perhaps next time you could actually add a few thoughts of your own if you ever have them.




bounty44 -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/7/2017 5:04:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

Nothing but dull stares and derping grunts from conservatives. Too many big words, right?



Well I can't speak for any other conservatives but this one is only mildly amused at the trolls attempt to entertain. But I will give you a B for your copy and paste skills. Perhaps next time you could actually add a few thoughts of your own if you ever have them.


another pompous ass comrade





mnottertail -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/7/2017 6:14:23 AM)

Sorta like you, copy and paste, no thought, only slobberblogs, but as a nutsucker you also shit your pants. Just a Reichsfuhrer of felchgobbbling




SecondBestBoy -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/7/2017 10:32:00 AM)


That wasn't much of a rebuttal to the peer reviewed studies, Kirata. At the very least, you need to develop your communication skills. I can only faintly gather that your problem with the scientific work is that you thought their assessment of "negative" experiences was value-laden? Please give some examples. There are certain things that all humans find universally negative. Typically in psych experiments, researchers choose from them.

Still sounds like you don't want to face all this, and are throwing up marbles-in-mouth rambling to try to counter the data. But maybe I'm just not understanding your terse objections.




SecondBestBoy -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/7/2017 10:48:35 AM)

Bounty44, a few points.

I just verified again that all the links in that rawstory article bring up either the abstract or full paper to the studies discussed. Maybe it is your internet connection, or maybe one of the journal sites was down when you tried. Feel free to give it another go.

Also, anxiety is most definitely a physiological state (and a psychological one - psychological states being basically an epiphenomenon of what's going on in our brain and adrenal systems at any given time). If it weren't, anxiolytic medications like Xanax simply wouldn't work.

As for your "turning around" the "hypersensitive" claim, that's a gallant try, but it won't make this go away. First, the amygdala (and other work) showing more acute responses to fear stimuli in conservatives (and keep in mind the findings aren't limited to just the morphological research of anatomical size) don't in themselves generate a value statement interpreting the results, it's just basic physiological differences. They establish that conservatives are more excitable by fear stimuli, just that.

It is then I (and many others) who are noting that certain situations are coming up where objectively there is little reason to get fearful to the point of overhauling our society -- and pointing to the neuroscience work to explain why conservatives are jumping obediently on board in response to the fearmongering. Islamic terrorists are less of a threat to your well being than toddlers with guns, yet you devote all of your attention to the former - directly in response to being primed by media and opportunistic politicians exploiting your fears to gain power like Trump and the GOP. It's objectively irrational of you. That's my point. The neuroscience just explains why you are this way, and vulnerable to this manipulation.

That was the point of my OP.




thishereboi -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/8/2017 2:12:41 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: bounty44


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy

Nothing but dull stares and derping grunts from conservatives. Too many big words, right?



Well I can't speak for any other conservatives but this one is only mildly amused at the trolls attempt to entertain. But I will give you a B for your copy and paste skills. Perhaps next time you could actually add a few thoughts of your own if you ever have them.


another pompous ass comrade




and they wonder why they lost the election [8|]




SunDominant -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/8/2017 3:00:13 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: SecondBestBoy
What can be done to treat these emotional messes of a human being, so that they can be positive contributing members of society? Xanax? Therapy? Or do we just skip right to straightjackets? I don't know. Discuss.


How tragic that you believe people with political views opposing yours are mentally ill. The Hibbing study reinforces one of my core political beliefs: we need each other. Reformers freshen the wellspring of innovation in policy and governance, while traditionalists ensure that we do not throw the baby out with the bathwater. Also, this constant binary oppression of "left" versus "right" is tiresome. Not only does it peripherally exclude moderate thinkers, it stifles dialogue.




bounty44 -> RE: Neuroscience explains why cons wet their panties in fear of 4-year-old Syrian girls (2/8/2017 3:40:52 AM)

i agree with that in part, but I don't take it to, for lack of a better word, an extreme whole.

as far as im concerned, collectivists are an oppressive enemy who are needed as much france needed Germany in world wars I and II.

there is enough variation of thought within the rest of us to allow for the things you are looking for.




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